# Hearn drops the ball on a PPV again



## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

No Pacquiao v Rios US/China leg. Only 3 confirmed fights. It's bullshit.


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## Elephant Man (Jun 8, 2012)

Yep, crap card but as much as hardcore fans complain, the fact is that casual fans who get sucked into these type of PPV events are not interested in the undercard all that much. They are parting with their £15 to watch Froch - Groves. It's the same as what Bob is doing for the Pacquiao - Rios fight. That card is crap, but the main event is a great one so lots will happily buy.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

The fact that this was gonna get added to SBO and be used as justification for the PPV has been bugging me for a while.

Really happy to see this on Boxnation.


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

Elephant Man said:


> Yep, crap card but as much as hardcore fans complain, the fact is that casual fans who get sucked into these type of PPV events are not interested in the undercard all that much. They are parting with their £15 to watch Froch - Groves. It's the same as what Bob is doing for the Pacquiao - Rios fight. That card is crap, but the main event is a great one so lots will happily buy.


Boxing sells Boxing. PPV should be seen as an opportunity to attract new fans to the sport.

If you paid 15quid for a show and they were talking about this great fight between Pacquiao & Rios you would at least record it and watch the next morning. If its a great fight, you might record the Bellew & Barker fights that are coming up, then your hooked.


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## NSFW (May 14, 2013)

Not sure how many casual fans are interested in Froch vs Groves anyway.


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

This Froch vs Groves PPV will fail big time.


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## cheekyvid (Jun 9, 2012)

And he has constantly promised a monster undercard. Not looking likely.


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## Marlow (Jan 6, 2013)

I suppose to people on this forum adding Pac was neither here nor there because they'd have watched it on Boxnation anyway but If you're selling to a casual audience then Pacquiao is a big name and you'd be able to sell it as a nine hour broadcast which would look like value for money.

Have to agree though Hearn has made a mess of this, he talked big and hasn't delivered.

Crolla/Gethin is a good fight but at the moment its the only decent undercard offering, just under four weeks out can anybody see good opponents for Quigg and Smith?


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

Only people I know who think groves has a chance are the ones that know him personally

Everyone else seems to think its a fore gone conclusion that froch is just gonna walk through groves 

It's not like the Kessler fight where it was considered 50 50

I fully expect something to go down , like a physical confrontation, too hype the fight


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## Elephant Man (Jun 8, 2012)

LuckyLuke said:


> This Froch vs Groves PPV will fail big time.


How much are they expecting, though, and how many buys would be a success for them?

It's not like Hearn has spent millions on the undercard. Groves probably isn't even picking up _that_ much.


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

Elephant Man said:


> How much are they expecting, though, and how many buys would be a success for them?
> 
> It's not like Hearn has spent millions on the undercard. Groves probably isn't even picking up _that_ much.


Froch will probably get £1million. Groves maybe 1/4 of that.


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## sim_reiss (Jun 6, 2012)

Made a rod for his own back with the "outrageous"/"obscene" talk. Not delivering on prick-teasing language is the quickest way to piss any fan off...


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## Elephant Man (Jun 8, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Froch will probably get £1million. Groves maybe 1/4 of that.


Exactly. As long as they shift a certain amount they are making a tidy profit I would imagine.


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## Vano-irons (Jun 6, 2012)

You know what, I wouldn't be surprised if this didn't happen


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Vano-irons said:


> You know what, I wouldn't be surprised if this didn't happen


A sparring injury you mean :bbb


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

I'd have been happy with the Froch-Groves card & Pac-Rios together on the PPV. But this takes the piss, utterly shit undercard.
Froch-Kessler2 did 400k buys apparently, I believe this will get 300k max.


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## Vano-irons (Jun 6, 2012)

My guess is a back injury


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## Elephant Man (Jun 8, 2012)

smegmaa said:


> I'd have been happy with the Froch-Groves card & Pac-Rios together on the PPV. But this takes the piss, utterly shit undercard.
> Froch-Kessler2 did 400k buys apparently, I believe this will get 300k max.


300k at £15. That's why he and many others do it. Hopefully it bombs and then maybe Hearn will be forced into putting on better events.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

Elephant Man said:


> 300k at £15. That's why he and many others do it. Hopefully it bombs and then maybe Hearn will be forced into putting on better events.


Nearly £4.5million in revenue from PPV alone + sponsors, gate revenue etc. Hearn and Sky will make a tidy profit on it if it does over 250K buys. The undercard doesn't really add any extra PPV buys. We're going to be stuck with this PPV shit every time a 'big fight' comes along.


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## One Inferno (Jun 12, 2013)

The card is simply awful in all honesty for a PPV.

You have Froch vs Groves which is a decent fight but not that competitive, Quigg fighting against someone not even announced yet, Crolla vs Gethin which is a decent trade fight but nothing more, Fielding against someone from the Caribbean who no one has heard of


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> I'd have been happy with the Froch-Groves card & Pac-Rios together on the PPV. But this takes the piss, utterly shit undercard.
> Froch-Kessler2 did 400k buys apparently, I believe this will get 300k max.


source?


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> source?


There is no source. Sky never release the figure unfortunately but that's what's been going around


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## WhoDatNation (Jun 10, 2013)

It's such a shit undercard to go along with an average main event, obviously he doesn't have the talent pool that Golden Boy has but look at the job Schaefer has done in the last 18 months, he is putting on shows which are filled with quality fights and fans are lapping it up. The two GBP shows coming up in December are absolutely brilliant.

Eddie has talked this card up, saying the undercard would be something very special, here is a link I posted earlier where he tries to talk it up, I'm sure he went even more overboard in another interview, it's not good enough, along with the Burns September card, the upcoming Hull show, the shit Prizefighter and the Xmas cracker 2, he is really starting to falter.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

I know Eddie said the undercard was gonna be amazeballs but hasn't he also said nobody buys a PPV for anything but the main event?


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

WhoDatNation said:


> It's such a shit undercard to go along with an average main event, obviously he doesn't have the talent pool that Golden Boy has but look at the job Schaefer has done in the last 18 months, he is putting on shows which are filled with quality fights and fans are lapping it up. The two GBP shows coming up in December are absolutely brilliant.
> 
> Eddie has talked this card up, saying the undercard would be something very special, here is a link I posted earlier where he tries to talk it up, I'm sure he went even more overboard in another interview, it's not good enough, along with the Burns September card, the upcoming Hull show, the shit Prizefighter and the Xmas cracker 2, he is really starting to falter.


xmas cracker 2 hasnt even been announced?


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## Marlow (Jan 6, 2013)

You'd hope McDonnell would be in a good fight on there but given the timeframe it's unlikely.


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## Peter Barlow (Jun 4, 2013)

Its a fucking shit card and Groves - Froch will probably be a spectacular fail. 
I still think it feels weird having all Froch fights PPV. I dont think he can pull it off the way an Amir Khan could.


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

Mugsy said:


> Its a fucking shit card and Groves - Froch will probably be a spectacular fail.
> I still think it feels weird having all Froch fights PPV. I dont think he can pull it off the way an Amir Khan could.


Amir Khan pulled it off?


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

Marlow said:


> You'd hope McDonnell would be in a good fight on there but given the timeframe it's unlikely.


Likely a Matchroom debut to settle into his shiny new contract!


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Vano-irons said:


> You know what, I wouldn't be surprised if this didn't happen


Thought this about 6 weeks ago as well, when it was all to apparent that this card was going to be a disaster.


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## Peter Barlow (Jun 4, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Amir Khan pulled it off?


Maybe its just me personally and I'm rambling here, but I just don't get near the same buzz of a Carl Froch fight than an Amir Khan fight.
I dont know why that is and I'm not a Khan fan.


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

Mugsy said:


> Maybe its just me personally and I'm rambling here, but I just don't get near the same buzz of a Carl Froch fight than an Amir Khan fight.
> I dont know why that is and I'm not a Khan fan.


its just you!


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## ImElvis666 (Jul 20, 2012)

Hearn has been smearing shit in the faces of Sky subscribers all year. It's going to drive more people to taking an online streaming alternative.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

Mugsy said:


> Maybe its just me personally and I'm rambling here, but I just don't get near the same buzz of a Carl Froch fight than an Amir Khan fight.
> I dont know why that is and I'm not a Khan fan.


Even Froch-Kessler II didn't get me proper pumped like. David Haye-Tyson Fury as well, I wasn't even half as excited for that fight as I thought I would be in the weeks leading up to the pull-out because it was so poorly built up and promoted.

Haye-Chisora is definitely the most recent example of a fight that I just couldn't wait for. Maybe it was because it was in a football stadium and all over front and back pages but it felt like a massive event. None of Sky's recent PPVs have, least not in my honest opinion.


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## Peter Barlow (Jun 4, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> Even Froch-Kessler II didn't get me proper pumped like. David Haye-Tyson Fury as well, I wasn't even half as excited for that fight as I thought I would be in the weeks leading up to the pull-out because it was so poorly built up and promoted.
> 
> Haye-Chisora is definitely the most recent example of a fight that I just couldn't wait for. Maybe it was because it was in a football stadium and all over front and back pages but it felt like a massive event. None of Sky's recent PPVs have, least not in my honest opinion.


