# ЯED MIST: Nathan Cleverly vs Sergey Kovalev (WBO Light Heavyweight) Prediction Thread



## Guest (Aug 9, 2013)

*ЯED Mist: Nathan Cleverly vs Sergey Kovalev for the WBO Light Heavyweight title.*
Venue: Live from the Motorpoint Arena in Cardiff, Wale (7,500)
TV: BoxNation (UK) HBO (USA)
Undercard: Gary Buckland vs Stephen Smith (British Super Featherweight), Ovil McEnzie v Enzo Maccarinelli II (Commonwealth Light Heavyweight)










*Betting Odds:* (William Hill)

Nathan Cleverly 11/10
Sergey Kovalev 8/11 (Favorite)






*Nathan Cleverly *
Hometown: Cefn Forest, Wales, United Kingdom
Age:26
Height: 6′1½,ft
Reach: 74 Inch 
Pro Record: 26-0 (12KO's)
Am Record: 32-4
Pro Rounds: 171
Trainer: Vince Cleverly
Stance: Orthodox
Titles: Current WBO Light Heavyweight Champion (4 Defenses), Former European, British & Commonwealth Light Heavyweight Champion (6 Defenses)
CHB World Ranking: No.6
Other Rankings: Fightnews No.8, ESPN No.6, RING No.3, TBRB No.6, BoxRec No.10
Strengths: Stamina, Strengh, Speed, Durability
Weaknesses: Power, Tactics, Ring Generalship, Vince Cleverly










*Notable Wins*

Robin Krasniqi UD12 
Tony Bellew MD12
Karo Murat TKO10










*Sergey "Krusher" Kovalev*
Hometown: Chelyabinsk, Russia
Age: 30
Height: 6ft 
Reach: 72½
Pro Record: 21-0 (19KO's)
Am Record: 193-32
Pro Rounds: 57
Trainer: John David Jackson
Stance: Orthodox
World Ranking: WBO No.2 (WBA No.7)
CHB World Ranking: No.5
Other Rankings: Fightnews No.4, ESPN No.3, RING No.4, TBRB No.5, BoxRec No.5
Strengths: Power, Aggression
Weaknesses: Experience, One Paced










*Notable Wins*

Cornelius White TKO3
Gabriel Campillo TKO3
Darnell Boone TKO2


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## Guest (Aug 9, 2013)

@Grant


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## DrMo (Jun 6, 2012)

Goop OP Rob :good

Kovalev by TKO, but if it goes past 4 rounds then Clev stands a good chance.

Anyone else going to this?


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

Cleverly UD

Workrate, chin and more mature tactics will win it after negotiating a rocky first third. He'll get tagged early and then win with plan B.


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## Guest (Aug 9, 2013)

Lilo said:


> Cleverly UD
> 
> Workrate, chin and more mature tactics will win it after negotiating a rocky first third. He'll get tagged early and then win with plan B.


whats plan A and whats plan B?


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

I really can't split them.

The potential weakness for kovalev is throwing too much too early and failing to get cleverly out of there.however he is a good boxer in his own right and his strength and combos mean I think he can possibly confound opinion and be a success in the later rounds as well.

I wouldn't be suprised to see any outcome for either boxer but if pushed I will go that we see 12 rounds of a seesaw fight with one or both hurt and maybe dropped during the action,I will edge towards clev taking a slim but fair decision that propels his career.not so much Calzaghe Lacey more khan maidana

All in all it really could be a classic and the 2 main support bouts are excellent trade fights as well.

Could be British card of the year if it delivers.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Great stuff Rob.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Cleverly ud 

Think Clev will set a furious pace and test the Russians stamina, Clev has a great chin and I don't see Clev being floored even if he is tagged and this will test kovalevs heart. I see Clev fighting in bursts in and out quickly. The only way I see Clev losing is if he loses the head and starts standing and trading.

As mentioned good thread rob


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## the iron sheik (Jul 26, 2013)

Cleverly UD........think its going to be a pretty 50/50 fight early on with both guys having their moments and clev will no doubt have a few scares along the way but think Nathan will come on strong and bank the last 3/4 rounds......ITS GOING TO BE NASTY!


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

It's got makings of a special fight. It's a little like Benn vs McClellan in respects that Cleverly although the champion is being dismissed by a fair few and has that feeling that Kovalev is being brought over to bash him up. Cleverly is a tough kid and doesn't like to take a backwards step and this is why this fight is going to be so exciting. 

Both start fast although Kovalev is extremely aggressive and makes Cleverly look conservative in his approach to the opening exchanges. I can see Kovalev looking to get down to work as normal whilst Cleverly looks to get range and keep it with his jab and then combinations. I don't expect to see Cleverly doing what he did to Murat so early this time. I'd expect him to look to bully the bully but later on into proceedings this time. 

Kovalev is very focused and if you can check his face he's intense and seeking any chance to land and with him being light on his feet Nathan must make sure that every action has a reaction. A lazy jab will spring a Kovalev attack and Nathan must nullify his early work because as we know power punchers are notorious for hitting hardest early on. 

Kovalev is lighter on his feet and also he commits to his punches which shortens reaction time for counters and leverage for them. Cleverly often leans forward which doesn't allow him to see punches as well as well as limiting his counter punching and Cleverly's lack of movement in terms of his feet worries me. Kovalev creates angles for his punches which is one of his major qualities as he shoots straight, around, down and upwards with corkscrew uppercuts. Cleverly's defence has always been questionable and that's with one punch and with Kovalev throwing angled punches in 2's 3's and 4's Nathan's defensive issues are a major worry. 

Nathan does ship stupid punches and Kovalev at times only just lands and has people on queer street. 

For me Cleverly's key is to maintain long range, utilize the jab. I've noticed Sergey can be knocked off balance and forced back by a good jab and Nathan does have long arms and can jab well at times but was being outboxed by Bellew in rounds 3,4 & 5. Kovalev although committing to punches isn't a defensive minded fighter and will be hit by Cleverly because he's tall upright and isn't going to far. Cleverly can look to lead off and land to head and body. I'm intrigued to see what Kovalev is like in the later rounds as he puts a lot into punches and Cleverly is a like a energizer bunny he doesn't run out of life. Kovalev seems the type of guy you can overwhelm with punches if you can get off and are brave enough to throw. But it's when, where and how to get off without risking to much that bothers me with Nathan here. Cleverly is a athletic and fast handed fighter yet his boxing brain has never been shown. He's clearly talented but talent isn't enough..

I'm 50/50 because you could easily see Cleverly being stopped in middle rounds but you could see him standing tall and reigning more and more punches on Kovalev and the Russian falling away down the stretch due to fatigue and Cleverly's will being to much. There's also a lot of questions about Kovalev who's not had that gutcheck yet. The issue for me though is if Cleverly comes to go shootout with Kovalev he's going to have to rely on his chin and his volume. It's a dicey game to play and with Vince talking KO's i'm sensing a middle round stoppage for Kovalev.


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## Elliot (Jun 4, 2013)

Cleverly by decision, see it being very close for 8 rounds then Cleverly's workrate coming into effect late to pull clear.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Superb odds for Cleverly this fight. The bookies always go weak at the knees over a KO artist and it's one area they can get done over, especially in this case as they have completely overlooked WHO Kovalev has been sparking. The 3 notable wins given for each fighter in the OP indicate that Kovalev is being overrated and Cleverly underrated in the betting. 

Campillo is being held up as proof of Kov's power but Campillo had already been KO'd prior to Kovalev and is most notable for a disputed points loss to Cloud who put in a pathetic performance against a nigh on 50 yr old. Campillo was also way off kilter going into the Kovalev fight. Kovalev KO'd White in 2 rounds but White had already been KO'd in 1 round by an absolute nobody prior to this. Similarly, Boone has lost more fights than he's won (21 losses) and had also been KO'd in 1 round prior to Kovalev.

The relatively unexposed nature of Kovalev's power means it has skewed the betting in this fight, which means a nice a little earner on the hometown win.


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## Post Box (Jun 7, 2012)

Cleverly either attempts to put the pressure on Kovalev early and walks onto something big with his porous defence or boxes off the back foot and lasts abit longer before he succumbs to the power of Kovalev. I just don't think he's good enough to outbox his man for the full 12


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

Kovalev by KO. 
Cleverly stopped on his feet by the 4th.


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## Indigo Pab (May 31, 2012)

"Red Mist" falls far short of both "Clevalev" _and_ "Kovaclev" as a tagline.

Poor promotion.


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## Guest (Aug 10, 2013)

Canastota said:


> Superb odds for Cleverly this fight. The bookies always go weak at the knees over a KO artist and it's one area they can get done over, especially in this case as they have completely overlooked WHO Kovalev has been sparking. The 3 notable wins given for each fighter in the OP indicate that Kovalev is being overrated and Cleverly underrated in the betting.
> 
> Campillo is being held up as proof of Kov's power but Campillo had already been KO'd prior to Kovalev and is most notable for a disputed points loss to Cloud who put in a pathetic performance against a nigh on 50 yr old. Campillo was also way off kilter going into the Kovalev fight. Kovalev KO'd White in 2 rounds but White had already been KO'd in 1 round by an absolute nobody prior to this. Similarly, Boone has lost more fights than he's won (21 losses) and had also been KO'd in 1 round prior to Kovalev.
> 
> The relatively unexposed nature of Kovalev's power means it has skewed the betting in this fight, which means a nice a little earner on the hometown win.


You have done a good job at trying to pick apart Kovalevs record. With Cleverlys you just need to read it. He has one convincing win over a decent fighter.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> You have done a good job at trying to pick apart Kovalevs record. With Cleverlys you just need to read it. He has one convincing win over a decent fighter.


So does Kovalev in Campillo and I don't rate Campillo that much. Am not saying Kovalev isn't the real deal but from his record I don't know yet - at least I can't tell from the people he has walked through thus far. This fight will tell us.

Am not bigging up Cleverly whilst doing that, but Kovalev is the favourite with the bookies primarily based on his KO record. So who he's been knocking out is going to come under more scrutiny before you stick your money down on this one.


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## Guest (Aug 10, 2013)

Canastota said:


> So does Kovalev in Campillo and I don't rate Campillo that much. Am not saying Kovalev isn't the real deal but from his record I don't know yet - at least I can't tell from the people he has walked through thus far. This fight will tell us.
> 
> Am not bigging up Cleverly whilst doing that, but Kovalev is the favourite with the bookies primarily based on his KO record. So who he's been knocking out is going to come under more scrutiny before you stick your money down on this one.


Kovalev has looked more impressive beating a simular level of opposition. Thats why he is the favourite.

I think you can see in the fights that Kovalev is a better all round fighter.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Kovalev has looked more impressive beating a simular level of opposition. Thats why he is the favourite.
> 
> I think you can see in the fights that Kovalev is a better all round fighter.


Wasn't this the first fight of our bet rob.

And Ryder-Saunders

Both are good matches and this could definately go either way.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Kovalev has looked more impressive beating a simular level of opposition. Thats why he is the favourite.
> 
> I think you can see in the fights that Kovalev is a better all round fighter.


Kovalev has definitely looked more efficient but I think Cleverly has been in with slightly tougher opposition more often. For instance with regard to the 3 notable wins for each fighter on the OP, I rate Bellew, Murat and Krasniqi above Campillo, White and Boone. Boone and White are extremely poor and Campillo had issues going into that fight and had a previous KO. Campillo has a pal who's worked with Clev in the build up to this and they both favour Cleverly.

Clev's been careless in fights but his progress up until Bellew was very good, although he should've beaten Bellew more convincingly if Vince hadn't been in his ear. That's where Dean Powell is important next Saturday. There's no doubt the last year and a half have got Cleverly down and based on his last 3 outings I'd favour Kovalev myself too. That's why it's a fight Cleverly needs.


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## Guest (Aug 10, 2013)

Canastota said:


> Kovalev has definitely looked more efficient but I think Cleverly has been in with slightly tougher opposition more often. For instance with regard to the 3 notable wins for each fighter on the OP, I rate Bellew, Murat and Krasniqi above Campillo, White and Boone. Boone and White are extremely poor and Campillo had issues going into that fight and had a previous KO. Campillo has a pal who's worked with Clev in the build up to this and they both favour Cleverly.
> 
> Clev's been careless in fights but his progress up until Bellew was very good, although he should've beaten Bellew more convincingly if Vince hadn't been in his ear. That's where Dean Powell is important next Saturday. There's no doubt the last year and a half have got Cleverly down and based on his last 3 outings I'd favour Kovalev myself too. That's why it's a fight Cleverly needs.


Campillo & White had better resumes than Murat & Bellew when the fights happend.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Campillo & White had better resumes than Murat & Bellew when the fights happend.


No quite the opposite actually. White had already been knocked out in 1 round by a nobody before he fought Kovalev and Campillo had already lost 4 times including a KO defeat before ole Krusher got hold of him.

On the other hand Murat was undefeated when he fought Cleverly and that loss remains Murat's only defeat. Bellew was also undefeated when he fought Cleverly and that remains Bellew's only defeat.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Canastota said:


> No quite the opposite actually. White had already been knocked out in 1 round by a nobody before he fought Kovalev and Campillo had already lost 4 times including a KO defeat before ole Krusher got hold of him.
> 
> On the other hand Murat was undefeated when he fought Cleverly and that loss remains Murat's only defeat. Bellew was also undefeated when he fought Cleverly and that remains Bellew's only defeat.


Spot on.

Cornelius white is far from a test that an aspiring world champion should fall back on to prove his quality.bellew and Murat would beat white In my opinion and krazniqi and karpency probaly aren't too far behind him.


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## Guest (Aug 10, 2013)

Canastota said:


> No quite the opposite actually. White had already been knocked out in 1 round by a nobody before he fought Kovalev and Campillo had already lost 4 times including a KO defeat before ole Krusher got hold of him.
> 
> On the other hand Murat was undefeated when he fought Cleverly and that loss remains Murat's only defeat. Bellew was also undefeated when he fought Cleverly and that remains Bellew's only defeat.


you need to actually watch fights and not read boxrec.

Campillo beat Murat twice in the eyes of anybody apart from Murats mum and 3 judges.