Yeah I'd agree there, to me Froch fights dont seem like a massive event either.

For Britains number 1 boxer, Froch really doesnt have the profile. Most people I know would not know who Froch is but Amir Khan is a household name.


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## WhoDatNation (Jun 10, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> xmas cracker 2 hasnt even been announced?


I am just preparing for the inevitable, the fact it is called 'seasons beatings' is even worse, stealing WWF PPV names from about 18 years ago is hardly a good omen.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

Mugsy said:


> Yeah I'd agree there, to me Froch fights dont seem like a massive event either.
> 
> For Britains number 1 boxer, Froch really doesnt have the profile. Most people I know would not know who Froch is but Amir Khan is a household name.


Froch's profile has definitely gone up the past 18 months and he's now known as one of Britain's top sportsmen. However, he's not half a famous as he and Hearn love to think he is. Why else did he go on that daft ITV dancing show? People who go on those sort of things are normally Z-listers desperate to get the public's attention in order to promore something or washed-up has-beens who want to be relevant again for 5 minutes. You'd have to say Froch falls under the former.

If I hear or read one more person saying "Froch vs Groves sold out in 10 minutes so that proves he's a massive star" then I'll burst. NO IT DIDN'T. The tickets were snapped up by ticket brokers who buy them to re-sell for a profit. It's the same for every sporting event, whether it be boxing or the Champions League Final. If you go on eBay or StubHub you can still find tickets to buy from private sellers.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

WhoDatNation said:


> I am just preparing for the inevitable, the fact it is called *'seasons beatings*' is even worse, stealing WWF PPV names from about 18 years ago is hardly a good omen.


Its wrong on so many levels :lol:

Anything would be better than that for example, Rumble in the Phones4U Arena.


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## adamcanavan (Jun 5, 2012)

Froch vs Groves (mismatch imo, wanna watch just to see groves get stopped)
Quigg vs TBA (probably shit)
Crolla vs Gethin (decent british title fight but crolla is a level above gethin imo)
Fielding vs Allen (decent fight for the level but hardly boosts yhe ppv status)
Stephen Smith vs TBA (probably shit)
Darren Hamilton vs TBA (not sure if this is still happening)
Cardle vs TBA
Maybe Joshua vs TBA

Just dont see the ppv value. My best guess was that they were planning to have burns as the chief support


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## WhoDatNation (Jun 10, 2013)

adamcanavan said:


> Just dont see the ppv value. My best guess was that they were planning to have burns as the chief support


This is what I think, Burns vs Crolla was stick on if Ricky won/didn't break his jaw


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## ScouseLad (May 16, 2013)

It's piss poor so far, it's what should just be regarded as an ok card on sky sports 2 or whatever, PPV is laughable and theres not a chance I'm paying unless theres a huge improvement. "Only" £15 or not.


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## Ishy (Jun 2, 2012)

6 or 7 title fights Eddie said. 

Main event, Crolla, Fielding, Quigg, Smith. That's 5 and we don't have opponents for two of them. McDonnell if he is on will fight for some IBF interthingy title. 

It's just shit though, Fielding/Allen is meh, Crolla/Gethin isn't great and who's he going to get for Quigg at this short notice? Looking at the WBA rankings I guess it'll be a no name like Oscar Escandon or Tyson Cave.


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## Noonaldinho (Jun 3, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> source?


:rofl


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## ScouseLad (May 16, 2013)

Do we get John Mcdonald for this aswell? Urgh.


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

Noonaldinho said:


> :rofl


whats so funny?


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## Noonaldinho (Jun 3, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> whats so funny?


You asking for a source, yet you consistently post in a matter of fact way with no source at all.


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

Noonaldinho said:


> You asking for a source, yet you consistently post in a matter of fact way with no source at all.


I don't. Nice try.


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## Noonaldinho (Jun 3, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> I don't. Nice try.


There you go again...


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## cheekyvid (Jun 9, 2012)

WhoDatNation said:


> This is what I think, Burns vs Crolla was stick on if Ricky won/didn't break his jaw


you shouldda seen the Burns - Beltran programme - said just about that much in it!


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Understand what people say about Froch and ppv as he still somehow doesn't come across as a big event fighter. Looking forward to this one though and can see Groves causing Froch problems even if it has come a bit too soon. Froch has the proven toughness but Groves seems to be getting severely underrated. 

Got the same kinda low key vibe that preceded the Haye-Fury fight though. Thought that was down to Sky underplaying Haye's return to SBO at the time so hope this doesn't go tits up too.


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2013)

Canastota said:


> Understand what people say about Froch and ppv as he still somehow doesn't come across as a big event fighter. Looking forward to this one though and can see Groves causing Froch problems even if it has come a bit too soon. Froch has the proven toughness but Groves seems to be getting severely underrated.
> 
> Got the same kinda low key vibe that preceded the Haye-Fury fight though. Thought that was down to Sky underplaying Haye's return to SBO at the time so hope this doesn't go tits up too.


I think the Haye stuff had allot to do with momentum. Had he gone and beat up Charr for 4 rounds I think there would have been more of a buzz.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> I think the Haye stuff had allot to do with momentum. Had he gone and beat up Charr for 4 rounds I think there would have been more of a buzz.


Yeah but I mean I was seeing threads 2 to 3 weeks out from the Haye-Fury fight on various forums asking why there wasn't more of a media presence surrounding the fight and why were Sky seemingly underhyping it. The injury then came just prior to what would've been the fight week media blitz I assume.

Hopefully Froch-Groves will build from here. I seem to be in something of a minority as I'm really looking forward to it. Could be a cracker although Groves's behind the scenes upheaval is a bit worrying.


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## welsh_dragon83 (Aug 11, 2013)

this card is fucking shit but heans knows us hardcore fans are going to buy it so what can we do? is the pac fight on boxnation i must of missed that?


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## ImElvis666 (Jul 20, 2012)

welsh_dragon83 said:


> this card is fucking shit but heans knows us hardcore fans are going to buy it so what can we do? is the pac fight on boxnation i must of missed that?


Wouldn't be so sure about that. Id imagine a lot of posters on this forum aren't going to buy it.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

You would have to be a monumental window licker to buy this piece of shit.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

Bill said:


> You would have to be a monumental window licker to buy this piece of shit.


A person who kicks the dog and molests the cat.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

PaulieMc said:


> A person who kicks the dog and molests the cat.


Dwyer in other words...


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## welsh_dragon83 (Aug 11, 2013)

theres alot of people on forums saying they wont pay ppv, then come fight week they on the blower saying please mr hearn take my money :SOK . i hate paying for shit ppv shows but hey i love my boxing & cant watch it on shit streams so i get the boys around & we all chip in :cheers


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

welsh_dragon83 said:


> theres alot of people on forums saying they wont pay ppv, then come fight week they on the blower saying please mr hearn take my money :SOK . i hate paying for shit ppv shows but hey i love my boxing & cant watch it on shit streams so i get the boys around & we all chip in :cheers


This. With all the hype on fight week, probably 70% of people who're saying they won't buy, will.
But the biggest thing that's pissed me off is Hearn giving it the Barry McGuigan: "monster card" "best Matchroom card ever" "it's gonna have this, it's gonna have that"!


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## Alba (Aug 4, 2013)

Im going to Buy it Cause Rob said so .


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## Hoshi (Aug 21, 2012)

Pathetic so far. For me I was reluctant to pay for Froch/Kessler due to the non existant undercard but it was a cracking fight so why not. Groves? Really? Are his purses so high that ppv is the only way they can get him in a fight with Froch?

Just putting some of his named fighters on the undercard isn't cutting it anymore. They all need to be in meaningful fights against top opposition or put it on regular sky.


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## Trippy (Jun 18, 2013)

Froch is the title holder. Groves is the madatory. Apparently neither are willing to budge.

So how does this need to be PPV to make the fight happen?

It doesn't.

Shocking from Matchroom this.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Shocked when i saw the news about Pac-Rios on BN. Fair play to em'. The Froch-Groves card isn't looking good at all glad i didn't book tickets for it.


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## TeddyL (Oct 5, 2013)

It's a smart move by Hearn and SKY. Boxnation has now gone and paid for it but they will have a seriously hard time getting people to subscribe for that and stay up till 5am when there is the SKY PPV on the same night staring Froch


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## Alf (Jul 26, 2013)

TeddyL said:


> It's a smart move by Hearn and SKY. Boxnation has now gone and paid for it but they will have a seriously hard time getting people to subscribe for that and stay up till 5am when there is the SKY PPV on the same night staring Froch


Surely getting the pac fight on sky as part of the ppv would be even smarter, no?


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## TeddyL (Oct 5, 2013)

Alan-Francis-85 said:


> Surely getting the pac fight on sky as part of the ppv would be even smarter, no?


No because the majority of the people who watch the Froch fight are not gonna wait up another 5 and half hours to watch it. Most of them wouldn't even be aware Pacquaio was fighting was that weekend.

By having Boxnation take it, they put the pressure on Boxnation to try compete against them in order to make something back on it. Which is impossible. When you have Warren in the sun trying to tell people 'Register on our channel for the fight at 5am in the morning, it's Pacquaio vs some guy who lost his last fight'... Vs SKY Sports News - the most dominant sports marketing tool in the country telling people to watch Froch at 10pm.

Lot of work for Boxnation


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

TeddyL said:


> No because the majority of the people who watch the Froch fight are not gonna wait up another 5 and half hours to watch it. Most of them wouldn't even be aware Pacquaio was fighting was that weekend.
> 
> By having Boxnation take it, they put the pressure on Boxnation to try compete against them in order to make something back on it. Which is impossible. When you have Warren in the sun trying to tell people 'Register on our channel for the fight at 5am in the morning, it's Pacquaio vs some guy who lost his last fight'... Vs SKY Sports News - the most dominant sports marketing tool in the country telling people to watch Froch at 10pm.
> 
> Lot of work for Boxnation


To be honest, I'd rather sleep through the Froch mismatch and shit card and stay up for Pac/Rios.


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## scrappylinks (Jun 2, 2012)

people who buy shit ppv cards are whats killing boxing


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## TeddyL (Oct 5, 2013)

Bill said:


> To be honest, I'd rather sleep through the Froch mismatch and shit card and stay up for Pac/Rios.


Yes but you aren't their target audience. You are not in the minority (which is boxing fans), you are a minority within them itself with your views on Hearn


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## Alf (Jul 26, 2013)

TeddyL said:


> No because the majority of the people who watch the Froch fight are not gonna wait up another 5 and half hours to watch it. Most of them wouldn't even be aware Pacquaio was fighting was that weekend.
> 
> By having Boxnation take it, they put the pressure on Boxnation to try compete against them in order to make something back on it. Which is impossible. When you have Warren in the sun trying to tell people 'Register on our channel for the fight at 5am in the morning, it's Pacquaio vs some guy who lost his last fight'... Vs SKY Sports News - the most dominant sports marketing tool in the country telling people to watch Froch at 10pm.
> 
> Lot of work for Boxnation


I think the majority of people who watch froch know who manny pacquaio is, he's been on sky box office before, heading up the khan-fagan ppv, which was a much smaller fight. defo smarter having it on the ppv.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

TeddyL said:


> Yes but you aren't their target audience. You are not in the minority (which is boxing fans), you are a minority within them itself with your views on Hearn


This has fuck all to do with Hearn, this is to do with the quality of boxing, Froch/Groves is a mismatch, the undercard is shit and the PPV isn't value for money, Pac/Rios is a better more interesting fight and Boxnation is better value for money.

Now fuck off.


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## SouthpawSlayer (Jun 13, 2012)

new age promoting aka lining eddies pockets


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## TeddyL (Oct 5, 2013)

Alan-Francis-85 said:


> I think the majority of people who watch froch know who manny pacquaio is, he's been on sky box office before, heading up the khan-fagan ppv, which was a much smaller fight. defo smarter having it on the ppv.


They know who he is obviously. They just won't be aware he is fighting.



Bill said:


> This has fuck all to do with Hearn, this is to do with the quality of boxing, Froch/Groves is a mismatch, the undercard is shit and the PPV isn't value for money, Pac/Rios is a better more interesting fight and Boxnation is better value for money.


3	Thomas Oosthuizen	South Africa
4	George Groves	England
5	James De Gale	England
6	Brandon Gonzales	United States
7	Maksim Vlasov	Russian Federation
8	Andre Dirrell	United States
9	Mouhamed Ali Ndiaye	Italy
10	Arthur Abraham	Germany

The IBF belt is Froch's bargaining tool for other fights, he is hardly going to relinquish it instead of fighting his mandatory Groves. I am not sure who you seem to think should occupy that slot instead. But it doesn't really matter does it, as it could be anyone in the list, or any Matchroom fight for that matter and you'd still be crying about it on the internet :yep


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

TeddyL said:


> They know who he is obviously. They just won't be aware he is fighting.
> 
> 3	Thomas Oosthuizen	South Africa
> 4	George Groves	England
> ...


So what possible reason does this fight have to be PPV?

Also don't judge me by your own biased standards, It could be a Frank Warren fighter, Bob Arum fighter, I don't care, if something's shit I will say so, if a promoter is taking the piss out of the fan's I will say so, Hearns getting stick at the moment because he's the one that deserves it, what can't you grasp about that?


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## DaveT (Nov 13, 2012)

I am interested in watching the main event but it is no way a PPV fight yet. If Groves was an Argie with the same ranking and career, this would never be anywhere near PPV.

The undercard is what really fucks me off, however. There isn't one fight that I would turn on to watch for free in it's own right. It's ok putting Quigg on the show but if he is in against a late replacement, you can't sell it as "a world title fight as chief support".

For the £15 I would like to sit on the sofa, with shit loads of beer, order some food in and make that my evening (the wife can like it or go out). This card doesn't provide anything like enough quality to make me want to do this.


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## raymann (Jul 6, 2012)

when this fight was made hearn would have been looking at froch vs groves, burns vs quigg, mcdonell vs tbc and then the usual prospects below. if the other fights were competitive and mcd fight was good as well then that looks a lot better. whats on offer at the moment is a shite card with a mismatch of a headline fight that sets the bar so low for ppv its genuinely worrying.

the only good thing about this is seeing the ticket touts who dived in after froch vs kess get burned. expect to see a fight at a press conference or something similar as two people that used to be mates are now cast as 'real enemies' and there is 'genuine bad feeling'. fact is, groves and froch used to spar together, groves was out of his depth and this fight is only happening because of where froch is in his career.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

It wonder how many people believe that this card will actually happen on November 23rd I think the chances of this being put off till the new year are very high.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

raymann said:


> when this fight was made hearn would have been looking at froch vs groves, *burns vs quigg*, mcdonell vs tbc and then the usual prospects below. if the other fights were competitive and mcd fight was good as well then that looks a lot better. whats on offer at the moment is a shite card with a mismatch of a headline fight that sets the bar so low for ppv its genuinely worrying.
> 
> the only good thing about this is seeing the ticket touts who dived in after froch vs kess get burned. expect to see a fight at a press conference or something similar as two people that used to be mates are now cast as 'real enemies' and there is 'genuine bad feeling'. fact is, groves and froch used to spar together, groves was out of his depth and this fight is only happening because of where froch is in his career.


:huh


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## The Chemist (Jun 14, 2013)

Stunkie said:


> It wonder how many people believe that this card will actually happen on November 23rd I think the chances of this being put off till the new year are very high.


Think your living in cloud cuckoo land if you don't think it happen!


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Stunkie said:


> It wonder how many people believe that this card will actually happen on November 23rd I think the chances of this being put off till the new year are very high.


It would be brilliant news, hopefully the fight gets cancelled altogether and Froch fights Golovkin.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

The Chemist said:


> Think your living in cloud cuckoo land if you don't think it happen!


I didn't say that it wouldn't happen I said I think there is a decent chance this will be postponed.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Bill said:


> It would be brilliant news, hopefully the fight gets cancelled altogether and Froch fights Golovkin, Eddie files for bankruptcy and Leyton Orient are liquidated


We know that's what your hoping for mate.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Stunkie said:


> We know that's what your hoping for mate.


:yep


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## BoltonTerrier (Jun 12, 2013)

Bill said:


> It would be brilliant news, hopefully the fight gets cancelled altogether and Froch fights Golovkin.


Yeah it would be brilliant news for the 20000 people who have tickets and have booked travel and accomodation. :huh:rolleyes
But dont let that get in the way of your sad little Eddie PPV obsession..


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## Libertarian (Jun 2, 2012)

Sad PPV obsession?

Eddie wants the fans to love him, whilst fucking them up the arse with the most gigantic BBC 

Boxing fans should be anti-PPV by definition, and accepting it only in a tiny minority of cases - like Floyd vs Hatton, Haye vs Klitschko and so on.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

BoltonTerrier said:


> Yeah it would be brilliant news for the 20000 people who have tickets and have booked travel and accomodation. :huh:rolleyes
> But dont let that get in the way of your sad little Eddie PPV obsession..


I will talk about what I want mug, If you don't like it stick me on ignore.

You may like being fleeched or watching the sport get further and further away in popularity, I don't.


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## BoltonTerrier (Jun 12, 2013)

Farage said:


> Sad PPV obsession?
> 
> Eddie wants the fans to love him, whilst fucking them up the arse with the most gigantic BBC
> 
> Boxing fans should be anti-PPV by definition, and accepting it only in a tiny minority of cases - like Floyd vs Hatton, Haye vs Klitschko and so on.