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## Guest (Aug 10, 2013)

One to watch said:


> Spot on.
> 
> Cornelius white is far from a test that an aspiring world champion should fall back on to prove his quality.bellew and Murat would beat white In my opinion and krazniqi and karpency probaly aren't too far behind him.


white had just won every round v Sukhotsky who has sparked Mohameddi in 2......who Clev looks shit against over 12 rounds.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> you need to actually watch fights and not read boxrec.
> 
> Campillo beat Murat twice in the eyes of anybody apart from Murats mum and 3 judges.


Why do you come back with a response like that? I can assure you I watch plenty of fights, frequently at the venue. Your statement has nothing to do with your previous post in which you stated White and Campillo both had better records when they fought Kovalev than Murat and Bellew did when they fought Cleverly.

Campillo had already suffered a KO loss before he'd even fought Murat; this being the same Murat that Cleverly had already battered and stopped and thus underlining that Kovalev's win over Campillo isn't all that it's cracked up to be

Your reply is completely irrelevant; no need to consult boxrec to figure that out.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

I think it's better if you lads break the fight down and give reasons for who you think will win. We can pick to pieces near on every fighter in history of the sports record so this debate could go on till next Saturday..

Must say Campillo seems to be horribly underrated by some. Good fighter who beat Cloud with ease after a bad first round.


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## Lunny (May 31, 2012)

Can't wait for this. I've got Kovalev KO but whatever the outcome someone's stock is gonna be sky high in my eyes.


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

On the scene kovalevs camp seem very confident


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## Guest (Aug 11, 2013)

Scorpio78 said:


> On the scene kovalevs camp seem very confident


You can post links to the scene here.

http://www.boxingscene.com/kovalevs-trainer-sergey-school-nathan-cleverly--68514


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Kovalevs trainer is spot on.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> white had just won every round v Sukhotsky who has sparked Mohameddi in 2......who Clev looks shit against over 12 rounds.


Rob the only reason I find it hard to take some of your summary a seriously is what I perceive to be bias on your part.
Lets have a look at a few of the British fighters you seem to think are overrated.

Frankie Gavin
Billy joe Saunders
Nathan cleverly
Ricky burns

There's a common theme running through there that I find hard to ignore.if you don't like warren fair enough but it's not his fighters fault what he gets up to.


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## Vano-irons (Jun 6, 2012)

I had when people read Boxrec like it's a given. Saying Campillo lost 4 times is a massive cop out when he clearly beat Murat and Cloud


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Vano-irons said:


> I had when people read Boxrec like it's a given. Saying Campillo lost 4 times is a massive cop out when he clearly beat Murat and Cloud


Yeah I use boxrec for valuable information on fights that went under the radar and to check a fighters cv but its naive to presume scorecards given are a fair reflection of a fight.
There are many others like campillo who's records don't do them justice.


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## MrBiggerthan (Jun 4, 2013)

Kovalev just has too much power and too much variety to his attack, and Cleverly is far too easy to hit...for this to be anything other than a stoppage victory for Kovalev.
Unless Cleverly is more difficult to hit than ever before and finds some power, this is going to be too much for him.

Kovalev stoppage under 7 rounds.


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## Hooch (Jun 18, 2013)

Bill said:


> Kovalevs trainer is spot on.


Really? I thought it was absoloute bollocks myself.

"Its hard to rank Cleverly because he has had no us exposure" what the fuck does that mean? He must be shit cos he is based in Britain. Is Kovalev hard to rank cos he aint been beating the best over here?

You may agree with his assessment of the fight but the rest was ignorant shite.


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## Hooch (Jun 18, 2013)

MrBiggerthan said:


> Kovalev just has too much power and too much variety to his attack, and Cleverly is far too easy to hit...for this to be anything other than a stoppage victory for Kovalev.
> Unless Cleverly is more difficult to hit than ever before and finds some power, this is going to be too much for him.
> 
> Kovalev stoppage under 7 rounds.


Pretty much how I see it. Hope we are both wrong and Nathan has more than he has shown in the past.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Hooch said:


> Really? I thought it was absoloute bollocks myself.
> 
> "Its hard to rank Cleverly because he has had no us exposure" what the fuck does that mean? He must be shit cos he is based in Britain. Is Kovalev hard to rank cos he aint been beating the best over here?
> 
> You may agree with his assessment of the fight but the rest was ignorant shite.


I agree that Cleverly despite his paper title is a no mark on the world scene not, just the U'S, nobody does know who he is and that includes the majority of Brits.


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## Royal-T-Bag (Jun 5, 2013)

campillo is ba much better fighterb than cleverly but clevs style is a more diffficult style match up for kovalev. still got kovalev by ko. i expect him to be king of LHW now that Dawson's done for


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Bill said:


> I agree that Cleverly despite his paper title is a no mark on the world scene not, just the U'S, nobody does know who he is and that includes the majority of Brits.


You must be just about ready to implode with excitement at the thought of Clev being sparked out cold, which I don't will happen Bill but I sort of want it too as it would no doubt make your year mate.


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> You can post links to the scene here.
> 
> http://www.boxingscene.com/kovalevs-trainer-sergey-school-nathan-cleverly--68514


old habbits


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Stunkie said:


> You must be just about ready to implode with excitement at the thought of Clev being sparked out cold, which I don't will happen Bill but I sort of want it too as it would no doubt make your year mate.


:lol: Providing he's healthy afterwards, I would be lying if I said I didn't want to see him sparked, It could be the best thing to ever happen to him as It might teach him to be humble.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Bill said:


> :lol: Providing he's healthy afterwards, I would be lying if I said I didn't want to see him sparked, It could be the best thing to ever happen to him as It might teach him to be humble.


What happens if Clev puts in a great performance and wins well, would your opinion of him change or would you still consider him a cunt? Obviously in the immediate aftermath you would be to busy dusting off your Basshunter CDs, so I thought I had best ask you now for clarification. :lol:


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Stunkie said:


> What happens if Clev puts in a great performance and wins well, would your opinion of him change or would you still consider him a cunt? Obviously in the immediate aftermath you would be to busy dusting off your Basshunter CDs, so I thought I had best ask you now for clarification. :lol:


I'd give him his due respect but will always think he's a cunt. I just don't like him.


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## Vano-irons (Jun 6, 2012)

One to watch said:


> Yeah I use boxrec for valuable information on fights that went under the radar and to check a fighters cv but its naive to presume scorecards given are a fair reflection of a fight.
> There are many others like campillo who's records don't do them justice.


:deal like Carlos Molina for instance


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Royal-T-Bag said:


> campillo is ba much better fighterb than cleverly


:lol::lol::lol:



Bill said:


> :lol: Providing he's healthy afterwards, I would be lying if I said I didn't want to see him sparked, It could be the best thing to ever happen to him as It might teach him to be humble.


Know him do u ?


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Canastota said:


> :lol::lol::lol:
> 
> Know him do u ?


Only on camera and I think he's a prick, maybe he is a good lad in real life? But then my question would be, why go out of your way to be a prick to the masses when its not really you?

So I suspect he's a jobsworth prick in real life.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Bill said:


> Only on camera and I think he's a prick, maybe he is a good lad in real life? But then my question would be, why go out of your way to be a prick to the masses when its not really you?
> 
> So I suspect he's a jobsworth prick in real life.


Well he isn't - nowhere near the mark. That's what I don't get. I know you're a fair poster so don't understand where Clev has got this high handed rep from. I know Bellew was posting elsewhere which turned a lot of people against Clev and also Frank has never exactly been flavour of the month so Cleverly had certain things against him. But even so he's just a workin class lad; I dunno if the degree is goin against him but he's never bigged himself up more than anyone else has. In fact, quite the opposite. And in saying that boxers have press releases go out on their behalf without never having said a word on them.

If he ditches the bandana and basshunter he's doing ok .


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Canastota said:


> Well he isn't - nowhere near the mark. That's what I don't get. I know you're a fair poster so don't understand where Clev has got this high handed rep from. I know Bellew was posting elsewhere which turned a lot of people against Clev and also Frank has never exactly been flavour of the month so Cleverly had certain things against him. But even so he's just a workin class lad; I dunno if the degree is goin against him but he's never bigged himself up more than anyone else has. In fact, quite the opposite. And in saying that boxers have press releases go out on their behalf without never having said a word on them.
> 
> If he ditches the bandana and basshunter he's doing ok .


To be fair I don't know him and he could well be a good lad but there are a few instances where he really grated me, he gave an interview once moaning about fans not wanting to see easy defences any more, which was just plain wrong, people pay money to watch him fight they should at least expect competitiveness especially if he calls himself ''world champion'' which is in itself wrong when you consider his run of opponents, you could argue that's Franks fault but Cleverly didn't have to take those fights.

Then there's the cringy showboating, I can't stand it when any fighter does it but Cleverly really takes the biscuit for some reason, I think he comes across arrogant and has a sense of I'm better than everyone and the fans can go fuck, he is taking a risk in his next fight and gets respect for that, although he should have been fighting these type of opponents when he first got handed the belt. Last but not least it's his hairband, what the fuck is he thinking? Any man that's not from south american or an Asian background that wears them, have sexuality issues and unnatural urges.


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## Guest (Aug 11, 2013)

One to watch said:


> Rob the only reason I find it hard to take some of your summary a seriously is what I perceive to be bias on your part.
> Lets have a look at a few of the British fighters you seem to think are overrated.
> 
> Frankie Gavin
> ...


I rate Frankie Gavin very very highly. Ricky Burns is with Hearn......theres a ton of other Hearn fighters I dont rate. Whats your point?


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Bill said:


> To be fair I don't know him and he could well be a good lad but there are a few instances where he really grated me, he gave an interview once moaning about fans not wanting to see easy defences any more, which was just plain wrong, people pay money to watch him fight they should at least expect competitiveness especially if he calls himself ''world champion'' which is in itself wrong when you consider his run of opponents, you could argue that's Franks fault but Cleverly didn't have to take those fights.
> 
> Then there's the cringy showboating, I can't stand it when any fighter does it but Cleverly really takes the biscuit for some reason, I think he comes across arrogant and has a sense of I'm better than everyone and the fans can go fuck, he is taking a risk in his next fight and gets respect for that, although he should have been fighting these type of opponents when he first got handed the belt. Last but not least it's his hairband, what the fuck is he thinking? Any man that's not from south american or an Asian background that wears them, have sexuality issues and unnatural urges.


No issue with the hairband - it has to go. A lot of the other stuff has been out of his control though and with the Burns fiasco Cleverly has been tarred with the same brush that was wafting over Warren.

Dispacthing Kovalev, who commentators said would never be voluntarily faced by a champion, will hopefully redress some of the negtatives of the last couple of years though.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Canastota said:


> No issue with the hairband - it has to go. A lot of the other stuff has been out of his control though and with the Burns fiasco Cleverly has been tarred with the same brush that was wafting over Warren.
> 
> Dispacthing Kovalev, who commentators said would never be voluntarily be faced by a champion, will hopefully redress some of the negtatives of the last couple of years though.


If he beat's Kovalev he will get a ton of respect and would make people take note of his boxing and not his dreadful dress sense, If he does win then I don't want him to go back to his previous level of opponents either, he has to build on it and continue to change public perception.


----------



## Guest (Aug 11, 2013)

@Canastota how can you laugh at people saying Campillo is better than Cleverly.

He has wins over Murat & Shumenov twice, Cloud & Garay. You talk about a KO loss from 6 years ago to a good fighter!


----------



## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

I don't mean to talk down about Campillo cos he's a really top fella and I hope he gets some rewards from here on in. But when somebody comes out and says he's better than Cleverly then that just isn't right. I'm not saying Campillo doesn't have sound fundamentals etc etc but he doesn't cut it when stepped up no matter what the disputed losses.

Even if the losses were disputed against Murat well then Murat is somebody Cleverly gave a one sided battering to and stopped. Cloud also put in a woeful showing against Hopkins and nobody really knows his actual worth either. The guy who KO'd Campillo is also far from being a good fighter. 

Anyways, didn't mean to go back into these debates about the merits of who beat who but I'm a betting man and I can say from experience these things matter when the bookies suddenly fall in love with KO merchant. This is the first REAL test of Kov's power as himself and Clev are different but quite well matched in other aspects so it's actually a fairly tricky one to be certain of. Which means it's one to look forward to.


----------



## Guest (Aug 11, 2013)

Canastota said:


> I don't mean to talk down about Campillo cos he's a really top fella and I hope he gets some rewards from here on in. But when somebody comes out and says he's better than Cleverly then that just isn't right. I'm not saying Campillo doesn't have sound fundamentals etc etc but he doesn't cut it when stepped up no matter what the disputed losses.
> 
> Even if the losses were disputed against Murat well then Murat is somebody Cleverly gave a one sided battering to and stopped. Cloud also put in a woeful showing against Hopkins and nobody really knows his actual worth either. The guy who KO'd Campillo is also far from being a good fighter.
> 
> Anyways, didn't mean to go back into these debates about the merits of who beat who but I'm a betting man and I can say from experience these things matter when the bookies suddenly fall in love with KO merchant. This is the first REAL test of Kov's power as himself and Clev are different but quite well matched in other aspects so it's actually a fairly tricky one to be certain of. Which means it's one to look forward to.


Cleverly barley got past Tony Bellew who got knocked down agaisnt McEznie & Ajisafe!

The gap between Campillo & Cleverly is not big. Campillo is the best win on either mans records.

I don't agree they are well matched in other aspects. Kovalev is better in almost every department.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> I rate Frankie Gavin very very highly. Ricky Burns is with Hearn......theres a ton of other Hearn fighters I dont rate. Whats your point?


I know burns is with Hearn but you can hardly turn around and change your attitude with him now.burns was a world champion and flag bearer for warren promotions as is cleverly.

You rate frankie Gavin very very highly but you predicted Denton vassel would beat him.thats not rating him highly in my opinion.

It just seems that warrens 'crown jewels' aren't rated by you and with your constant sniping at warren that can't be a coincidence.
You don't want him to do well which means his fighters not doing well or boxnation doing well.forget matchroom for now.

An I right?


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## Guest (Aug 11, 2013)

One to watch said:


> I know burns is with Hearn but you can hardly turn around and change your attitude with him now.burns was a world champion and flag bearer for warren promotions as is cleverly.
> 
> You rate frankie Gavin very very highly but you predicted Denton vassel would beat him.thats not rating him highly in my opinion.
> 
> ...


I have always praised and defended ricky burns run at lightweight. its only been since the gonzalez fight i questioned his ability at the top level.....so since he signed with hearn. the vassell fight answered allot of questions.

no....you are wrong.