Its one thing wanting the PPV figures to fail and the model being dropped. I dont have a problem with that. But wanting the card to be cancelled and see thousands of genuine boxing fans lose out on hundreds of pounds is another thing altogether.


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## BoltonTerrier (Jun 12, 2013)

Bill said:


> I will talk about what I want mug, If you don't like it stick me on ignore.
> 
> You may like being fleeched or watching the sport get further and further away in popularity, I don't.


See my post above. I agree this is not a PPV fight and I would rather spend £40 going to the venue and having a great night out in a fantastic atmosphere than sat in my living room having spent £15 on it.

However its one thing wanting the PPV numbers to flop miserably but wanting the event cancelled when thousands people have spent hundreds on travel and hotel rooms is bang out of order imo.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

BoltonTerrier said:


> Yeah it would be brilliant news for the 20000 people who have tickets and have booked travel and accomodation. :huh:rolleyes
> But dont let that get in the way of your sad little Eddie PPV obsession..


Also, is it my fault you bought tickets on Eddie's broken promises? Is it my fault the fan's feel let down? Do I have to want Froch to fight Groves just because you bought tickets, If you want to blame somebody blame the people that run the sport,,,,like I do.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

BoltonTerrier said:


> See my post above. I agree this is not a PPV fight and I would rather spend £40 going to the venue and having a great night out in a fantastic atmosphere than sat in my living room having spent £15 on it.
> 
> However its one thing wanting the PPV numbers to flop miserably but wanting the event cancelled when thousands people have spent hundreds on travel and hotel rooms is bang out of order imo.


If this fell through due to not being PPV worthy, it wouldn't be Bill's fault :yep

Not that it will though, this will go ahead as PPV.


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## BoltonTerrier (Jun 12, 2013)

I dont feel robbed though. I would happily pay £40 to watch Froch v Groves plus a few decent undercard fights. Its the same price as people are paying for the shit Hull card this weekend. I would feel ripped off If I had bought it on PPV but it hasnt even gone on sale yet..

FWIW I reckon itll probably do pretty well on the buys after sky ramps it up over the next few weeks(both on ringside tomorrow)


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

Bill said:


> Also, is it my fault you bought tickets on Eddie's broken promises? Is it my fault the fan's feel let down? Do I have to want Froch to fight Groves just because you bought tickets, If you want to blame somebody blame the people that run the sport,,,,like I do.


:happy

This is a terrible fight, if you bought tickets to this crap and end up feeling let down, either because it gets cancelled or the fight turns out to be a one-sided farce like many predict it will be, then it's your own fault for buying into Sky and St Edward's bullshit.


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## BoltonTerrier (Jun 12, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> :happy
> 
> This is a terrible fight, if you bought tickets to this crap and end up feeling let down, either because it gets cancelled or the fight turns out to be a one-sided farce like many predict it will be, then it's your own fault for buying into Sky and St Edward's bullshit.


I dont think it is a terrible fight though. I think Groves will do a lot better than many on here predict. Yes it was my decision to buy a ticket and its one Im very happy with. Obviously Id prefer some decent undercard fights as well to go with it..


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

PaulieMc said:


> :happy
> 
> This is a terrible fight, if you bought tickets to this crap and end up feeling let down, either because it gets cancelled or the fight turns out to be a one-sided farce like many predict it will be, then it's your own fault for buying into Sky and St Edward's bullshit.


Exactly, why should I feel feel guilty or put up with this shit because of other peoples stupidity, I said from the start this was a rubbish fight and that Eddie was lying about the undercard and I didn't want it to happen, If people fell for his smart suit and smile, be that on them, not me.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

BoltonTerrier said:


> I dont think it is a terrible fight though. I think Groves will do a lot better than many on here predict. Yes it was my decision to buy a ticket and its one Im very happy with. Obviously Id prefer some decent undercard fights as well to go with it..


That's your decision mate and you're entitled to do what you want with your money as is anyone. What we're saying though is that if this whole event turns out to be a stinker like previous Sky PPVs then nobody who spent money on it will have any right to complain. We've seen this all before and most people have their caution caps on because of it. We've been ripped off and let down by Sky countless times so by now we can see it coming a mile off.


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## DaveT (Nov 13, 2012)

Sadly I don't think the undercard is going to affect the amount of PPV buys this fight has. 

Eddie knows the undercard is awful and is hoping and praying for something to kick off on Ringside tomorrow. In fact, he has probably sent Froch in to be even more of a cunt than usual. 

The publicity will soar and the undercard will become irrelevant to the casuals who buy the fight - meaning that sadly Eddie gets away with it.


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## - DC - (Jun 7, 2013)

Mandanda said:


> Shocked when i saw the news about Pac-Rios on BN. Fair play to em'. The Froch-Groves card isn't looking good at all glad i didn't book tickets for it.


Didn't Hearn claim he had a fantastic card and it would be nothing short of that because of the PPV factor and so that people dont feel short changed? I'm sure they said they didnt want to distance the paying customer, because they started doing PPV a lot more again. They said the cards needed to be worthy of PPV for them to be PPV. Because they'd been burnt once with the Haye-Harrison farce, a fight in which Sky lost just as much credibility as the fighters. They had to rebuild with Eddie Hearn and get fans back onside, now they have, its straight back in on PPV. It was the plan all along to sucker them back in, "leave a bit of bread in the fishes mouth" wank them off for a while with the PR and get more money out of the paying customer. A paying customer who is already paying through the roof for Sky Sports. You cant fool me you bunch of capitalist extortionate money grabbing suit wearing tossers.

"I'm not a mug and I don't mug people of"

Fuck Hearn. Fuck Sky. Fuck Murdoch.


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## Post Box (Jun 7, 2012)

This might be the first PPV that I don't buy & I bought Haye-Harrison for fuck sake


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## Post Box (Jun 7, 2012)

I really want this PPV to fall flat on its face


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## Jim Kelly (Jul 12, 2012)

I was thinking hearn was banking on carl's celeb dance performance on itv...


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## Trippy (Jun 18, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Amir Khan pulled it off?


Indeed! Him getting sparked 54 seconds into his Sky Box Office debut is the best £15 I've ever spent.


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## Azar (Oct 22, 2013)

finally people wakin up to fast car the guy wants to mug as many people as possible while trying to pretend hes a man of the people.


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## - DC - (Jun 7, 2013)

Azar said:


> *finally* people wakin up to fast car the guy wants to mug as many people as possible while trying to pretend hes a man of the people.


_*Finally?

*_:huh


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## Macho_Grande (Jun 6, 2012)

Isn't PPV a massive risk for a promoter?

They can do all the projections in the world but there is no garauntee that anyone will buy it..

I think it's quite arrogant to suggest that Froch v Groves is only possible with PPV... If nobody buys it they are fucked


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Anybody who says Carl froch versus George groves is a terrible fight might want to consider following another sport.


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## DaveT (Nov 13, 2012)

One to watch said:


> Anybody who says Carl froch versus George groves is a terrible fight might want to consider following another sport.[/
> 
> It's not a stand alone PPV headlining fight though.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

DaveT said:


> One to watch said:
> 
> 
> > Anybody who says Carl froch versus George groves is a terrible fight might want to consider following another sport.[/
> ...


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

One to watch said:


> Anybody who says Carl froch versus George groves is a terrible fight might want to consider following another sport.


Yeah, how dare anyone have an opinion.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> Yeah, how dare anyone have an opinion.


Listen.if people think that froch-groves isn't worthy of PPV then I understand and pretty much agree.

But if you think it's a terrible fight then what boxing gets your pulse racing.i would question the persons love for the sport to be honest.im not saying it's a top international fight but domestically it's very very good.


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## cheekyvid (Jun 9, 2012)

Eddie has a needy girl bent over, shafting her up the Hershey Highway whilst whispering "I love you babe" in her ear. And his gold-plated brass neck twists in the cold night air as he dumps her to the kerb, from his fast (sky) sports telling her, "I'll call you, love." He doesn't call but like the erstwhile slut she crawls back because the only other option is a pauper with a boxy Fiat punto.
Hes shafting her hard whilst flirting with casual sluts.
The girl's name? Boxing Fans.


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## TeddyL (Oct 5, 2013)

Without PPV British boxing cannot do high profile fights. The advertisement money you get from just being on SS1 isn't enough to pay for them.


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## CheckHook (Jun 6, 2013)

Don't think it should be PPV. But this a not a terrible fight in the slightest, it's a brilliant match up. As a boxing fan these are the kind of fights we need to be seeing


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

One to watch said:


> Anybody who says Carl froch versus George groves is a terrible fight might want to consider following another sport.


I'll clarify what I meant. I don't mean terrible in the sense that they'll just hug each other all night and the crowd will fall asleep. I mean terrible in the sense that most fans weren't particularly interested in seeing it made and then put on PPV, at least not right now. Most people surely would have preferred to have seen Groves fight another top 10 guy to prove that he's worthy and seen Froch see if he could sort a deal with Golovkin?

This whole promotion just stinks of Sky taking for us a ride and giving their fighters unjustified paydays, a bit like Haye-Harrison in my opinion. If you or anyone wants to buy it then fair enough, spend your money how you see fit. Don't be surprised though if it all ends up with us saying "I told you so".


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## scrappylinks (Jun 2, 2012)

TeddyL said:


> Without PPV British boxing cannot do high profile fights. The advertisement money you get from just being on SS1 isn't enough to pay for them.


if you have to fight on ppv to get paid millions of pounds maybe you should justify earning millions of pounds by fighting someone good


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

The way people talk, you'd think that they don't have the choice whether to pay for PPV or not. You can't say that "Sky are taking us for a ride" when it's entirely down to the fans whether they buy the show. If you think it's shit, don't buy it, and if enough people agree with you, Sky and Hearn will lose money. Buying a PPV isn't a mystery box, where you don't have a clue which fights will be on but you take the risk on the off chance it'll be quality, everyone who buys it will either think it's value for money or they'll think it's not worth £15. Personally, I don't think it is worth £15 but this idea that Sky are doing anything wrong to put it on PPV is bullshit because it's not a mandatory fee for every boxing fan. If the majority of casual fans agree that it's not worth the money, it'll be a flop and it'll cost everyone involved money, so it's not like Sky and Hearn can put out shit, charge massive amounts for it and still make a profit.

Fans have the choice to buy tickets to a show, to get BoxNation, to get Sky Sports 1 and to get PPV fights, and in all of those cases, the same rule applies. If you think it's value for money, get it, but if you think it's not worth the amount asked for, don't. That's a simple choice given to the consumer and there's no obligation to pay, therefore there's no basis to cry about being ripped off.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

Jack said:


> The way people talk, you'd think that they don't have the choice whether to pay for PPV or not. You can't say that "Sky are taking us for a ride" when it's entirely down to the fans whether they buy the show. If you think it's shit, don't buy it, and if enough people agree with you, Sky and Hearn will lose money. Buying a PPV isn't a mystery box, where you don't have a clue which fights will be on but you take the risk on the off chance it'll be quality, everyone who buys it will either think it's value for money or they'll think it's not worth £15. Personally, I don't think it is worth £15 but this idea that Sky are doing anything wrong to put it on PPV is bullshit because it's not a mandatory fee for every boxing fan. If the majority of casual fans agree that it's not worth the money, it'll be a flop and it'll cost everyone involved money, so it's not like Sky and Hearn can put out shit, charge massive amounts for it and still make a profit.
> 
> Fans have the choice to buy tickets to a show, to get BoxNation, to get Sky Sports 1 and to get PPV fights, and in all of those cases, the same rule applies. If you think it's value for money, get it, but if you think it's not worth the amount asked for, don't. That's a simple choice given to the consumer and there's no obligation to pay, therefore there's no basis to cry about being ripped off.


Let's look at it another way. Do you see the biggest football games on PPV? Why not?

Ignore whether the fight is PPV worthy, and think about whether it's good for consumers to have to pay extra on top of their subscriptions for what is, effectively, a one-fight card with a smattering of mid-level names alongside it. It's hardly the sort of card Hearn said he'd need to justify PPV and, from my perspective, isn't that much better than the dross Warren served up when all he did was PPV.

It was wrong when he asked £15 for it, and it's wrong now.


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

dftaylor said:


> Let's look at it another way. Do you see the biggest football games on PPV? Why not?
> 
> Ignore whether the fight is PPV worthy, and think about whether it's good for consumers to have to pay extra on top of their subscriptions for what is, effectively, a one-fight card with a smattering of mid-level names alongside it. It's hardly the sort of card Hearn said he'd need to justify PPV and, from my perspective, isn't that much better than the dross Warren served up when all he did was PPV.
> 
> It was wrong when he asked £15 for it, and it's wrong now.


Football is an entirely different sport to boxing though. Boxers don't have 50+ fights a year, where they are guaranteed a fixed amount of money per week. There are no regular TV contracts, no regular sponserships or anything like that. The structure of money in boxing and MMA is different to other sports, and that's why PPV exists. I think the format can be very beneficial to the fighters and the sport too.

I'm not going to defend this card because, as I said, I don't think it's worth £15. However, if enough people agree with me, Hearn and Sky will lose money on this card and that'll change their attitudes towards PPV in the future, so that will prevent more weak cards. If the majority of potential customers agree that it's a crap card and nobody buys it, things will change, but if people do like the card and they get their moneys worth, whats the problem with that? If people want to spend £15 on a one-fight card which has the potential to be one-sided, that's their choice. I'm not saying it's worth £15, I'm just saying that people aren't being ripped off when they have a simple choice of whether to buy it or not.


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## TeddyL (Oct 5, 2013)

scrappylinks said:


> if you have to fight on ppv to get paid millions of pounds maybe you should justify earning millions of pounds by fighting someone good


Millions?, try a few hundred grand. A fight on SS1 cannot offer anything more than a few hundred thousand pounds, when you are splitting that between two boxers it doesn't leave much.

So if you want a big fight in the UK, it isn't going to happen. Because all the big names can fight in other countries or other platforms and make 800k+. They are not going to do it in Britain. For example , Kell Brook Vs Any of golden boys big name welterweights would have to be PPV. It isn't about deserves. It's just the realities of getting the fight made in the UK


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## Ilesey (Jun 8, 2012)

I won't be buying this one. I don't think it's PPV worthy and the much anticipated undercard hardly sets the pulse racing. Dissapointing, really.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

TeddyL said:


> Millions?, try a few hundred grand. A fight on SS1 cannot offer anything more than a few hundred thousand pounds, when you are splitting that between two boxers it doesn't leave much.
> 
> So if you want a big fight in the UK, it isn't going to happen. Because all the big names can fight in other countries or other platforms and make 800k+. They are not going to do it in Britain. For example , Kell Brook Vs Any of golden boys big name welterweights would have to be PPV. It isn't about deserves. It's just the realities of getting the fight made in the UK


Froch/Groves ISN'T a big fight though.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Bill said:


> Froch/Groves ISN'T a big fight though.


But it has Mr PPV, the "joint" greatest British boxer of all time, the P4P number 2 and star of Saturday night prime time TV. If that's not PPV what is?


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## Roe (Jun 1, 2012)

Bill said:


> Froch/Groves ISN'T a big fight though.


Selling out in the first hour is pretty big.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Roe said:


> Selling out in the first hour is pretty big.


How many went to ticket touts Roe?


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

Bill said:


> How many went to ticket touts Roe?


Most of them


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Stunkie said:


> But it has Mr PPV, the "joint" greatest British boxer of all time, the P4P number 2 and star of Saturday night prime time TV. If that's not PPV what is?


Froch as much as I like him, is full of shit, saying that he is a level maybe 2 levels above Groves, who hasn't mixed in world class company and best win is Degale at domestic level, Froch can't carry a PPV on his own and never will be, he isn't Mayweather despite what King Edward might say. :lol:


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

TeddyL said:


> Without PPV British boxing cannot do high profile fights. The advertisement money you get from just being on SS1 isn't enough to pay for them.


That may be the case, though I'm not convinced, but if ppv is the vehicle then it needs to be value for money.


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

This PPV whinging is just plain boring. Let's face it many have no intention of paying anyway. If you don't think its value for money then you have two options:

1. Stream it for free.
2. Don't stream or buy it.

You'd think people are being forced to buy the fights, the way some go on.

If a fight is on PPV then it pretty much automatically becomes a bigger fight due to the amount of coverage, column inches and hype it gets. I'd rather people were talking about big fights that are happening in UK rather than a small number of people talking about a card in America. Even Froch-Groves as it stands is nowhere near the worst PPV of the last say 5/6 years:

Hatton vs Mayweather
Hatton vs Pacquaio
Hatton vs Senchenko
Hatton vs Laszcano
Hatton vs Malignaggi
Khan vs Fagan
Khan vs Prescott
Khan vs Barrera
Khan vs McCloskey
Khan vs Kotelnik
Khan vs Salita
Froch vs Kessler I
Froch vs Kessler II
Froch vs Abraham
Froch vs Dirrell (AWFUL undercard)
Haye vs Audley 
Haye vs Ruiz 
Haye vs Valuev
Haye vs Klitschko (No undercard)
Magnificent 7
Groves vs Degale + Clev


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## Jakemilo (Nov 12, 2012)

You could still get tickets off eventim last week and undercard fighters are still hawking em ,I like froch until he opens his gob so won't pay any extra to watch him


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## TeddyL (Oct 5, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> That may be the case, though I'm not convinced, but if ppv is the vehicle then it needs to be value for money.


Sometimes it's going to be hit and miss. If they are not careful they will easily slide back to the old days.

Problem is that once a fighter gets put onto PPV he expects it every time. If Froch Kessler had not been PPV, this wouldn't be either. But, although he is obviously taking home less, a guy isn't going to go from earning millions, to earning 250K.