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

Rob - you don't rate Gavin very, very highly at all. You constantly slate him! If you rate him so high what do you rate Vassell then!


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## Guest (Aug 11, 2013)

Lilo said:


> Rob - you don't rate Gavin very, very highly at all. You constantly slate him! If you rate him so high what do you rate Vassell then!


I had two main questions about Frankie Gavin.

1. Can he keep his shit together for more than a few months?
2. Is he able to compete with genuinely big Welterweights?

I think they were fair questions to ask and I thought the answer to both would be No. Frankie Gavin proved me wrong, happy to admit that. He hasn't short circuited for a good 18months and he proved he can handle a big welterweight in Vassell who I think is european level.

Since the Vassell win I haven't said anything negative about Gavin. I still think had he lived better between the age of 16-26 he could comfortably be at a lower weight and do bette

So to be clear I rate Frankie Gavin and think he will become a world champion and more....and this is before he signs with Hearn in a few months. lol


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

rob only rates gavin now because of the big rumours of him jumping ship to eddie later this year


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Scorpio78 said:


> rob only rates gavin now because of the big rumours of him jumping ship to eddie later this year


This was my suspicion but I didn't want to keep going on,now you have mentioned it I don't mind.

Definately against any fighter under the frank warren banner being a success.


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## Guest (Aug 11, 2013)

One to watch said:


> This was my suspicion but I didn't want to keep going on,now you have mentioned it I don't mind.
> 
> Definately against any fighter under the frank warren banner being a success.


Thats complete and utter bullshit.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Who voted Cleverly stoppage by the way?


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## sim_reiss (Jun 6, 2012)

Bill said:


> Who voted Cleverly stoppage by the way?


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

sim_reiss said:


>


Hahaha


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

sim_reiss said:


>


Hahhahahahahahaha epic! Bill! Look at those fucking shades :lol:


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## Guest (Aug 11, 2013)

sim_reiss said:


>


Suprised nobody has noticed I listed Vince as a weakness yet!


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

sim_reiss said:


>


:lol: I can see who Nathan gets his dress sense from, poor kid never had a chance really.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Anybody else suspect that Vince has a 70's long haired wig with a sparkly suit and is a regular at Bee Gee's tribute act concerts?


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## Marvelous Marv (Jun 30, 2012)

```

```
I don't think the 1 guy that voted Clev stoppage can be completely dismissed. He's probably sensed that this could be an energy sapping fight if it goes into the latter stages. Clev's been pretty one dimensional of late, and Kovalev is definitely going to be looking to let a lot of heavy artillery go. It could be one of those fights where somebody wilts late on if Clev doesn't get taken out earlyish. I'm not expecting any miracle punches out of Cleverly but a late stoppage isn't too fanciful, it should be seriously considered as a very real possibility if not a probability.


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## sim_reiss (Jun 6, 2012)

Marvelous Marv said:


> ```
> 
> ```
> I don't think the 1 guy that voted Clev stoppage can be completely dismissed. He's probably sensed that this could be an energy sapping fight if it goes into the latter stages. Clev's been pretty one dimensional of late, and Kovalev is definitely going to be looking to let a lot of heavy artillery go. It could be one of those fights where somebody wilts late on if Clev doesn't get taken out earlyish. I'm not expecting any miracle punches out of Cleverly but a late stoppage isn't too fanciful, it should be seriously considered as a very real possibility if not a probability.


Good post. It's not fanciful to suggest a guy who's only been more than three rounds three times might get worn out come 10, 11, 12...it's just the small matter of Nathan taking him there...


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## Roy Jones Jr's Jab (Jun 4, 2013)

As much as I dislike Clev......I think he is getting stopped.


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## Guest (Aug 12, 2013)

Roy Jones Jr's Jab said:


> As much as I dislike Clev......I think he is getting stopped.


LOL!


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Bellew ranting on Twitter that Kovalev is not a threat.

Not surprising really.


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

Grant said:


> Bellew ranting on Twitter that Kovalev is not a threat.
> 
> Not surprising really.


Coming across as a bitter, bitter man. Kovalev would probably beat Stevenson who is now massively overrated due to one punch over a weak(ened) champion.


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## Marlow (Jan 6, 2013)

Running order for this yet?


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Marlow said:


> Running order for this yet?


On Clevs website.


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## Marlow (Jan 6, 2013)

Grant said:


> On Clevs website.


Cheers.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

Lilo said:


> Coming across as a bitter, bitter man. Kovalev would probably beat Stevenson who is now massively overrated due to one punch over a weak(ened) champion.


Suprised so many back Cleverly but think Bellew will get KO'd


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Suprised so many back Cleverly but think Bellew will get KO'd


Well the poll is slightly in Kovalev's favour which reflects it being a 50/50. I don't think many people are adamant on a particular outcome (aside from you perhaps).

It's all fine margins but I think Bellew could struggle with a big, strong, bruising puncher. Clev has proven his chin is better than Bellew's and TBF Clev is simply better than Bellew (not by much admittedly). Personally I think Clev will go life and death (esp early doors) but come out on top due to his chin and stamina; whereas Bellew doesn't have these strengths so may well lose IMO.


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)




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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Marvelous Marv said:


> I don't think the 1 guy that voted Clev stoppage can be completely dismissed. He's probably sensed that this could be an energy sapping fight if it goes into the latter stages. Clev's been pretty one dimensional of late, and Kovalev is definitely going to be looking to let a lot of heavy artillery go. It could be one of those fights where somebody wilts late on if Clev doesn't get taken out earlyish. I'm not expecting any miracle punches out of Cleverly but a late stoppage isn't too fanciful, it should be seriously considered as a very real possibility if not a probability.


The only time anyone has put anything on Kovalev as a pro was Boone in the first fight and he was on the floor there and glad it was only an 8 rounder. Be interesting to see if his durability has come on if it goes further


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## On the Money (Jun 10, 2013)

Kovalev looks a beast but Cleverly is a step up for him. Classic puncher vs boxer maybe.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

Canastota said:


> The only time anyone has put anything on Kovalev as a pro was Boone in the first fight and he was on the floor there and glad it was only an 8 rounder. Be interesting to see if his durability has come on if it goes further


Cleverly couldn't stop Tommy Karpency!


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

On the Money said:


> Kovalev looks a beast but Cleverly is a step up for him. Classic puncher vs boxer maybe.


Except Kovalev is the boxer and the puncher.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Cleverly couldn't stop Tommy Karpency!


Nobody seems to be raising the issue of Kovalev's chin. Good job it seems the fight will be over before feather fists Cleverly gets at it then!


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

Canastota said:


> Nobody seems to be raising the issue of Kovalev's chin. Good job it seems the fight will be over before feather fists Cleverly gets at it then!


Good prediction.


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Good prediction.


Can't tell much from Kovalev's pro fights as they've all just crumbled in front of him apart from when Boone put it on him in their first fight. So most people haven't seen what happens when even a relatively light puncher lands flush on him.

Saw some of Kovalev's amateur fights from the year before he turned pro the other day tho.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

Canastota said:


> Can't tell much from Kovalev's pro fights as they've all just crumbled in front of him apart from when Boone put it on him in their first fight. So most people haven't seen what happens when even a relatively light puncher lands flush on him.
> 
> Saw some of Kovalev's amateur fights from the year before he turned pro the other day tho.


Have you watched the first Boone fight? I can't find it online or even find a fight report.

Are you picking Cleverly?


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Have you watched the first Boone fight? I can't find it online or even find a fight report.
> 
> Are you picking Cleverly?


Not seen the first Boone fight but was told Kovalev was knackered at the end after being put down in the 7th and fortunate to get the split. A guy who covered it confirmed that to me as I'd not read much more than the likes of this myself:

http://www.boxingnews24.com/2010/10/kovalev-decisions-boone/

But was suprised to learn that Kovalev got sparked in 1 round in 2008 by Atoev who stayed amateur but went down to middleweight afterwards. He was a double world amateur champ but it still doesn't speak well of Kovalev's toughness. Kovalev looks a good fighter to me but then he has set the pace to every pro fight bar one - that being the first Boone fight in which it seems he struggled badly by all accounts.

My money's on Cleverly. If Kovalev is as powerful as he's being cracked up to be he'll have to prove his chin though.


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## Marvelous Marv (Jun 30, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Cleverly couldn't stop Tommy Karpency!


So what, that ain't the be all and end all. Based on that it would be easy to say Cleverley has no right to expect a stoppage against a Murat either, who is fairly tough. But it shows that in a tough, close quarters, high intensity fight it can happen whether somebody gasses, gets beat up or gets pulled out, it can happen multiple different ways.

The one punch power isn't so crucial in forcing a stoppage if both guys are willing to fight at a high intensity, and this fight looks very much like that at the outset considering the styles.

The advantage Kovalev has of course is he may have the power to end it in one punch or the consistent power to break Cleverley apart, whereas Clev's chances only come from the latter.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

Canastota said:


> Not seen the first Boone fight but was told Kovalev was knackered at the end after being put down in the 7th and fortunate to get the split. A guy who covered it confirmed that to me as I'd not read much more than the likes of this myself:
> 
> http://www.boxingnews24.com/2010/10/kovalev-decisions-boone/
> 
> ...


I think allot of people think that I am over rating Kovalev going into this fight, but its actually that I rate Cleverly as such a poor fighter, that I think any decent fighter will beat him, and any decent fighter with power will stop him.

Cleverly is so technically and tactically poor. He fights in the Joe Calzaghe style but he doesn't have the speed or the stature to pull it off. I don't think he has any real punching power to command respect from a decent level of fighter.

Kovalevs might not have faced anybody decent coming through (I disagree with that but for the sake of this conversation) but I have seen enough from him to think he is good enough to beat Cleverly.

I think when people talk about amateur fights of Kovalevs and the first Boone fight they are clutching at straws slightly. It was 3 years and 12 fights ago. A fighter based in the US will have come on along way since then.

Kovalevs flaws are what ifs. What if he has a weak chin, what if he can't do 12 rounds. Cleverlys weak points are glaringly obvious upon every viewing. No defense, no power, no jab, technically poor.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

Marvelous Marv said:


> So what, that ain't the be all and end all. Based on that it would be easy to say Cleverley has no right to expect a stoppage against a Murat either, who is fairly tough. But it shows that in a tough, close quarters, high intensity fight it can happen whether somebody gasses, gets beat up or gets pulled out, it can happen multiple different ways.
> 
> The one punch power isn't so crucial in forcing a stoppage if both guys are willing to fight at a high intensity, and this fight looks very much like that at the outset considering the styles.
> 
> The advantage Kovalev has of course is he may have the power to end it in one punch or the consistent power to break Cleverley apart, whereas Clev's chances only come from the latter.


Didn't Murat get a cut, thats why the fight was stopped?


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

If you do go off the Boone and amateur KO1 defeats then it suggests that high work rate and a solid chin are required to beat Kov though.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

Lilo said:


> If you do go off the Boone and amateur KO1 defeats then it suggests that high work rate and a solid chin are required to beat Kov though.


Does it?

Lets remember Darnell Boone put Andre Ward on the canvas and people thought he was unlucky, and he stopped Adonis Stevenson.


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Does it?
> 
> Lets remember Darnell Boone put Andre Ward on the canvas and people thought he was unlucky, and he stopped Adonis Stevenson.


Yes. Your chin gets you through the early assault and your stamina/high pace gasses him out.

Boone got stopped in 1 by Periban in his next fight. The Ward fight was 5 years prior.


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## Marvelous Marv (Jun 30, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Didn't Murat get a cut, thats why the fight was stopped?


I remember him getting a pasting and looking gassed, that's about it, but the point was that was a close quarters slugfest and regardless of Cleverley not having the one punch power to really shake up Murat ordinarily, he certainly did shake him up on accumulation and pushed his durability to the limit. That being the case its not really important anyway because you're much more likely to sustain a bad cut from a punch in an active, aggressive fight compared to two outboxers attempting to get the better of each other. Throw that into the mix and its another small part of the chance that makes up Cleverley stopping Kovalev.

If Cleverley wins this I only make the PTS likelihood about 65% and stoppage 35%, I don't see the dramatic difference the bookies have between PTS and a stoppage This is going to be a very, very tough fight if Kovalev does not stop Cleverly early or dominate in some way. I don't really see two skillsets that can put on a boxing clinic and avoid that. Even if Cleverley or for some reason Kovalev came out cautiously they are both getting hit and its a massive stretch to see them sticking to it.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2013)

Lilo said:


> Yes. Your chin gets you through the early assault and your stamina/high pace gasses him out.
> 
> Boone got stopped in 1 by Periban in his next fight. The Ward fight was 5 years prior.


He has stopped Adonis Stevenson 6 months prior. The Boone fight was 3 years ago for Kovalev and he has stopped him in in 2 since. Stevenson went 6 rounds with Boone 6 months later in there rematch.

I personally think Chin is irrelevant against an accurate A+ puncher, but either way Cleverly leaves enough openings that he is susceptible to a KO at any point in the fight.


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## Lilo (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> He has stopped Adonis Stevenson 6 months prior. The Boone fight was 3 years ago for Kovalev and he has stopped him in in 2 since. Stevenson went 6 rounds with Boone 6 months later in there rematch.
> 
> I personally think Chin is irrelevant against an accurate A+ puncher, but either way Cleverly leaves enough openings that he is susceptible to a KO at any point in the fight.


Clev is far better than Boone.

Surprised at how adamant - you seem unwilling to give Clev any chance whatsoever whereas most see it as 50/50ish. What chance do you give him? The bookies are now almost identical (for what they're worth).


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## Scotty (Jun 6, 2012)

Cleverly 10-1 rds 7-12. 
Decent odds considering Sergey has never been past 8 and has only 60 odd rounds as a pro.


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

Lilo said:


> Clev is far better than Boone.
> 
> Surprised at how adamant - you seem unwilling to give Clev any chance whatsoever whereas most see it as 50/50ish. What chance do you give him? The bookies are now almost identical (for what they're worth).


5%. I just cannot see how Cleverly wins this fight based on everything I have seen from him. To win he has to do stuff we have never seen him do before in the ring, not just that, do stuff that he hasn't even shown signs of doing before. Its not even me not rating Cleverly, because I would fancy him to have a shot against somebody like Hopkins. I just think anybody that can genuinely punch will beat him.