I remember Warren put Khan onto PPV because it was the only way to keep him. People were in uproar that he left ITV but it wasn't Warrens fault. The demands from Khans people were such that anything else was impossible. Problem was by the end he was getting 50,000 viewers or something like that.

So it's not so much about the fight usually, but the boxer in the fight. So the onus is more on making sure every fight is a decent name.


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## DaveT (Nov 13, 2012)

I agree, it IS a fight that I would be interested in seeing based on the fact that they are both British and there is a bit of needle there (probably not as much as the stage managed Ringside spat that will be on later).

I think the frustration here is, once again, the proper boxing fans get to miss out on a night of boxing simply because we know that the card isn't worth £15 and don't agree with paying for it. Casuals who think "fuck it, I'll get it" on the night are the ones who are being catered to here.

I do think that to put on MAJOR fights, PPV is necessary over here but the standard of the card needs to reflect the fact that they are asking people to part with £15 on top of their usual Sky subscription fee. It needs to feel like you are buying in to a great event - not a run of the mill card with a headlining fight that may be interesting but when you strip it down it SHOULD be a routine win for Froch.


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## TeddyL (Oct 5, 2013)

DaveT said:


> I think the frustration here is, once again, the proper boxing fans get to miss out on a night of boxing simply because we know that the card isn't worth £15 and don't agree with paying for it. Casuals who think "fuck it, I'll get it" on the night are the ones who are being catered to here.


Yep understandable but you have to see that Sky obviously is in the business of making profit because that is what the shareholders want. There isn't always some guy sat there rubbing his hands together thinking how he's fucking over all the boxing fans whilst thinking of all the money he is making. It's just regular people, some old woman in a carehome who has her savings invested partially invested in Sky. Everyone wants money. That's why the concept of corporations is fucked up.

Anyway.. back in point, because of all that , nobody gives a fuck about boxing fans because especially in the UK it is a minority sport, there is no major money to be made from boxing fans to either make profit or to fund the fights themselves, so sadly these days it relies upon the football fans, who all become experts at 5pm on fight day and are convinced Hatton would of had Mayweather had it not been for Cortez who was paid off.


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## Ashedward (Jun 2, 2012)

The problem is that Hearn boasted that the undercard would be top notch and with 3 weeks out the chief support is Quigg-tba.He gets over excited an does himself no favours with some his comments,setting a standard to be met and failing to deliver.I`m going to this, so i`m dissapointed with the undercard and people have every right to say this isn`t good enough.It might be better then many ppvs of the past but Hearn and the chance to set a new standard and failed to do so.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Ashedward said:


> The problem is that Hearn boasted that the undercard would be top notch and with 3 weeks out the chief support is Quigg-tba.He gets over excited an does himself no favours with some his comments,setting a standard to be met and failing to deliver.I`m going to this, so i`m dissapointed with the undercard and people have every right to say this isn`t good enough.It might be better then many ppvs of the past but Hearn and the chance to set a new standard and failed to do so.


That's a good point.

Hearn will have pissed off a lot of people actually attending, who bought tickets after him saying how wonderful the undercard would be.

Us PPV buyers can still reject the show.


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## Ashedward (Jun 2, 2012)

Grant said:


> That's a good point.
> 
> Hearn will have pissed off a lot of people actually attending, who bought tickets after him saying how wonderful the undercard would be.
> 
> Us PPV buyers can still reject the show.


Yep,I`m still looking forward to Froch-Groves and think Groves will cause problems early on but the way he was talking it was like he was going to put on a magnificent 7 type show underneath and the card would be outrageous. I always thought that the card wouldn`t match up to the boasts but with 3 weeks to go it looks very poor compared to what he promised.The best we can hope for now is that he gets a decent opponent for Quigg and suprises us with another good fight from nowhere.


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## Elliot (Jun 4, 2013)

Not going to pretend that I'm not going to pay for it. Sky will charge for absolutely anything they can, shocks me football cup finals aren't PPV.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

Bill said:


> How many went to ticket touts Roe?


Sick of pointing this out to people. There's still tickets available now on eBay and StubHub.


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## smoggy7188 (May 28, 2013)

Lilo said:


> This PPV whinging is just plain boring. Let's face it many have no intention of paying anyway. If you don't think its value for money then you have two options:
> 
> 1. Stream it for free.
> 2. Don't stream or buy it.
> ...


best post ive seen in a while on here.


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

PaulieMc said:


> Sick of pointing this out to people. There's still tickets available now on eBay and StubHub.


That's irrelevant. The ticket companies bought the tickets because it's a show people are interested in, so you can't say that there's a lack of interest because it wasn't the fans who bought them directly. The ticket companies knew there was high interest in the fight so they purchased the tickets in bulk, as they know they'll make a good profit from them. If there wasn't significant interest in the fight, companies like StubHub wouldn't have bought so many tickets in the first place.


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

Lilo said:


> This PPV whinging is just plain boring. Let's face it many have no intention of paying anyway. If you don't think its value for money then you have two options:
> 
> 1. Stream it for free.
> 2. Don't stream or buy it.
> ...


Excellent post, mate.

Like you said, people have a choice of whether to buy it or not. If you don't think it's worth the money, don't pay for it, and that's the end of it. I see no reason why people cry about a show being on PPV when they aren't being forced to buy it. It doesn't make a difference to me.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Jack said:


> Excellent post, mate.
> 
> Like you said, people have a choice of whether to buy it or not. If you don't think it's worth the money, don't pay for it, and that's the end of it. I see no reason why people cry about a show being on PPV when they aren't being forced to buy it. It doesn't make a difference to me.


Because it is stopping people watching the fight in the manner they'd like.

I'd really like to see Froch-Groves at home. But like fuck will I support the PPV, cus its crap.

I've gotta go to the pub to watch it now (no sarcasm) and watch it with people jumping around talking shit.

I can put up with that for the football/rugby, but I like watching boxing on my own.

Probably comes across as petty, but the decision to put this relatively crap card on PPV means I can't do as I please.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

Jack said:


> That's irrelevant. The ticket companies bought the tickets because it's a show people are interested in, so you can't say that there's a lack of interest because it wasn't the fans who bought them directly. The ticket companies knew there was high interest in the fight so they purchased the tickets in bulk, as they know they'll make a good profit from them. If there wasn't significant interest in the fight, companies like StubHub wouldn't have bought so many tickets in the first place.


Think I'm going to call you Thong from now on, seeing as you're always up Eddie's arse. This fight is not a big fight, nobody outside of boxing cares about it. The casuals, as people insist on calling them, don't care by the looks of it. Has a single person who isn't already a boxing fan mentioned this fight to you? Same question to every other poster. Groves is unknown and Froch isn't as known as he thinks.

It's annoying as fuck when Hearn sits there in his interviews all smarmy and says "this fight sold out in 15 minutes" and thinks that proves that people can't wait for this fight and his and Sky's decision to put it on PPV is vindicated. The ticket brokers bought up all the tickets, this happens for EVERY sporting event. The tickets haven't all been bought up because there was 20,000 people clamouring on their computers and waiting up all night to buy tickets ASAP. Anyone who's going will have bought them during the re-sale.

People will buy the fight can do as they please, it's your money. Just stop telling those of us who've been ripped off before and don't like it when we feel Sky are trying to take us for a ride kick off. If they refunded my money that I've wasted on PPV in the past then I'd shut up but they won't and never will.


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## Peter Barlow (Jun 4, 2013)

George Groves is a box office fighter and Skys next cash cow.....:deal


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

PaulieMc said:


> The ticket brokers bought up all the tickets, this happens for EVERY sporting event. The tickets haven't all been bought up because there was 20,000 people clamouring on their computers and waiting up all night to buy tickets ASAP. Anyone who's going will have bought them during the re-sale.


No, it doesn't. How many empty seats were at the last Warren show? How many were at the Brook fight? In fact, when was the last boxing event (Prizefighter excluded) which sold 100% of it's tickets? You're talking absolute nonsense. The thing is, you must know that what you're saying is bollocks yet because you've picked a stance, you have to create lies in order to build up an argument to defend it. It's ridiculous.


PaulieMc said:


> Just stop telling those of us who've been ripped off before and don't like it when we feel Sky are trying to take us for a ride kick off. If they refunded my money that I've wasted on PPV in the past then I'd shut up but they won't and never will.


You didn't get "ripped off", the fights simply didn't live up to their expectations. That's nothing to do with Sky so why the fuck would they give you a refund?


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> Think I'm going to call you Thong from now on, seeing as you're always up Eddie's arse. This fight is not a big fight, nobody outside of boxing cares about it. The casuals, as people insist on calling them, don't care by the looks of it. Has a single person who isn't already a boxing fan mentioned this fight to you? Same question to every other poster. Groves is unknown and Froch isn't as known as he thinks.
> 
> It's annoying as fuck when Hearn sits there in his interviews all smarmy and says "this fight sold out in 15 minutes" and thinks that proves that people can't wait for this fight and his and Sky's decision to put it on PPV is vindicated. The ticket brokers bought up all the tickets, this happens for EVERY sporting event. The tickets haven't all been bought up because there was 20,000 people clamouring on their computers and waiting up all night to buy tickets ASAP. Anyone who's going will have bought them during the re-sale.
> 
> People will buy the fight can do as they please, it's your money. Just stop telling those of us who've been ripped off before and don't like it when we feel Sky are trying to take us for a ride kick off. If they refunded my money that I've wasted on PPV in the past then I'd shut up but they won't and never will.