If Cleverly wins on Saturday I will look like a twat and people will be bringing it up for bloody ever like they have never got a pick wrong, and I will hand my head in shame an accept it. But I just cannot see it happening. I just don't see how Cleverly can go from being a tactically inept, fundamentally flawed fighter with very little power that leaves himself open for counters all day.

Another suggestion is that Cleverly will survive the early onslaught and his stamina will pull him through and Kovalev will gas. There is nothing to show that Kovalev will gas, he barley looked like he came out of 2nd gear when he stopped White & Campillo. Secondly we have no idea how Cleverlys stamina will be effected by taking a number of hard shots from an accurate power puncher. We haven't seen Cleverly fight at a fast pace for 12 rounds against guys that don't really fight back. Look at the punch stats in the Bellew fight, they were allot lower than in other Cleverly fights because he was getting hit.

Also I am surprised at how many knowledgeable posters have mentioned Cleverlys chin. Are they making the assumption that Kovalev is just a puncher, that would be wrong. Also since when has having a good chin been such an important attribute.

Kovalev is too accurate and too powerful, and Cleverly is top open and to reckless.


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## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> He has stopped Adonis Stevenson 6 months prior. The Boone fight was 3 years ago for Kovalev and he has stopped him in in 2 since. Stevenson went 6 rounds with Boone 6 months later in there rematch.
> 
> I personally think Chin is irrelevant against an accurate A+ puncher, but either way Cleverly leaves enough openings that he is susceptible to a KO at any point in the fight.


What if an A+ puncher is punching someone with an A+ Chin??? The power to chin ratio is a shady subject. Most are just assuming that Kovs power will win ( not knocking his boxing skills) as you have stated hes got A+ punching power. At present Kov cracking Clevs chin is all subjective.


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

DaveyBoyEssexUK said:


> What if an A+ puncher is punching someone with an A+ Chin??? The power to chin ratio is a shady subject. Most are just assuming that Kovs power will win ( not knocking his boxing skills) as you have stated hes got A+ punching power. At present Kov cracking Clevs chin is all subjective.


A+ Puncher beats an A+ Chin for me.


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## Tage_West (May 16, 2013)

red mist....it's nearly 25 years. quarter of a century since the soviets disappeared.

you can make the argument that wlad and vitali are the only relics of the cold war left in boxing.


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## Them Bones (Jul 13, 2013)

I'm starting to get seriously excited about this fight. I clearly favor Kovalev. But there are some unknown factors about both guys, and there's a chance that one of these two guys could be getting exposed on saturday.

Both guys have question marks surrounding some of their qualities, and i think that's very much fair in both cases.
I know that chin talk is a somewhat sensitive subject in this sport, and i honestly don't mean any disrespect, but i have a question about Clev's chin. I see quite a few posts here where some are saying that he has a great chin. But is his chin actually proven in any way?
Wasn't he really wobbled against that Polish dude who couldn't really punch.. maybe i'm remembering wrong, and it wasn't that big of a deal, i'm not sure.
And has he ever faced a anyone with a big punch? He has faced some okay punchers, but i'm not seeing any big punchers on his resumé.
Maybe i'm wrong about this, and feel free to school me if i am.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Rob palmer gives Nathan cleverly 5% chance of winning this.

If he was with Eddie Hearn it would be 50%.

That is the truth.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

I give cleverly a 28.5% chance of winning.


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

One to watch said:


> Rob palmer gives Nathan cleverly 5% chance of winning this.
> 
> If he was with Eddie Hearn it would be 50%.
> 
> That is the truth.


Please stop talking shit.

http://checkhookboxing.com/showthread.php?15053-Eddie-Hearn-is-letting-us-down


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

Bill said:


> I give cleverly a 28.5% chance of winning.


I give him solid 45.5%:hey


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Bill said:


> I give cleverly a 28.5% chance of winning.


You have just pulled a number out the air there Bill because you couldn't convert "not a fucking chance in hell" into an accurate percentage.


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## sim_reiss (Jun 6, 2012)

Very excited about this :bbb :bbb

If Clev can keep it tight against Kovalev i.e. avoid taking clean shots without dropping his own activity/tempo, then I really fancy him to pull away in the second half of the fight.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Stunkie said:


> You have just pulled a number out the air there Bill because you couldn't convert "not a fucking chance in hell" into an accurate percentage.


:yep I was trying to sound unbiased, it was lying and I'm sorry, I only give Cleverly 00000000000000000000000000.1/2 chance and that's being considerate.


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## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

I give Cleverly a puncher's chance. And I don't think Cleverly is as big a puncher as his fans do.

Let's hope Enzo - I mean Vince - has the Tizer chilled so that The Rat Bastard can drown his sorrows while playing sudoku.


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Batkilt said:


> I give Cleverly a puncher's chance. And I don't think Cleverly is as big a puncher as his fans do.
> *
> Let's hope Enzo - I mean Vince - has the Tizer chilled so that The Rat Bastard can drown his sorrows while playing sudoku*.


:lol:


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Bill said:


> :yep I was trying to sound unbiased, it was lying and I'm sorry, I only give Cleverly 00000000000000000000000000.1/2 chance and that's being considerate.


Are you having a financial punt on Kovalev mate? Just think Clev could be responsible for paying your kids uni fees, the irony would be to much to take, especially if it was a maths degree they where taking. :lol:


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

Batkilt said:


> I give Cleverly a puncher's chance. And I don't think Cleverly is as big a puncher as his fans do.
> 
> Let's hope Enzo - I mean Vince - has the Tizer chilled so that The Rat Bastard can drown his sorrows while playing sudoku.


I have never really seen anyone calling him a puncher?


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## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)




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## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)




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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

Buzzing for this now. Already gave my prediction, think a lot of people are overrating Kovalev here and under rating Cleverly.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

BoxingAnalyst said:


> Buzzing for this now. Already gave my prediction, think a lot of people are overrating Kovalev here and under rating Cleverly.


Agreed

Hardest thing as a boxing fan is to wade through the propaganda and hype to the reality but I think the latter is that cleverly is a very good championship distance fighter with immense workrate,punch output and good chin.
Kovalev for me isn't proven yet,I hold out hope for Nathan from seeing kovalev hurt a couple of times before and his seeming inability to keep a lid on his over excitement early.

I could see any of the possible results easily happen Saturday and it really is a mouthwatering fight.
I expect cleverly to be like a dog with a bone,desperate to shut up the critics and emerge on the world scene.

War cleverly.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

sim_reiss said:


> Very excited about this :bbb :bbb
> 
> If Clev can keep it tight against Kovalev i.e. avoid taking clean shots without dropping his own activity/tempo, then I really fancy him to pull away in the second half of the fight.


When has he ever done this?
People are acting like he's fought different styles numerous times & has a good defence! His defence is his face!


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## Czech Hooker (Jun 4, 2013)

Clev TKO


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> When has he ever done this?
> People are acting like he's fought different styles numerous times & has a good defence! His defence is his face!


Thats what I find so bizare about peoples predictions. Its as if they dont want to be proved wrong by Cleverly.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> When has he ever done this?
> People are acting like he's fought different styles numerous times & has a good defence! His defence is his face!


Yep. He knew he could take the punches. A fighter know what he can take and what not. So I think he fought careless. I doubt he will be careless against Kovalev. Cleverly is a good fighter and he will Show that this Weekend I think. You clearly can see great Talent in him. Just a question if he can Show it for 12 rounds. Kovalev dont gives room for many mistakes.


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

Berliner said:


> Yep. He knew he could take the punches. A fighter know what he can take and what not. So I think he fought careless. I doubt he will be careless against Kovalev. Cleverly is a good fighter and he will Show that this Weekend I think. You clearly can see great Talent in him. Just a question if he can Show it for 12 rounds. Kovalev dont gives room for many mistakes.


Bellew & Murat, whether it was true to not, had reputations as big punchers and Clev walks forward face first against them. Its tough to get rid of bad habbits. Fighters rarley change there style.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Bellew & Murat, whether it was true to not, had reputations as big punchers and Clev walks forward face first against them. Its tough to get rid of bad habbits. Fighters rarley change there style.


And like I said on the Fury thread - you can't get rid of bad habits in one training camp! I believe he relies his chin is 'iron' when it's not been tested really yet & believes he can walk through anyone, which is a disaster waiting to happen. Don't forget he's got Vince Cleverly as his trainer. I doubt the Mayweather's could change his defence in 10 weeks. Kovalev KO all over this for me.


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> And like I said on the Fury thread - you can't get rid of bad habits in one training camp! I believe he relies his chin is 'iron' when it's not been tested really yet & believes he can walk through anyone, which is a disaster waiting to happen. Don't forget he's got Vince Cleverly as his trainer. I doubt the Mayweather's could change his defence in 10 weeks. Kovalev KO all over this for me.


i think allot of that confidence comes from the sparring with Enzo, Fury & Chisora.


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## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Bellew & Murat, whether it was true to not, had reputations as big punchers and Clev walks forward face first against them. Its tough to get rid of bad habbits. Fighters rarley change there style.


But going on the back foot just plays into Kovs hands


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

DaveyBoyEssexUK said:


> But going on the back foot just plays into Kovs hands


I know, and thats how people think he will win the fight.


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## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> I know, and thats how people think he will win the fight.


I believe Terry O 'Conner is the ref of fucking shit!


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> I know, and thats how people think he will win the fight.


I dont think so. Cleverly is a very very strong light heavyweight. He would waste that if he fights on the back foot. I think Cleverly will go to Kovalev.Punches also arent that hard when you fight on the inside. Not much room to land huge shots.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

Berliner said:


> I dont think so. Cleverly is a very very strong light heavyweight. He would waste that if he fights on the back foot. I think Cleverly will go to Kovalev.Punches also arent that hard when you fight on the inside. Not much room to land huge shots.


He's going to fight the only way he knows how to! But really not that hard? When you're getting nailed on the chin from a 86% KO merchant, the only way you're going is down.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> He's going to fight the only way he knows how to! But really not that hard? When you're getting nailed on the chin from a 86% KO merchant, the only way you're going is down.


No. Fighting Close on the inside can lead to be saver than being on the outside. this is a fact. It is harder to land huge shots when your Opponent has his head on your cheest. If he can back up Kovalev it would be interestng to see if Kovalev still can be that powerful and if he can fight on the back foot.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

Berliner said:


> No. Fighting Close on the inside can lead to be saver than being on the outside. this is a fact. It is harder to land huge shots when your Opponent has his head on your cheest. If he can back up Kovalev it would be interestng to see if Kovalev still can be that powerful and if he can fight on the back foot.


I know what you mean yeah. But Cleverly always leaves his left hand low/ has a lazy jab coming in and Kovalev will look for that all night. Kovalev won't go back he'll be on the front foot more when he knows that Cleverly can't punch that hard. Who are you picking for this?


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## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Berliner said:


> I dont think so. Cleverly is a very very strong light heavyweight. He would waste that if he fights on the back foot. I think Cleverly will go to Kovalev.Punches also arent that hard when you fight on the inside. Not much room to land huge shots.


Cleverly hasn't shown that he's an effective fighter on the inside though - but he has shown he's wide open for punches when at close range, partly due to his poor defensive skills.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> I know what you mean yeah. But Cleverly always leaves his left hand low/ has a lazy jab coming in and Kovalev will look for that all night. Kovalev won't go back he'll be on the front foot more when he knows that Cleverly can't punch that hard. Who are you picking for this?


The Thing is I think he even has a smaller Chance if he runs away from Kovalev. I really think that Cleverly has a Chance. Hard to call for me. Maybe stoppage for Kovalev or Close UD for Clverly. I really think that it wont be that easy for Kovalev. Cleverly showed against Krasniqi that he can fight on the inside. Also against Murat. And didnt he fought Bellew up Close to? I just dont think that it is his style to fight on the back foot. 
Lets see what happens. But I am pretty sure that it will be a hard battle for both fighters.


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## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)

Berliner said:


> The Thing is I think he even has a smaller Chance if he runs away from Kovalev. I really think that Cleverly has a Chance. Hard to call for me. Maybe stoppage for Kovalev or Close UD for Clverly. I really think that it wont be that easy for Kovalev. Cleverly showed against Krasniqi that he can fight on the inside. Also against Murat. And didnt he fought Bellew up Close to? I just dont think that it is his style to fight on the back foot.
> Lets see what happens. But I am pretty sure that it will be a hard battle for both fighters.


Spot on dude!


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

Nathan Cleverly & inside fighting!!!!!!


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

with inside I dont mean fighting in a clinch. Just being very Close to your Opponent wich worked out very well against Krasniqi and Murat and in parts against Bellew.


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## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Berliner said:


> with inside I dont mean fighting in a clinch. Just being very Close to your Opponent wich worked out very well against Krasniqi and Murat and in parts against Bellew.


I don't think there's much comparison between Murat or Bellew and Kovalev though. If Bellew had the stamina to sustain his early form through the full twelve rounds, I honestly think he'd have beaten Cleverly, but for a good portion of that fight Bellew was out boxing Clev, and his response to it was to look for big punches; sure, he eventually adjusted and took control of the fight, but I don't think Kovalev will be as accommodating. Bellew's boxing was underrated going into the Cleverly fight, but his punching is a bit overrated by UK fans - in my opinion - and I don't think Cleverly really should be looking to be within range if he can avoid it.


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## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)




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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

Batkilt said:


> I don't think there's much comparison between Murat or Bellew and Kovalev though. If Bellew had the stamina to sustain his early form through the full twelve rounds, I honestly think he'd have beaten Cleverly, but for a good portion of that fight Bellew was out boxing Clev, and his response to it was to look for big punches; sure, he eventually adjusted and took control of the fight, but I don't think Kovalev will be as accommodating. Bellew's boxing was underrated going into the Cleverly fight, but his punching is a bit overrated by UK fans - in my opinion - and I don't think Cleverly really should be looking to be within range if he can avoid it.


 Cleverly has to get in range at some Point. There is no other way. Fighting on the back foot still means that you have to be in range at some Point. Or has Cleverly huge reach Advantage? Punchers often dont like pressure. And many of them really look weak on the back foot. But Cleverly wont get Kovalev on the back foot by fighting outside. At the end he has to mix it up. He wont win by running 12 rounds. Look at Macklin-Golovkin. Also here I said before the fight that Macklin cant run because good Punchers always catch you at some Point. (if you arent a skilled outside fighter wich Cleverly inst). I would try to put pressure on kovalev and maybe force him on the back foot. Maybe Kovalev cant fight on the back foot at all because it is very different to fight on the back foot and fighting on teh front foot.


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## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Berliner said:


> Cleverly has to get in range at some Point. There is no other way. Fighting on the back foot still means that you have to be in range at some Point. Or has Cleverly huge reach Advantage? Punchers often dont like pressure. And many of them really look weak on the back foot. But Cleverly wont get Kovalev on the back foot by fighting outside. At the end he has to mix it up. He wont win by running 12 rounds. Look at Macklin-Golovkin. Also here I said before the fight that Macklin cant run because good Punchers always catch you at some Point. (if you arent a skilled outside fighter wich Cleverly inst). I would try to put pressure on kovalev and maybe force him on the back foot. Maybe Kovalev cant fight on the back foot at all because it is very different to fight on the back foot and fighting on teh front foot.


Personally I just don't see Cleverly winning the fight. But I am pretty biased, as I don't think he's very good. Plus he's a rat bastard.


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

Berliner said:


> with inside I dont mean fighting in a clinch. Just being very Close to your Opponent wich worked out very well against Krasniqi and Murat and in parts against Bellew.


Clincing and what you deacribed is not inside fighting.


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## p.townend (May 17, 2013)

Unless clev gets tagged and knocked out early he will win a fairly comfortable decision I think. His chin has seemed pretty solid but he shouldn't take any risks in this fight. If he keeps a tight defence and just boxes he wins.


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2013)

p.townend said:


> Unless clev gets tagged and knocked out early he will win a fairly comfortable decision I think. His chin has seemed pretty solid but he shouldn't take any risks in this fight. If he keeps a tight defence and just boxes he wins.


When has Cleverly done this before?


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## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)




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## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)




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## Guest (Aug 15, 2013)

Thanks Dan.

Find it strange that people would question the power of a man that stopped a 17-1 fighter that had never been stopped, and went on to die 3 days later. Kovalevs power is for real.


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## MrBiggerthan (Jun 4, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Thanks Dan.
> 
> Find it strange that people would question the power of a man that stopped a 17-1 fighter that had never been stopped, and went on to die 3 days later. Kovalevs power is for real.


We do not have much longer for people to see this for themselves either.:deal


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

I think the scouse rent-a-quote has inadvertently increased the focus this fight is getting.

He's done Frank a favour.


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## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)

Can't miss a good Frank interview


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## Czech Hooker (Jun 4, 2013)

Will anyone actually give Nathan any credit when he's beaten Kovalev?

Clev is just going to be too fast for Kovalev, he'll take him apart and probably stop him. The thing about having a good chin and knowing you have a good chin is that you can fight your fight and execute your game plan confidently and without much fear. It also gives the opportunity to adjust if necessary and get in toe to toe, which can really take the edge out of a punch. 

The game plan should be to practically step on Kovalev's toes, like how Purdy tried against Alexander. Deifference being that Clev has the speed here.

Clev win by TKO rounds 7-9.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Czech Hooker said:


> Will anyone actually give Nathan any credit when he's beaten Kovalev?


Some people are gonna look daft if he does.


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## Crean (May 19, 2013)

I genuinely can only see one result. Kovalev KO/TKO.

Maybe im blind to the alternatives?


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

tony ' the tit ' bellew : 

Tony Bellew ‏@TonyBellew 14 Aug 
I really think the other fella Beats him and beats him without many problems.. Just look who he has been ran close by! Workrate will do him!


there was another tweet , which I cant find or was deleted , where he says Adonis would absolutely smash kovalev to bits


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

Scorpio78 said:


> tony ' the tit ' bellew :
> 
> Tony Bellew ‏@TonyBellew 14 Aug
> I really think the other fella Beats him and beats him without many problems.. Just look who he has been ran close by! Workrate will do him!
> ...


Tony the prick Bellew.


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## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)




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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

That interviewer is shit stirrer like kugan


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

John David Jackson didn't seem to be aware Kovalev had been stopped as an amateur.


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## Guest (Aug 15, 2013)

If your former boss tried to rewin your life and career, you would also want him and his employees to fail. Tony should keep quiet nut its completley understandable why he says this stuff.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> If your former boss tried to rewin your life and career, you would also want him and his employees to fail. Tony should keep quiet nut its completley understandable why he says this stuff.


I don't see how making himself look daft is going to help him get back at Warren. He has given this fight more publicity than almost anybody else.

And he know he was daft because he played the 'fishing' card.


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## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Cleverly couldn't stop Tommy Karpency!


Karpency fought with Sparring partner syndrome he was their to survive, seen plenty do this before against champs


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

For all the differing views and opinions of what will happen, has anyone ever been this excited about a Cleverly fight? think it will be a stormer so many questions to be answered can't wait for the weekend, this is the start of a run of cracking fights.


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## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)

Just watched the head to head video and agree with earl on another post Kov looked a bit shook up


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Cleverly has a 4 inch reach. I do feel the toe to toe stuff is playing a really dangerous game but leading off and keeping Kovalev off balance is a must. 

His long arms could proved to be pivotal but then again could be used against him. 

Cannot wait for this fight. Going to be a war!. I still feel Kovalev will land at some point and finish the job but Cleverly can do it. But this will take a performance of maturity.


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## Guest (Aug 15, 2013)

Stunkie said:


> For all the differing views and opinions of what will happen, has anyone ever been this excited about a Cleverly fight? think it will be a stormer so many questions to be answered can't wait for the weekend, this is the start of a run of cracking fights.


You didn't feel this way about Joey Vegas?


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> You didn't feel this way about Joey Vegas?


No I had a little less enthusiasm for that fight, but the Shawn Hawk fight now that's a different matter, you had to peel me off the ceiling for that. :lol:


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## Guest (Aug 15, 2013)

Stunkie said:


> No I had a little less enthusiasm for that fight, but the Shawn Hawk fight now that's a different matter, you had to peel me off the ceiling for that. :lol:


I remember being pretty excited about the Murat fight to be fair. That was the fight from the Magnificent 7 I was looking forward to most. Also the Tony Oakey fight, when most posters on ESB backed Oakey to win.

I always really liked Cleverly until he became a world champion and he has just stagnated. In fact he has got worse!


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> I remember being pretty excited about the Murat fight to be fair. That was the fight from the Magnificent 7 I was looking forward to most. Also the Tony Oakey fight, when most posters on ESB backed Oakey to win.
> 
> I always really liked Cleverly until he became a world champion and he has just stagnated. In fact he has got worse!


ESB used to be quite funny when Clev was coming through.

He would never make it, and he had a glass jaw.

And that was before the Bellew love-in.


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## Guest (Aug 15, 2013)

Grant said:


> ESB used to be quite funny when Clev was coming through.
> 
> He would never make it, and he had a glass jaw.
> 
> And that was before the Bellew love-in.


The Bellew love in was incredible. Literally this guy was gonna become P4P No.1. I remember getting ripped for saying "What was so impressive about beating an afro bum" after he stopped Atoli Moore. After the Ajisafe fight people were talking about his heart lol

Its strange to see how quickly people turned on his and how quickly people have turned on Carl Froch because of a few things he says in interviews.


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## Guest (Aug 15, 2013)

DaveyBoyEssexUK said:


> Just watched the head to head video and agree with earl on another post Kov looked a bit shook up


what???


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## PHONK (Jul 14, 2012)

Cleverly on points.

He's finally got his 'big fight' 

Time for him to produce.


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## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Mandanda said:


> Cleverly has a 4 inch reach. I do feel the toe to toe stuff is playing a really dangerous game but leading off and keeping Kovalev off balance is a must.
> 
> His long arms could proved to be pivotal but then again could be used against him.
> 
> Cannot wait for this fight. Going to be a war!. I still feel Kovalev will land at some point and finish the job but Cleverly can do it. But this will take a performance of maturity.


If he's able to utilise his reach advantage and keep Kovalev off of him using his jab, I'll be well impressed. Having a reach advantage is only helpful when you know how to use it, and I'm not convinced Cleverly will be able to use it to consistently keep Kovalev at bay. Not just because I'm not keen on Clev - I think Kovalev is a good fighter, and doing that is going to be a hard task for anyone. It'll be interesting to see if Clev does try that, and whether or not it's successful.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Batkilt said:


> If he's able to utilise his reach advantage and keep Kovalev off of him using his jab, I'll be well impressed. Having a reach advantage is only helpful when you know how to use it, and I'm not convinced Cleverly will be able to use it to consistently keep Kovalev at bay. Not just because I'm not keen on Clev - I think Kovalev is a good fighter, and doing that is going to be a hard task for anyone. It'll be interesting to see if Clev does try that, and whether or not it's successful.


I think Cleverly's combinations could make it hard for Kovalev but the fact he leans forward and doesn't utilize range that well means his long arms could be used against him with lazy punches being countered. I've seen another tale of the tape saying it's only 2 inch reach advantage.

Cleverly's never been one to keep guys at range that way even when fighting likes of Kuziemski he allowed him to get close and land.


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## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Mandanda said:


> I think Cleverly's combinations could make it hard for Kovalev but the fact he leans forward and doesn't utilize range that well means his long arms could be used against him with lazy punches being countered. I've seen another tale of the tape saying it's only 2 inch reach advantage.
> 
> Cleverly's never been one to keep guys at range that way even when fighting likes of Kuziemski he allowed him to get close and land.


Yeah, Kuziemski landed far too many punches that night, really. I haven't been impressed by Cleverly at all during his WBO title run, but some fighters tend to perform better in the bigger fights. At this point I think you could give him the benefit of the doubt, and assume he didn't respect Kuziemski's power and thus won't make the same mistakes against Kovalev, but if he is open to those sort of shots from Kovalev then I think he's going to get hurt.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Batkilt said:


> Yeah, Kuziemski landed far too many punches that night, really. I haven't been impressed by Cleverly at all during his WBO title run, but some fighters tend to perform better in the bigger fights. At this point I think you could give him the benefit of the doubt, and assume he didn't respect Kuziemski's power and thus won't make the same mistakes against Kovalev, but if he is open to those sort of shots from Kovalev then I think he's going to get hurt.


Yeah nor have i mate. I have laid off the criticism to a extent because maybe Nathan isn't as motivated by the level of opposition and isn't going through gears as he could or should.

But in all honesty he's a talented lad but he ships punches and if he ships them on Saturday in a gunfight he's going to get hurt somewhere down the line.

Even Shawn Hawk landed i just think Cleverly has got into bad habits and there hard to get rid of when your going year by year without correcting them.


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## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Mandanda said:


> Yeah nor have i mate. I have laid off the criticism to a extent because maybe Nathan isn't as motivated by the level of opposition and isn't going through gears as he could or should.
> 
> But in all honesty he's a talented lad but he ships punches and if he ships them on Saturday in a gunfight he's going to get hurt somewhere down the line.
> 
> Even Shawn Hawk landed i just think Cleverly has got into bad habits and there hard to get rid of when your going year by year without correcting them.


Aye, and that's the biggest problem with having Vince as his trainer. Father/son pairings sometimes work, but Vince doesn't seem as though he'd be in Nathan's corner if he wasn't his father - and that's an issue. It's one thing if the father/trainer is correcting these sort of mistakes, but Vince seems more of a cheerleader than anything. And the longer a fighter leaves it before he tries to correct these mistakes, the more unlikely he is to be able to.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Batkilt said:


> Aye, and that's the biggest problem with having Vince as his trainer. Father/son pairings sometimes work, but Vince doesn't seem as though he'd be in Nathan's corner if he wasn't his father - and that's an issue. It's one thing if the father/trainer is correcting these sort of mistakes, but Vince seems more of a cheerleader than anything. And the longer a fighter leaves it before he tries to correct these mistakes, the more unlikely he is to be able to.


Yeah i agree mate i've laughed at his father's antics in the ring and way he speaks about the boy at times. Thing is though and it must be said when he was with Enzo Calzaghe i watched Nathan and he looked poor TBH. When he went off with the dad i be honest there was major improvements for around 15 months he kicked on massively but i think since then the father's maybe lack of knowledge and Nathan hitting a ceiling in development has hindered him.

I think Nathan has done very well to remain unbeaten because i don't believe things are as they should be for a world class fighter. I kinda hope he wins Saturday i have nothing but respect for him taking this fight.


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## Guest (Aug 15, 2013)

Cleverly is a big man that fights like a small man. All Enzo Calzghe fighters do the same thing.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

In about 36 hours @Bill becomes @BandanaBill.


----------



## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)




----------



## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)

Cleverly 174 Kovalev 173


----------



## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)

Buckland 128, Smith 130, Enzo 174, McKenzie 174


----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Grant said:


> In about 36 hours @Bill becomes @BandanaBill.


:lol: I don't own a hairband, I'll have to tie a pair of my pants round my head instead.


----------



## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Bill said:


> :lol: I don't own a hairband, I'll have to tie a pair of my pants round my head instead.


A name change on here will suffice.


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## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Got myself HBO free for 6 months last night


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## lirva1 (Aug 16, 2013)

Round 1

Cleverly comes out with a high guard. Kovalev on the attack already with good punches, all blocked by Cleverly. Fast jabs by Clev and good foot speed. Kovalev tries with another combination and Cleverly takes them on the gloves again. Kovalev now knows he needs to adjust his punches slightly to get around the guard. Another combo by Kovalev and Clev rides and blocks the punches and now they are in close. HARD LEFT HOOK TO THE BODY BY CLEVERLY. Kovalev takes it well. Back to the centre of the ring, jab jab jab by cleverly. Its a jabing contest as Kovalev also starts jabbing. Cleverly is in survival mode here as Kovalev attacks again and lands one of his punches to the head of Cleverly who takes it well. Cleverly is keeping very tight and they jab again as the bell rings to end round 1. Tight round.


Round 2 begins. Kovalev has thought about it and now comes in with more accurate punches. CLEVERLY GETS HURT BY A RIGHT HAND AND SHOWBOATS TO KOVALEV. Kovalev doesn't need an invitation and attacks cleverly with powerful punches again. cleverly covers up but he's taking some punches. His defense is too leaky. Cleverly gets hurt again and is down on a left hand. Up a 5, he takes the 8 count. Kovalev is going for it, Cleverly has realized that he can be hurt as Kovalev gets him against the ropes and starts firing. Cleverly returns fire with brutal body shots. Kovalev takes them well and continues his assault. ANOTHER LEFT HAND HAS DROPPED CLEVERLY AT THE BELL.