Not all sporting events sell out mate.

The fact 20,000 were sold in double quick time is an Indication of the scale of the fight,whether it's touts or not.

This is a big fight,the biggest domestic fight of the year and one of the biggest there currently is in Britain.

Both fighters deliver exciting fights more often than not.


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## Guest (Oct 31, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> Think I'm going to call you Thong from now on, seeing as you're always up Eddie's arse. This fight is not a big fight, nobody outside of boxing cares about it. The casuals, as people insist on calling them, don't care by the looks of it. Has a single person who isn't already a boxing fan mentioned this fight to you? Same question to every other poster. Groves is unknown and Froch isn't as known as he thinks.
> 
> It's annoying as fuck when Hearn sits there in his interviews all smarmy and says "this fight sold out in 15 minutes" and thinks that proves that people can't wait for this fight and his and Sky's decision to put it on PPV is vindicated. The ticket brokers bought up all the tickets, this happens for EVERY sporting event. The tickets haven't all been bought up because there was 20,000 people clamouring on their computers and waiting up all night to buy tickets ASAP. Anyone who's going will have bought them during the re-sale.
> 
> People will buy the fight can do as they please, it's your money. Just stop telling those of us who've been ripped off before and don't like it when we feel Sky are trying to take us for a ride kick off. If they refunded my money that I've wasted on PPV in the past then I'd shut up but they won't and never will.


i love this tout argument. if anything it goes to prove its a big fight because the touts take notice. there wasnt an empty seat in the 02 for Froch v Kessler and people were saying every ticket went to a tout.


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## BoltonTerrier (Jun 12, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> Think I'm going to call you Thong from now on, seeing as you're always up Eddie's arse. This fight is not a big fight, nobody outside of boxing cares about it. *The casuals, as people insist on calling them, don't care by the looks of it. Has a single person who isn't already a boxing fan mentioned this fight to you? Same question to every other poster. Groves is unknown and Froch isn't as known as he thinks. *
> 
> It's annoying as fuck when Hearn sits there in his interviews all smarmy and says "this fight sold out in 15 minutes" and thinks that proves that people can't wait for this fight and his and Sky's decision to put it on PPV is vindicated. The ticket brokers bought up all the tickets, this happens for EVERY sporting event. The tickets haven't all been bought up because there was 20,000 people clamouring on their computers and waiting up all night to buy tickets ASAP. Anyone who's going will have bought them during the re-sale.
> 
> People will buy the fight can do as they please, it's your money. Just stop telling those of us who've been ripped off before and don't like it when we feel Sky are trying to take us for a ride kick off. If they refunded my money that I've wasted on PPV in the past then I'd shut up but they won't and never will.


I had 7 casuals ask me to sort tickets out for this one who have barely been to a fight before. Stubhub had loads of tickets for Mayweather Canelo too if you think thats a good barometer..


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

Jack said:


> You didn't get "ripped off", the fights simply didn't live up to their expectations. That's nothing to do with Sky so why the fuck would they give you a refund?


I never understand the argument that, if a PPV is disappointing, then it's a rip-off. Sky, as you say, isn't responsible for whether a fight turns out well or not. The people that had gigantic e-tantrums over Haye-Wlad (and Haye-Harrison before it) not being exciting seemed to conveniently forget the fighters' tendencies.

Ultimately, you have the choice as a consumer whether to buy a service. Sky's offering never appeals to me and their attitude to charging premium fees for the bigger fights isn't something I like or support. So I don't buy it. That way I don't feel ripped off. I can go to the pub for most of the UK events they show, or my sister's, and I can catch BoxNation's online service wherever I am.


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## Trippy (Jun 18, 2013)

Lilo said:


> This PPV whinging is just plain boring. Let's face it many have no intention of paying anyway. If you don't think its value for money then you have two options:
> 
> 1. Stream it for free.
> 2. Don't stream or buy it.
> ...


A lot of those had USA cards following them, particularly the Khan ones.

The Froch fights were only on Primetime because no other broadcaster was interested too.

The magnificent 7 was a pretty damn good card with Khan v Maidana part of it as well.

But just because we've been shovelled shit in the past it doesn't mean we should continue to accept it.

Hearn made specific promises to the quality of this undercard and at the minute he's not making good on it.


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## Trippy (Jun 18, 2013)

I hope the happy clappers spouting the "You're not forced to buy it, so stop complaining" aren't also the type who complain about petrol prices or energy prices increasing. 'Cause you aren't forced to pay those either.


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

dftaylor said:


> I never understand the argument that, if a PPV is disappointing, then it's a rip-off. Sky, as you say, isn't responsible for whether a fight turns out well or not. The people that had gigantic e-tantrums over Haye-Wlad (and Haye-Harrison before it) not being exciting seemed to conveniently forget the fighters' tendencies.
> 
> Ultimately, you have the choice as a consumer whether to buy a service. Sky's offering never appeals to me and their attitude to charging premium fees for the bigger fights isn't something I like or support. So I don't buy it. That way I don't feel ripped off. I can go to the pub for most of the UK events they show, or my sister's, and I can catch BoxNation's online service wherever I am.


I agree, mate.

Ultimately, if a fight is great fun, people will view the PPV as a good buy but if it's a stinker or one round blowout, people will say it was a rip off. That's an absurd way of looking at it though, I think.


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

Trippy said:


> I hope the happy clappers spouting the "You're not forced to buy it, so stop complaining" aren't also the type who complain about petrol prices or energy prices increasing. 'Cause you aren't forced to pay those either.


Petrol and energy are essential items for most people though. Buying a boxing PPV is a different thing entirely because nobody 'needs' it like they need petrol. A better comparison would be something like a football shirt, which are very overpriced and not essential. I have no issue with clubs charging £50 per shirt though, I just won't get one.


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## sim_reiss (Jun 6, 2012)

Trippy said:


> I hope the happy clappers spouting the "You're not forced to buy it, so stop complaining" aren't also the type who complain about petrol prices or energy prices increasing. 'Cause you aren't forced to pay those either.


That's a stupid comparison. For a lot of people heating their homes and fueling their car is a necessity.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

BoltonTerrier said:


> I had 7 casuals ask me to sort tickets out for this one who have barely been to a fight before. Stubhub had loads of tickets for Mayweather Canelo too if you think thats a good barometer..


Fair enough though I've not heard a peep from anyone personally. Whenever Haye fights my dad always asks me cause he likes the heavyweights, when it comes Froch though he's not arsed and has never even heard of Groves.

Bringing up the Mayweather-Canelo only backs up the point I'm trying to make to be honest, not even that fight sold out that quick. I just don't like it when Hearn and Sky sit there all smug and say "this fight sold out in bla, bla, bla," and think that they're vindicated for making this PPV. They want the average numpty to think that this fight is so good that 20,000 people waited up on computers for hours in order to buy their tickets first thing before everyone else. That Carl Froch is such a massive name that whenever a fight is announced he drives fans into a frenzy. In reality only a few people actually did do that.

Again, buy the fight or even go to it if you want, no one has the right to tell people how to spend their money. Just don't be surprised if you coming away at the end feeling it was a waste, I have several times sadly.

Didn't get around to watching Ringside, was it any good?


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> Fair enough though I've not heard a peep from anyone personally. Whenever Haye fights my dad always asks me cause he likes the heavyweights, when it comes Froch though he's not arsed and has never even heard of Groves.
> 
> Bringing up the Mayweather-Canelo only backs up the point I'm trying to make to be honest, not even that fight sold out that quick. I just don't like it when Hearn and Sky sit there all smug and say "this fight sold out in bla, bla, bla," and think that they're vindicated for making this PPV. They want the average numpty to think that this fight is so good that 20,000 people waited up on computers for hours in order to buy their tickets first thing before everyone else. That Carl Froch is such a massive name that whenever a fight is announced he drives fans into a frenzy. In reality only a few people actually did do that.
> 
> ...


How do you know mayweather-canelo didn't sell out quick if touts bought up all the tickets in minutes.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

One to watch said:


> How do you know mayweather-canelo didn't sell out quick if touts bought up all the tickets in minutes.


I meant sold out in the sense that fans got hold of all the tickets!


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## - DC - (Jun 7, 2013)

Promoters and the people who make the moves in the boxing world, have divided the fans to rule. Divide and rule. Once upon a time we was simply _just_ boxing fans, now we are split into casuals and hardcore by them. Where if you watch a certain fight or not, or go on boxing forums or not, you are a certain _type_ of fan.