In the corner Vince Cleverly gives his son awful advice. Out they come for round 3. BIG RIGHT HAND BY KOVALEV GETS CLEVERLY GOING AGAIN. terry o connor is looking closely as Kovalev reigns in the punches. Another LEFT HAND sends cleverly down and the fight is stopped before he gets starched..


KOVALEV KO3


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Grant said:


> A name change on here will suffice.


Deal. :lol:

I am actually really looking forward to the fight, not for a sadistic reason, its genuinely interesting.


----------



## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Bill said:


> :lol: I don't own a hairband, I'll have to tie a pair of my pants round my head instead.


You will have to buy one you cheap fuck!


----------



## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Bill said:


> Deal. :lol:
> 
> I am actually really looking forward to the fight, not for a sadistic reason, its genuinely interesting.


Haha I am actually looking forward to the fall-out on here when he wins :deal


----------



## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Grant said:


> Haha I am actually looking forward to the fall-out on here when he wins :deal


I will get absolutely ripped if he wins. It will be brutal.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> You will have to buy one you cheap fuck!


I'd die of shame first.


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## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Bill said:


> I'd die of shame first.


So your bitching out?


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Grant said:


> Haha I am actually looking forward to the fall-out on here when he wins :deal


I'd have no choice but to give him credit, although it will be painful for me at the same time.


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## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> So your bitching out?


I'm not buying a fucking hairband mate, what if someone saw me, id probably get shot.


----------



## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Bill said:


> I'm not buying a fucking hairband mate, what if someone saw me, id probably get shot.


So whats the point of the bet?


----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> So whats the point of the bet?


I didn't even agree to the hairband, I said i'd post a video of me raveing my little nugget off to Basshunter, Grant said he's happy with a name change, whatever he decides.


----------



## faz (Jan 25, 2013)

I think the workrate of Cleverly will win him a 116-112ish UD.


----------



## DynamiteDan (Jul 18, 2013)




----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

I so want Clev to get sparked.


----------



## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)

Weigh ins


----------



## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Cleverly trying to front up to a stone faced killa!


----------



## Bryn (Jun 2, 2012)

Just dropping in to give my final prediction for bragging rights later. :deal

Cleverly will dust off his boxing skills and show the world he his truly the future of the 175lbs division, and more than a decent engine and chin. Kovalev will be made to look one paced and lacking ideas while Cleverly builds up a lead on the scorecards, Nathan will hit the deck at some point but recover well. First few rounds Cleverly will spend on the back foot, jabbing, circling in changing directions, Kovalev tires chasing Cleverly down and then Cleverly ups his pace and takes rounds with combination punching, parrying and slipping the shots of Kovalev while effectively landing his own. 

Clev PTS.


----------



## JamieC (Jun 2, 2012)

I'd love Cleverly to do it, but i think Kovalev is a massive jump from Karpency/Hawk et al. If he does though i'll be delighted to be proved wrong

Is this the closest poll we've had on here?


----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

JamieC said:


> I'd love Cleverly to do it, but i think Kovalev is a massive jump from Karpency/Hawk et al. If he does though i'll be delighted to be proved wrong
> 
> Is this the closest poll we've had on here?


It's the most rigged. :yep


----------



## JamieC (Jun 2, 2012)

Bill said:


> It's the most rigged. :yep


ah is that why whos voted for who is private?


----------



## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Bryn said:


> Just dropping in to give my final prediction for bragging rights later. :deal
> 
> Cleverly will dust off his boxing skills and show the world he his truly the future of the 175lbs division, and more than a decent engine and chin. Kovalev will be made to look one paced and lacking ideas while Cleverly builds up a lead on the scorecards, Nathan will hit the deck at some point but recover well. First few rounds Cleverly will spend on the back foot, jabbing, circling in changing directions, Kovalev tires chasing Cleverly down and then Cleverly ups his pace and takes rounds with combination punching, parrying and slipping the shots of Kovalev while effectively landing his own.
> 
> Clev PTS.


This prediction completely contradicted itself. First few rounds Cleverly will box on the back foot and control the fight and then take over with his stanima.....but he will also get knocked down and come back?


----------



## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Bill said:


> It's the most rigged. :yep


??

I take it your prediction is a Kovalev KO?


----------



## Elliot (Jun 4, 2013)

Cleverly UD, anyone got any actual money on this?


----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> ??
> 
> I take it your prediction is a Kovalev KO?


Why of course, this may come as a shock but I do have eyes.


----------



## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Bill said:


> I'd have no choice but to give him credit, although it will be painful for me at the same time.


It'll be worse for me than you mate. I'll be taking photos of me out and about wearing the heidband.

Fortunately for me Cleverly will get knocked out now that he's stepping up....:yep


----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Batkilt said:


> It'll be worse for me than you mate. I'll be taking photos of me out and about wearing the heidband.
> 
> Fortunately for me Cleverly will get knocked out now that he's stepping up....:yep


If I had a hairband (which I dont) I couldn't go and buy one, its just not part of my make up.


----------



## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Batkilt said:


> It'll be worse for me than you mate. I'll be taking photos of me out and about wearing the heidband.
> 
> Fortunately for me Cleverly will get knocked out now that he's stepping up....:yep


Oh yeh it was you with the headband.

Yeh you got nothing to worry about. This fight is a lock!


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## D-U-D-E (Jul 31, 2013)

Cleverly UD, let's get those headbands out fellas :ibutt


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## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Bill said:


> If I had a hairband (which I dont) I couldn't go and buy one, its just not part of my make up.


I don't have one. I'd be ordering one of those that the rat bastard wears especially for the forfeit.


----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Batkilt said:


> I don't have one. I'd be ordering one of those that the rat bastard wears especially for the forfeit.


:lol: The internet is a wonderful thing (Sometimes).


----------



## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

Bill said:


> :lol: The internet is a wonderful thing (Sometimes).


http://www.boxxerworld.com/nathan-cleverly-headband

:huh


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## D-U-D-E (Jul 31, 2013)

£25?, that's daylight robbery :haye


----------



## Batkilt (Jun 6, 2012)

@D-U-D-E It's fucking shocking, isn't it? You could just buy one and iron "CLEV" onto it for a fiver.

I'd pay £25 for that if it said "PUTIN" on it though. Wait...customise design option is there.....:deal:


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## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

fuck it. If Clev wins I will get one and it will be my avi pic for the rest of 2013.


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## Bryn (Jun 2, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> This prediction completely contradicted itself. First few rounds Cleverly will box on the back foot and control the fight and then take over with his stanima.....but he will also get knocked down and come back?


You never seen someone control a round/fight but get knocked down and recover well from the shot that put them down? It's a pretty common.


----------



## Guest (Aug 16, 2013)

Bryn said:


> You never seen someone control a round/fight but get knocked down and recover well from the shot that put them down? It's a pretty common.


Hhmmm fair point. Although I don't think that can happen in this fight. Kovalev is a concussive puncher, if Cleverly gets put down he will be in trouble and it will take him time to recover.

I just don't beleive Cleverly has the ability to box the way you need him to to win this fight. Hes getting knocked out.


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## dkos (Jun 2, 2012)

I'm not confident in making any kind of concrete prediction on the result for this one. There are quite a few questions about both fighters that still need to be answered - can Kovalev take a punch, can Cleverly box sufficiently enough on the back foot, can Kovalev handle going into the later rounds, can Cleverly take the power Kovalev dishes out, how will both handle and/or negate the others high work rate and intensity etc. etc. - which makes me wary in picking a winner. 

I've tentatively went with Kovalev to break Cleverly down by the mid-rounds, but I could conceivably see any method of result happening. The only thing I can predict with any conviction is that it'll be a great fight while it lasts.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Man I'm excited.

Best title fight in britain outside of froch for some time,it's split everybody and has Americas attention.
This is high stakes boxing and the support card is very good as well.

Bring it on


----------



## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

I just get the feeling cleverly will be like a man possessed trying to prove himself.

A win and his exposure could mean Hopkins on showtime under the tutelage of Freddie roach,a loss and he either becomes an opponent for the big boys or goes back to beating substandard opposition at home or bellew 2.

Nathan's going to be very motivated,and a hungry boxer at home is a force to be reckoned with.

Cleverly ud 12.tight but well deserved decision

People can scoff all they want but when kovalevs throwing he can be caught and hurt,I can see cleverly hurting him at some point.
That's why this fights on a knife edge because of the posssibilties,I can see both being hurt and a fight that ebbs and flows as 2 well matched fighters will provide.

Then we get barker-geale for dessert in what I expect to be a less explosive fight but a very technical affair where barker has to make his mark early if he wants to take the belt home.over championship distance geale is very hard to beat and barkers previous for not sustaining 12 rounds consistently doesn't bode well.i just wish barker had more experience with better opposition to prepare him.
People slate cleverlys cv all the time but the fact is that his wins over Murat,bellew,kuziemski and krazniqui compare favourably to barkers wins over spada,hope and rotolo.

Come on the Brits


----------



## Guest (Aug 17, 2013)

One to watch said:


> I just get the feeling cleverly will be like a man possessed trying to prove himself.
> 
> A win and his exposure could mean Hopkins on showtime under the tutelage of Freddie roach,a loss and he either becomes an opponent for the big boys or goes back to beating substandard opposition at home or bellew 2.
> 
> ...


When you make predictions based on a feeling rather than actuallu analysing a fight, you are in for trouble. Kovalev might be open but Cleverly is not a big puncher......oh you know who is a big puncher, Kovalev.....OH and you know who is open defensivley......yeh you guessed it.

The difference between Cleverly & Barker is that Cleverly is a world champion and Barker isn't. Obviously Cleverly will have the better record. Whats Barker got to do with this anyway?

Campillo just got stopped in 9 rounds tonight against Fonfara. Looks like he is done.


----------



## Libertarian (Jun 2, 2012)

All talk of fighting Hopkins needs to stop.

Stay the fuck away from him.

Why people agree to fight him I've no idea. None of them are ever the same afterwards.


----------



## Guest (Aug 17, 2013)

Dinamita said:


> All talk of fighting Hopkins needs to stop.
> 
> Stay the fuck away from him.
> 
> Why people agree to fight him I've no idea. None of them are ever the same afterwards.


Even those that bear him.


----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Batkilt said:


> http://www.boxxerworld.com/nathan-cleverly-headband
> 
> :huh


Jesus wept!! £25 quid is a small price to pay to look as cool and dapper as Nathan.


----------



## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Campillo just got stopped in 9 rounds tonight against Fonfara. Looks like he is done.


Shocking the way he crumbled there especially given who he was fighting; Fonfara was previously badly struggling against Karpency until the weird ending in that fight at which point he was down on 2 of the score cards.

Seems like the way Campillo spent his near year out between the Cloud and Kovalev fights has done for him.


----------



## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

This is a hard one to pick. Yes, Kovalev is a banger and yes Clev is there to be hit, but... we've never seen Nathan hurt, we've never seen Kovalev deal with someone throwing so many punches and constantly doing something. And I suspect that Nathan will be more cautious in this fight - he was a little slow to get started with Bellew because of all the noise about Tony's power. Soon as Nathan realised he could take it, he really hammered Bellew in the late rounds. 

I think there are big unknowns here and don't feel that confident of a pick. I see arguments for both guys, but Kovalev is rightly the favourite.


----------



## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

That's me out for the day. Have a good un ladies.

Gwan Clev.


----------



## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> When you make predictions based on a feeling rather than actuallu analysing a fight, you are in for trouble. Kovalev might be open but Cleverly is not a big puncher......oh you know who is a big puncher, Kovalev.....OH and you know who is open defensivley......yeh you guessed it.
> 
> The difference between Cleverly & Barker is that Cleverly is a world champion and Barker isn't. Obviously Cleverly will have the better record. Whats Barker got to do with this anyway?
> 
> Campillo just got stopped in 9 rounds tonight against Fonfara. Looks like he is done.


Well I predicted fonfara would stop campillo so perhaps my theories aren't that stupid.


----------



## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

I know some lads from my gym going and I am very jealous right now.

Going to be electric tonight.welshmen in all fights as well.


----------



## Bryn (Jun 2, 2012)

Need to find a local pub that has BoxNation. It's a sad state of affairs when you cannot find a pub in Cleverly's own hometown that is showing the biggest fight of his career. Pubs should be full.


----------



## Jon Snow (Jun 10, 2013)

What Time is the ring walk?


----------



## Ishy (Jun 2, 2012)

Jon Snow said:


> What Time is the ring walk?


Around 10pm http://www.boxnation.com/boxing-news/cleverly-v-kovalev-televised-running-order-confirmed/


----------



## Jon Snow (Jun 10, 2013)

Ishy said:


> Around 10pm http://www.boxnation.com/boxing-news/cleverly-v-kovalev-televised-running-order-confirmed/


Cool thanks. Hoping nathan can do it and shut the critics up.


----------



## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

Nathan has a better chance of winning tonight than Barker, IMO.


----------



## Guest (Aug 17, 2013)

Bryn said:


> Need to find a local pub that has BoxNation. It's a sad state of affairs when you cannot find a pub in Cleverly's own hometown that is showing the biggest fight of his career. Pubs should be full.


BoxNation man. These fighters and fights are completley of the radar of the general fan. Hasn't sold out either.


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## Guest (Aug 17, 2013)

One to watch said:


> Well I predicted fonfara would stop campillo so perhaps my theories aren't that stupid.


Did you make that prediction based on a feeling?


----------



## Guest (Aug 17, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> Nathan has a better chance of winning tonight than Barker, IMO.


On paper, Yes. Based on styles, No.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> On paper, Yes. Based on styles, No.


That's a bit of a lazy analysis - you're really discrediting Cleverly's strengths here. Kovalev is used to guys backing off from him - he won't be as powerful with someone mugging him at mid to close range. And Cleverly isn't quite as one-dimensional as you're making out.

In terms of styles, a tidy boxer who fades down the stretch versus a high volume guy who throws from all angles is possibly the worst style for someone like Barker.


----------



## Guest (Aug 17, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> That's a bit of a lazy analysis - you're really discrediting Cleverly's strengths here. Kovalev is used to guys backing off from him - he won't be as powerful with someone mugging him at mid to close range. And Cleverly isn't quite as one-dimensional as you're making out.
> 
> In terms of styles, a tidy boxer who fades down the stretch versus a high volume guy who throws from all angles is possibly the worst style for someone like Barker.


But everybody on here predicting a Cleverly win is saying he has to fight on the back foot. Are you saying the way to beat Kovalev is to take it to him from round 1? Lets remember he may have been cautious in the early rounds v Bellew but Bellew won those early rounds.

Barker has a tough ask no doubt. But I think Cleverly has no chance.


----------



## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> *But everybody on here predicting a Cleverly win is saying he has to fight on the back foot. *Are you saying the way to beat Kovalev is to take it to him from round 1? Lets remember he may have been cautious in the early rounds v Bellew but Bellew won those early rounds.
> 
> Barker has a tough ask no doubt. But I think Cleverly has no chance.


A lot of people think that backing off from an aggressive, powerful fighter is the right tactic. In this case, and keeping in mind the way Clev fights, I think it's the wrong decision. He was cagey against Bellew because he thought that Tony could crack. Turns out he really can't and once Clev figured it out, he was all over him. What happened? Tony couldn't deal with him any more. So while he gave away rounds, hopefully he's learned from that.

Cleverly is like The Terminator when he gets going - fast hands, good combinations, a little bit of sting (but not much, obviously), and he's relentless. Kovalev is pretty basic, he likes the time afforded to him by guys backing up and he gets more leverage on his shots coming forward. If Clev takes that away from him, he can actually smother the straighter shots of the other guy.

If you think Clev has no chance, Barker is absolutely fucked. He fades down the stretch, isn't much of a puncher and dislikes guys who throw a lot of punches. Geale is the antidote to every one of those things.


----------



## Guest (Aug 17, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> A lot of people think that backing off from an aggressive, powerful fighter is the right tactic. In this case, and keeping in mind the way Clev fights, I think it's the wrong decision. He was cagey against Bellew because he thought that Tony could crack. Turns out he really can't and once Clev figured it out, he was all over him. What happened? Tony couldn't deal with him any more. So while he gave away rounds, hopefully he's learned from that.
> 
> Cleverly is like The Terminator when he gets going - fast hands, good combinations, a little bit of sting (but not much, obviously), and he's relentless. Kovalev is pretty basic, he likes the time afforded to him by guys backing up and he gets more leverage on his shots coming forward. If Clev takes that away from him, he can actually smother the straighter shots of the other guy.
> 
> If you think Clev has no chance, Barker is absolutely fucked. He fades down the stretch, isn't much of a puncher and dislikes guys who throw a lot of punches. Geale is the antidote to every one of those things.


Like I have said I wont be making a real predixtion on Barker as I am
emotionally involved. I think Kovalev is better than Geale though. Plus your Rigo has no chance prediction gives me faith


----------



## Masters (May 20, 2013)

Bryn said:


> Need to find a local pub that has BoxNation. It's a sad state of affairs when you cannot find a pub in Cleverly's own hometown that is showing the biggest fight of his career. Pubs should be full.


Thats fucked up. If you know any pub with an illegal satalite instead of Sky they will have it. Most likely they wont know they have it.
I went months before I realized my local had free boxnation and free Sky sports box office.
Its actually legal by some technicality , the singal come in from Iraqistan or somewhere.


----------



## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Did you make that prediction based on a feeling?


Who cares and where did you get the information that the arena isn't sold out miss marple.

Plus how many people have actually said cleverly needs to fight on the back foot.surely kovalev isn't used to sustained pressure.
Educated pressure I believe it's called.


----------



## Scotty (Jun 6, 2012)

dftaylor said:


> A lot of people think that backing off from an aggressive, powerful fighter is the right tactic. In this case, and keeping in mind the way Clev fights, I think it's the wrong decision. He was cagey against Bellew because he thought that Tony could crack. Turns out he really can't and once Clev figured it out, he was all over him. What happened? Tony couldn't deal with him any more. So while he gave away rounds, hopefully he's learned from that.
> 
> Cleverly is like The Terminator when he gets going - fast hands, good combinations, a little bit of sting (but not much, obviously), and he's relentless. Kovalev is pretty basic, he likes the time afforded to him by guys backing up and he gets more leverage on his shots coming forward. If Clev takes that away from him, he can actually smother the straighter shots of the other guy.
> 
> If you think Clev has no chance, Barker is absolutely fucked. He fades down the stretch, isn't much of a puncher and dislikes guys who throw a lot of punches. Geale is the antidote to every one of those things.


I agree with this. I think Cleverly will be safer in close rather than in retreat. Limit the leverage of Kovalev and try to make him think about his defence for a change. Cleverly cannot win this fight unless he throws the dice imo.


----------



## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Like I have said I wont be making a real predixtion on Barker as I am
> emotionally involved. I think Kovalev is better than Geale though. Plus your Rigo has no chance prediction gives me faith


That wasn't my finest hour. :lol:


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## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

I know ring walk for barker is around 4am what about cleverly ?


----------



## Scorpio78 (Jun 10, 2012)

10.10pm

jist got tweeted from his account


----------



## Royal-T-Bag (Jun 5, 2013)

yo, bit of help here folks.....what time is the clev vs kovalev fight? i'm too busy today to care to watch the undercard.


----------



## Bryn (Jun 2, 2012)

Royal-T-Bag said:


> yo, bit of help here folks.....what time is the clev vs kovalev fight? i'm too busy today to care to watch the undercard.


It's the post above yours mate.


----------



## lirva1 (Aug 16, 2013)

lirva1 said:


> Round 1
> 
> Cleverly comes out with a high guard. Kovalev on the attack already with good punches, all blocked by Cleverly. Fast jabs by Clev and good foot speed. Kovalev tries with another combination and Cleverly takes them on the gloves again. Kovalev now knows he needs to adjust his punches slightly to get around the guard. Another combo by Kovalev and Clev rides and blocks the punches and now they are in close. HARD LEFT HOOK TO THE BODY BY CLEVERLY. Kovalev takes it well. Back to the centre of the ring, jab jab jab by cleverly. Its a jabing contest as Kovalev also starts jabbing. Cleverly is in survival mode here as Kovalev attacks again and lands one of his punches to the head of Cleverly who takes it well. Cleverly is keeping very tight and they jab again as the bell rings to end round 1. Tight round.
> 
> ...


Good prediction I'd say!


----------



## CCR (Jun 4, 2013)

If I was Irish i'd bump this thread every time the issue of impartiality cropped up. I can't believe nearly 50% of the Brit forum believed Cleverly would win. Bizarre.


----------



## Back to Bill (Jun 5, 2012)

Yep from some good posters as well. everyone has an off night though.


----------



## lirva1 (Aug 16, 2013)

CCR said:


> If I was Irish i'd bump this thread every time the issue of impartiality cropped up. I can't believe nearly 50% of the Brit forum believed Cleverly would win. Bizarre.


People like this always come out of the woodwork. Where was your Kovalev by brutal KO prediction before the fight?

I can direct you to mine if you'd like to read it.


----------



## CCR (Jun 4, 2013)

lirva1 said:


> People like this always come out of the woodwork. Where was your Kovalev by brutal KO prediction before the fight?
> 
> I can direct you to mine if you'd like to read it.


http://checkhookboxing.com/showthre...Boxing-nation-from-europe&p=409126#post409126

I said Clev was getting his 'arse handed to him'. Read into that what you will - but I think it's fairly evident as to what I thought was going to happen.


----------



## lirva1 (Aug 16, 2013)

I take it you made several thousand pounds putting your money where your mouth is as well?


----------



## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

At what point did some of guys say "Shit.....Rob Palmer was right"??


----------



## Frenchy (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> At what point did some of guys say "Shit.....Rob Palmer was right"??


This deserves a bump.:happy


----------



## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

Lilo said:


> Cleverly UD
> 
> Workrate, chin and more mature tactics will win it after negotiating a rocky first third. He'll get tagged early and then win with plan B.





One to watch said:


> I really can't split them.
> 
> The potential weakness for kovalev is throwing too much too early and failing to get cleverly out of there.however he is a good boxer in his own right and his strength and combos mean I think he can possibly confound opinion and be a success in the later rounds as well.
> 
> I wouldn't be suprised to see any outcome for either boxer but if pushed I will go that we see 12 rounds of a seesaw fight with one or both hurt and maybe dropped during the action,I will edge towards clev taking a slim but fair decision that propels his career.not so much Calzaghe Lacey more khan maidana.





Stunkie said:


> Cleverly ud
> 
> Think Clev will set a furious pace and test the Russians stamina, Clev has a great chin and I don't see Clev being floored even if he is tagged and this will test kovalevs heart. I see Clev fighting in bursts in and out quickly. The only way I see Clev losing is if he loses the head and starts standing and trading.





the iron sheik said:


> Cleverly UD........think its going to be a pretty 50/50 fight early on with both guys having their moments and clev will no doubt have a few scares along the way but think Nathan will come on strong and bank the last 3/4 rounds......ITS GOING TO BE NASTY!





Elliot said:


> Cleverly by decision, see it being very close for 8 rounds then Cleverly's workrate coming into effect late to pull clear.





Canastota said:


> Superb odds for Cleverly this fight. The bookies always go weak at the knees over a KO artist and it's one area they can get done over, especially in this case as they have completely overlooked WHO Kovalev has been sparking. The 3 notable wins given for each fighter in the OP indicate that Kovalev is being overrated and Cleverly underrated in the betting.
> 
> Campillo is being held up as proof of Kov's power but Campillo had already been KO'd prior to Kovalev and is most notable for a disputed points loss to Cloud who put in a pathetic performance against a nigh on 50 yr old. Campillo was also way off kilter going into the Kovalev fight. Kovalev KO'd White in 2 rounds but White had already been KO'd in 1 round by an absolute nobody prior to this. Similarly, Boone has lost more fights than he's won (21 losses) and had also been KO'd in 1 round prior to Kovalev.
> 
> The relatively unexposed nature of Kovalev's power means it has skewed the betting in this fight, which means a nice a little earner on the hometown win.





Canastota said:


> The only time anyone has put anything on Kovalev as a pro was Boone in the first fight and he was on the floor there and glad it was only an 8 rounder. Be interesting to see if his durability has come on if it goes further





Canastota said:


> Nobody seems to be raising the issue of Kovalev's chin. Good job it seems the fight will be over before feather fists Cleverly gets at it then!





Canastota said:


> Can't tell much from Kovalev's pro fights as they've all just crumbled in front of him apart from when Boone put it on him in their first fight. So most people haven't seen what happens when even a relatively light puncher lands flush on him.
> 
> Saw some of Kovalev's amateur fights from the year before he turned pro the other day tho.





Canastota said:


> My money's on Cleverly. If Kovalev is as powerful as he's being cracked up to be he'll have to prove his chin though.





Lilo said:


> Clev is far better than Boone.
> 
> Surprised at how adamant - you seem unwilling to give Clev any chance whatsoever whereas most see it as 50/50ish. What chance do you give him? The bookies are now almost identical (for what they're worth).





DaveyBoyEssexUK said:


> What if an A+ puncher is punching someone with an A+ Chin??? The power to chin ratio is a shady subject. Most are just assuming that Kovs power will win ( not knocking his boxing skills) as you have stated hes got A+ punching power. At present Kov cracking Clevs chin is all subjective.





sim_reiss said:


> Very excited about this :bbb :bbb
> 
> If Clev can keep it tight against Kovalev i.e. avoid taking clean shots without dropping his own activity/tempo, then I really fancy him to pull away in the second half of the fight.





BoxingAnalyst said:


> Buzzing for this now. Already gave my prediction, think a lot of people are overrating Kovalev here and under rating Cleverly.





One to watch said:


> Agreed
> 
> Hardest thing as a boxing fan is to wade through the propaganda and hype to the reality but I think the latter is that cleverly is a very good championship distance fighter with immense workrate,punch output and good chin.
> Kovalev for me isn't proven yet,I hold out hope for Nathan from seeing kovalev hurt a couple of times before and his seeming inability to keep a lid on his over excitement early.
> ...





Czech Hooker said:


> Clev TKO





Berliner said:


> Yep. He knew he could take the punches. A fighter know what he can take and what not. So I think he fought careless. I doubt he will be careless against Kovalev. Cleverly is a good fighter and he will Show that this Weekend I think. You clearly can see great Talent in him. Just a question if he can Show it for 12 rounds. Kovalev dont gives room for many mistakes.





Berliner said:


> I dont think so. Cleverly is a very very strong light heavyweight. He would waste that if he fights on the back foot. I think Cleverly will go to Kovalev.Punches also arent that hard when you fight on the inside. Not much room to land huge shots.





Berliner said:


> No. Fighting Close on the inside can lead to be saver than being on the outside. this is a fact. It is harder to land huge shots when your Opponent has his head on your cheest. If he can back up Kovalev it would be interestng to see if Kovalev still can be that powerful and if he can fight on the back foot.





p.townend said:


> Unless clev gets tagged and knocked out early he will win a fairly comfortable decision I think. His chin has seemed pretty solid but he shouldn't take any risks in this fight. If he keeps a tight defence and just boxes he wins.





Czech Hooker said:


> Will anyone actually give Nathan any credit when he's beaten Kovalev?
> 
> Clev is just going to be too fast for Kovalev, he'll take him apart and probably stop him. The thing about having a good chin and knowing you have a good chin is that you can fight your fight and execute your game plan confidently and without much fear. It also gives the opportunity to adjust if necessary and get in toe to toe, which can really take the edge out of a punch.
> 
> ...





PHONK said:


> Cleverly on points.
> 
> He's finally got his 'big fight'
> 
> Time for him to produce.





Grant said:


> In about 36 hours @*Bill* becomes @BandanaBill.





faz said:


> I think the workrate of Cleverly will win him a 116-112ish UD.





Bryn said:


> Just dropping in to give my final prediction for bragging rights later. :deal
> 
> Cleverly will dust off his boxing skills and show the world he his truly the future of the 175lbs division, and more than a decent engine and chin. Kovalev will be made to look one paced and lacking ideas while Cleverly builds up a lead on the scorecards, Nathan will hit the deck at some point but recover well. First few rounds Cleverly will spend on the back foot, jabbing, circling in changing directions, Kovalev tires chasing Cleverly down and then Cleverly ups his pace and takes rounds with combination punching, parrying and slipping the shots of Kovalev while effectively landing his own.
> 
> Clev PTS.