Its new age demographic stereotype marketing suit wearing corporate business brain bullshit. "Know your customer/audience and target accordingly"


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## smoggy7188 (May 28, 2013)

what is a hardcore boxing fan? everyone bands it about but what is it....


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> I meant sold out in the sense that fans got hold of all the tickets!


Unfortunately touts are part and parcel of life now.

I understand your reasons for being against PPV.haye-Harrison disgusted me and haye-klitschko disappointed me.the former in particular was damaging to boxing and continues to be,as this thread proves.
But froch-groves and froch-Kessler are good,good fights.i don't know whether they are PPV worthy but I will pay for them and I know it will be a good night.

PPV makes boxnation look sensational value though.

Compare your 15 quid for one evenings boxing to your 10quid which covers a mass of live high quality boxing.


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## Trippy (Jun 18, 2013)

sim_reiss said:


> That's a stupid comparison. For a lot of people heating their homes and fueling their car is a necessity.


You aren't forced to buy either though, which seems to be the crux of the argument for those criticising others who are making valid points about how ridiculous it is that this fight is PPV.

This PPV is a joke and the "Well, you do t have to buy it" reasoning doesn't hold up as I've just shown.

People have every right to have a go at Eddie and Matchroom for this. They already broadcast I a subscription platform that charge over £30 a month. Why can't this fight be shown on their to flagship their boxing coverage?


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## - DC - (Jun 7, 2013)

smoggy7188 said:


> what is a hardcore boxing fan? everyone bands it about but what is it....


Similar to hardcore porn I would imagine. Question is, what is a softcore boxing fan?


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## sim_reiss (Jun 6, 2012)

Trippy said:


> You aren't forced to buy either though, which seems to be the crux of the argument for those criticising others who are making valid points about how ridiculous it is that this fight is PPV.
> 
> This PPV is a joke and the "Well, you don't have to buy it" reasoning doesn't hold up as I've just shown.


You've shown nothing up. For a lot of people not heating their home and not putting fuel in their tank would have a deleterious impact on their quality of life. Essentially, they do have to buy them. Televised boxing, Sky itself even, is a luxury good. If you don't buy a PPV, you forfeit a couple of hours of entertainment and save £15. The comparison is completely invalid...



Trippy said:


> People have every right to have a go at Eddie and Matchroom for this. They already broadcast I a subscription platform that charge over £30 a month. Why can't this fight be shown on their to flagship their boxing coverage?


Because the viewing figures Sky achieve suggests that for all the subscription money they rake in, a very small percentage is down to televised boxing. The audience and advertising revenues Froch-Groves would generate don't justify the money being paid to stage the fight.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

Trippy said:


> They already broadcast I a subscription platform that charge over £30 a month. Why can't this fight be shown on their to flagship their boxing coverage?


Probably 80% alone of that pays for Sky's Premier League rights which is the main attraction to Sky Sports. Boxing is a minority of what they show so will have less money, obviously. 
Then the purse for Froch will be £1.5m so they have to get it from somewhere. Blame Carl.


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## Macho_Grande (Jun 6, 2012)

How do touts manage to purchase so many tickets in bulk anyway....

Do Matchroom mark them up & sell them to brokers?


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## JonnyBGoode (Jun 13, 2013)

The touts have software for purchasing multiple tickets apparently but it's not unknown for ticket companies to also own second tier more expensive ticket agencies that seem to get a lot of the original tickets on their books very quickly. Touts only buy all the tickets up for events that they think are guaranteed sell out anyway otherwise it wouldn't work so they obviously thought it would be a sell out, I bet some of the touts are pissed off with Eddie for the under card shambles too! 

On PPV I have always bought nearly all of them and the money isn't the issue I just think this one is very weak and have just decided not to pay for it this time because it's not really worth it. If they had at least one other decent fight like Rees/Mitchell and the Pac/Rios bill I would probably have cracked and bought it but it's not happened so I'm not going to bother, PPV is OK so long as it's for a really big card and this just doesn't qualify.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

Macho_Grande said:


> How do touts manage to purchase so many tickets in bulk anyway....
> 
> Do Matchroom mark them up & sell them to brokers?


Organised networks of folk looking for some quick cash. They tell them to buy the maximum limit of tickets on their credit/debit card. They pay them the money to cover the costs and a small fee for the purchase, and gather them up. Then there are the software solutions, which are less efficient on Ticketmaster, etc but quite good on some of the sites.

It's a complete racket, particularly for music events.


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## Macho_Grande (Jun 6, 2012)

dftaylor said:


> Organised networks of folk looking for some quick cash. They tell them to buy the maximum limit of tickets on their credit/debit card. They pay them the money to cover the costs and a small fee for the purchase, and gather them up. Then there are the software solutions, which are less efficient on Ticketmaster, etc but quite good on some of the sites.
> 
> It's a complete racket, particularly for music events.


But that doesn't guarantee that they'll get tickets....

I knew a guy in school called Tariq... He was always getting tickets for events. I remember him coming into college one day with a shitload of tickets for the 1999 Champions League final... This story isn't going anywhere btw..... He never would say how he was able to acquire tickets for any event on the planet...

Last I heard he was living it up in Dubai.

Always intrigued me how touts get tickets


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## Guest (Oct 31, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> Organised networks of folk looking for some quick cash. They tell them to buy the maximum limit of tickets on their credit/debit card. They pay them the money to cover the costs and a small fee for the purchase, and gather them up. Then there are the software solutions, which are less efficient on Ticketmaster, etc but quite good on some of the sites.
> 
> It's a complete racket, particularly for music events.


promoters and venues are probably in on it as well. Put £40 tickets up and let them all go to touts that sell them for £100. The tout takes £30 profit and gives £30 to the promoter/venue.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

Macho_Grande said:


> But that doesn't guarantee that they'll get tickets....
> 
> I knew a guy in school called Tariq... He was always getting tickets for events. I remember him coming into college one day with a shitload of tickets for the 1999 Champions League final... This story isn't going anywhere btw..... He never would say how he was able to acquire tickets for any event on the planet...
> 
> ...


If your network is large enough (and touts rarely work solo), you'll always get a percentage. There's a company that ran an event I attended a few years ago, and the relationship manager was saying that they provided a broker service for businesses looking for tickets to large events. The businesses benefited from the lower costs (and the ease of getting tickets), but the company would quite often have deals with certain touts to offload the extras.

Also, some of the travel companies (there's one that often advertises in Boxing News) have deals with the promoters where, as Rob says, they split the additional profits.


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

Trippy said:


> I hope the happy clappers spouting the "You're not forced to buy it, so stop complaining" aren't also the type who complain about petrol prices or energy prices increasing. 'Cause you aren't forced to pay those either.


I don't have/need a car. Energy bills and transport is very cheap here.

Did Hearn actually say "I promise to deliver an amazing undercard"? No he said something like it needs a monster undercard. With a 'world' title, British, Commonwealth + Joshua and a title fight for Stephen Smith makes it the best PPV undercard since the Magnificent Seven. Over three years ago. Jamie McDonnell is meant to be on it too!

What standard would be acceptable to you? Are you not happy with the undercard or just feel its not as good as 'promised'?


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2013)

Lilo said:


> I don't have/need a car. Energy bills and transport is very cheap here.
> 
> Did Hearn actually say "I promise to deliver an amazing undercard"? No he said something like it needs a monster undercard. With a 'world' title, British, Commonwealth + Joshua and a title fight for Stephen Smith makes it the best PPV undercard since the Magnificent Seven. Over three years ago. Jamie McDonnell is meant to be on it too!
> 
> What standard would be acceptable to you? Are you not happy with the undercard or just feel its not as good as 'promised'?


He said it was gonna be one if the best cards ever seen.

For me you should have 5 title fights that are 60-40 at least and one of those has to be world level.


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> He said it was gonna be one if the best cards ever seen.
> 
> For me you should have 5 title fights that are 60-40 at least and one of those has to be world level.


Source?

Are we denying that his intention was to put on the best PPV card in recent history?

Froch vs Groves - WBA/IBF
Quigg vs Cermeno? - WBA
McDonnell vs Malinga - IBF

Smith vs Sykes - British
Gethin vs Crolla - British
Fielding vs Allen - Commonwealth

Joshua & Cardle


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2013)

Lilo said:


> Source?
> 
> Are we denying that his intention was to put on the best PPV card in recent history?
> 
> ...


it was in one of his ifilm interviews. he said people were going to be shocked by how good it was.

doesn't really matter what his intention was did it.

Smith & McDonnell need to be in serious fights. Unless they have already been set up I would shocked if they get anyone decent at 4 weeks notice.

Smith v Arash Usmane, Juan Carlos Saldado, Devis Boschiero, Sergio Thompson, Takahiro Ao, Marvin Honorio, Gamaliel Diaz or Will Tomlinson
McDonnell v Hugo Ruiz, Pungluang Sor Singyu, Ryosuke Iwasa, Julio Ceja II, Malcom Tunacao, Rolly Matsushita, Karim Guefri, Stephan Jamoye II, Lee Haskins II


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