D-U-D-E said:


> Cleverly UD, let's get those headbands out fellas :ibutt





One to watch said:


> I just get the feeling cleverly will be like a man possessed trying to prove himself.
> 
> A win and his exposure could mean Hopkins on showtime under the tutelage of Freddie roach,a loss and he either becomes an opponent for the big boys or goes back to beating substandard opposition at home or bellew 2.
> 
> ...





dkos said:


> I'm not confident in making any kind of concrete prediction on the result for this one. There are quite a few questions about both fighters that still need to be answered - can Kovalev take a punch, can Cleverly box sufficiently enough on the back foot, can Kovalev handle going into the later rounds, can Cleverly take the power Kovalev dishes out, how will both handle and/or negate the others high work rate and intensity etc. etc. - which makes me wary in picking a winner.
> 
> I've tentatively went with Kovalev to break Cleverly down by the mid-rounds, but I could conceivably see any method of result happening. The only thing I can predict with any conviction is that it'll be a great fight while it lasts.





dftaylor said:


> Nathan has a better chance of winning tonight than Barker, IMO.





dftaylor said:


> That's a bit of a lazy analysis - you're really discrediting Cleverly's strengths here. Kovalev is used to guys backing off from him - he won't be as powerful with someone mugging him at mid to close range. And Cleverly isn't quite as one-dimensional as you're making out.
> 
> In terms of styles, a tidy boxer who fades down the stretch versus a high volume guy who throws from all angles is possibly the worst style for someone like Barker.





dftaylor said:


> A lot of people think that backing off from an aggressive, powerful fighter is the right tactic. In this case, and keeping in mind the way Clev fights, I think it's the wrong decision. He was cagey against Bellew because he thought that Tony could crack. Turns out he really can't and once Clev figured it out, he was all over him. What happened? Tony couldn't deal with him any more. So while he gave away rounds, hopefully he's learned from that.
> 
> Cleverly is like The Terminator when he gets going - fast hands, good combinations, a little bit of sting (but not much, obviously), and he's relentless. Kovalev is pretty basic, he likes the time afforded to him by guys backing up and he gets more leverage on his shots coming forward. If Clev takes that away from him, he can actually smother the straighter shots of the other guy.
> 
> If you think Clev has no chance, Barker is absolutely fucked. He fades down the stretch, isn't much of a puncher and dislikes guys who throw a lot of punches. Geale is the antidote to every one of those things.





One to watch said:


> Who cares and where did you get the information that the arena isn't sold out miss marple.
> 
> Plus how many people have actually said cleverly needs to fight on the back foot.surely kovalev isn't used to sustained pressure.
> Educated pressure I believe it's called.


----------



## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


>


Great work!:lol:


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Kovalev was tremendous and settled the doubts some people had about certain aspects given he was relatively unexposed, whilst confirming the utter belief others had in him to do exactly exactly what he did. 

However, some people have way too much time on their hands!!!!


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

:lol: Rob stop giving it the Barry Mcguigan just because you got a prediction right.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

Canastota said:


> Kovalev was tremendous and settled the doubts some people had about certain aspects given he was relatively unexposed, whilst confirming the utter belief others had in him to do exactly exactly what he did.
> 
> However, some people have way too much time on their hands!!!!


My prediction always had more to do with Cleverlys limitations rather than Kovalev being a special fighter. Theres still allot of questions about Kovalev and last night didn't answer them. But anybody thats watched a Cleverly fight before should have known he was not the fighter to ask those questions.


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

And people will do the same mistake when Kovalev fights Hopkins. There is no one who will beat this guy right now in the LHW division. No one.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

LuckyLuke said:


> And people will do the same mistake when Kovalev fights Hopkins. There is no one who will beat this guy right now in the LHW division. No one.


All the questions people had about Kovalev were and still are valid. We have yet to see him in with a world class fighter, who and punch and has a defence.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

LuckyLuke said:


> *And people will do the same mistake when Kovalev fights Hopkins.* There is no one who will beat this guy right now in the LHW division. No one.


Still banging this sad, piddly little drum, huh?


----------



## DaveyBoyEssexUK (Jun 8, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> All the questions people had about Kovalev were and still are valid. We have yet to see him in with a world class fighter, who and punch and has a defence.


It appears nobody has that full package at present, good predictions btw


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> My prediction always had more to do with Cleverlys limitations rather than Kovalev being a special fighter. Theres still allot of questions about Kovalev and last night didn't answer them. But anybody thats watched a Cleverly fight before should have known he was not the fighter to ask those questions.


I know what you're saying. Calzaghe got away with a lack of tactical back up from his corner because he had a natural instinct and ability to judge distance when the shit started to hit the fan. But also I've gotta say that the power from Kovalev was monstrous. I've seen Clev get hit by heavyweights and not move him. The almost casual power Kovalev had was almost too good to believe. GGG has similar eastern bloc concussive capabilities.

Was talking to some Russian journalists on Saturday night; hope the shit isn't gonna hit the fan with these guys.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> My prediction always had more to do with Cleverlys limitations rather than Kovalev being a special fighter. Theres still allot of questions about Kovalev and last night didn't answer them. But anybody thats watched a Cleverly fight before should have known he was not the fighter to ask those questions.


Nail on the head Rob :happy There was nothing that Cleverly had done to suggest he had the style to beat Kovalev


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> Nail on the head Rob :happy There was nothing that Cleverly had done to suggest he had the style to beat Kovalev


Nice one from you as well mate!


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> Still banging this sad, piddly little drum, huh?


Yeah I do think Kovalev beats and knocks out 49 year old Hopkins. Shocking I know.

At least I dindt compare Cleverly with Terminator. You also said Kovalev is pretty basic. Good joke my friend.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

I underestimated Kovalev. I knew he had power but I just wasn't convinced it was the same type of power as a Golovkin or a Matthysse. Honestly thought Cleverly's chin would be able to withstand it as long as he didn't fight like an idiot. Alas though, Cleverly fought like an idiot and was made to pay. Kovalev sparked him in the 3rd which sent Nathan backwards and from there it was game over. Terry O'Connor was a fucking melon, should have stopped it after the 2nd knockdown. Vince Cleverly too ought to be ashamed of himself, sending his own son out there to get annihilated when he must have known that Nathan was badly hurt when he had him back in the corner. Father-trainers are meant to be be over-protective, not the opposite.

Interesting to see where Kovalev goes from here now. Still not convinced by his stamina but he may have the power to bomb out anyone in the division early. Hope he doesn't become like a Golovkin in the sense that nobody in the division wants to go near him because he could be involved in some cracking fights.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

Canastota said:


> I know what you're saying. Calzaghe got away with a lack of tactical back up from his corner because he had a natural instinct and ability to judge distance when the shit started to hit the fan. But also I've gotta say that the power from Kovalev was monstrous. I've seen Clev get hit by heavyweights and not move him. The almost casual power Kovalev had was almost too good to believe. GGG has similar eastern bloc concussive capabilities.
> 
> Was talking to some Russian journalists on Saturday night; hope the shit isn't gonna hit the fan with these guys.


Calzaghe also has the size and speed to fight in that style, also he was a southpaw and a naturally more confident man.

You could see that power from any fight.

What do you mean by your last comment?


----------



## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> *I underestimated Kovalev.* I knew he had power but I just wasn't convinced it was the same type of power as a Golovkin or a Matthysse. Honestly thought Cleverly's chin would be able to withstand it as long as he didn't fight like an idiot. Alas though, Cleverly fought like an idiot and was made to pay. Kovalev sparked him in the 3rd which sent Nathan backwards and from there it was game over. Terry O'Connor was a fucking melon, should have stopped it after the 2nd knockdown. Vince Cleverly too ought to be ashamed of himself, sending his own son out there to get annihilated when he must have known that Nathan was badly hurt when he had him back in the corner. Father-trainers are meant to be be over-protective, not the opposite.
> 
> Interesting to see where Kovalev goes from here now. Still not convinced by his stamina but he may have the power to bomb out anyone in the division.


No, you over estimated Cleverly.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> No, you over estimated Cleverly.


I had faith in Cleverly's chin yes. I thought he'd be able to get through the early rounds and be able to get a decision using his work-rate. Yet again though he fought with the wrong mentality and it's cost him big time. Think he'll be in the Who Needs Him? club for a bit now.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> Nail on the head Rob :happy There was nothing that Cleverly had done to suggest he had the style to beat Kovalev


But sure something that he could ask some questions? I didnt thought that Kovalev would deal that easy with Cleverly. I thought he would do better than Campillio, Boone, White etc. But he couldnt. But well I also thought that Cleverly would step up his game wich he didnt. Got careless in round three and paid for it.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

LuckyLuke said:


> Yeah I do think Kovalev beats and knocks out 49 year old Hopkins. Shocking I know.
> 
> At least I dindt compare Cleverly with Terminator. You also said Kovalev is pretty basic. Good joke my friend.


No, just very unlikely. Better fighters than Kovalev have been unable to even put a significant dent in him. There's beating Cleverly and beating an ATG.

The Terminator thing was more a reference to Cleverly's relentless attack, but since you seem happy to contradict yourself when it comes to the value of a judge's scorecard, I'll go on the theory that metaphors aren't your bag. Unless you really thought I was comparing Cleverly, literally, to a cyborg from the future.

Kovalev IS pretty basic - nothing wrong with that. He's textbook - it's not an insult.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

PaulieMc said:


> I had faith in Cleverly's chin yes. I thought he'd be able to get through the early rounds and be able to get a decision using his work-rate. Yet again though he fought with the wrong mentality and it's cost him big time. Think he'll be in the Who Needs Him? club for a bit now.


Cleverly has a great chin. But an A+ puncher will always crack any chin no matter how strong it it. Come on man you must have watched enough boxing to know that by now?

The way to beat Kovalev is to have a strong defence & footwork, and be able to fight on the inside. At the moment that means Andre Ward.


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Cleverly has a great chin. But an A+ puncher will always crack any chin no matter how strong it it. Come on man you must have watched enough boxing to know that by now?
> 
> The way to beat Kovalev is to have a strong defence & footwork, and be able to fight on the inside. At the moment that means Andre Ward.


When has Cleverly ever proven he has a great chin? The only puncher he's fought demolished him without landing more then a handful of clean shots.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> No, just very unlikely. Better fighters than Kovalev have been unable to even put a significant dent in him. There's beating Cleverly and beating an ATG.
> 
> The Terminator thing was more a reference to Cleverly's relentless attack, but since you seem happy to contradict yourself when it comes to the value of a judge's scorecard, I'll go on the theory that metaphors aren't your bag. Unless you really thought I was comparing Cleverly, literally, to a cyborg from the future.
> 
> Kovalev IS pretty basic - nothing wrong with that. He's textbook - it's not an insult.


Come on DF. Don't backtrack and claim the "basic" comment was not an insult. It clearly was.

I think Kovalev would beat a 48 year old Hopkins but lose to the Hopkins that beat Pavlik/Tarver and was close to beating Calzaghe


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

BoxingAnalyst said:


> When has Cleverly ever proven he has a great chin? The only puncher he's fought demolished him without landing more then a handful of clean shots.


He has taken big, clean, flush shots of decent punchers right on the button and shaken them off. His punch resistance/chin is perfectly fine but nobody takes shots from an a+ puncher.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Cleverly has a great chin. But an A+ puncher will always crack any chin no matter how strong it it. Come on man you must have watched enough boxing to know that by now?
> 
> *The way to beat Kovalev is to have a strong defence & footwork, and be able to fight on the inside. At the moment that means Andre Ward.*


That's a fight I really like the sound of. Ward badly needs a fight against someone significant because HBO have apparently knocked back a couple of suggest opponents. If he's not rematching Froch then what's the point in him hanging around at SM? Go up and get involved at 175lbs I say.


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> He has taken big, clean, flush shots of decent punchers right on the button and shaken them off. His punch resistance/chin is perfectly fine but nobody takes shots from an a+ puncher.


His chin is perfectly fine? Absolutely, but you claimed he had a great chin, he clearly hasn't.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

BoxingAnalyst said:


> :lol: Rob stop giving it the Barry Mcguigan just because you got a prediction right.


Ain't it


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Come on DF. Don't backtrack and claim the "basic" comment was not an insult. It clearly was.
> 
> I think Kovalev would beat a 48 year old Hopkins but lose to the Hopkins that beat Pavlik/Tarver and was close to beating Calzaghe


How is it an insult? There are plenty of fighters with what I would call a basic style - it's a textbook style, it relies on a good jab and maintaining "correct" distance. Oscar De La Hoya had a basic style - it wasn't awfully fancy, he didn't come in with weird shots or anything and he didn't like when he was forced to fight at pace or if someone smothered his work.

Regardless, saying that Kovalev goes from beating Cleverly to beating even a 48-year old Hopkins is a bit of a stretch. To say he STOPS him is just ludicrous. The guy is touch as nails and a defensive wizard even now. It's fine smashing up guys who don't do a huge amount back, but Hopkins makes everyone he fights look awful and cuts their work down to nothing.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

Berliner said:


> But sure something that he could ask some questions? I didnt thought that Kovalev would deal that easy with Cleverly. I thought he would do better than Campillio, Boone, White etc. But he couldnt. But well I also thought that Cleverly would step up his game wich he didnt. Got careless in round three and paid for it.


I have no idea what the game plan was.
If it was to get inside and work on Kovalev's chest then you know he has no footwork to get into range which he clearly showed before in the Bellew fight. He has no lateral or head movement which could have upset Kovalev's rhythm but he can't do that either. You can'tcan't fight at mid range - which he did, because that is Kovalev's territory. If it was to fight long then his jab isn't great either - it carries no power and hasn't shown he can fight long other than parts of the Krasniqi fight, but the levels between the two are extraordinary. Kovalev also has had 200+ amateur fights, I don't know how good Cleverly was as an amateur.
His only real assets are his work rate - which being accurate and hitting real hard beats all day every day and was beaten to the jab..


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> No, just very unlikely. Better fighters than Kovalev have been unable to even put a significant dent in him. There's beating Cleverly and beating an ATG.
> 
> The Terminator thing was more a reference to Cleverly's relentless attack, but since you seem happy to contradict yourself when it comes to the value of a judge's scorecard, I'll go on the theory that metaphors aren't your bag. Unless you really thought I was comparing Cleverly, literally, to a cyborg from the future.
> 
> Kovalev IS pretty basic - nothing wrong with that. He's textbook - it's not an insult.


:lol::lol:
Again you just ignore the age factor. If you cant see that Hopkins gets older with every fight I dont know how to help you. What Hopkins did 10 years ago is meaningless. Just compare Hopkins in the Pascal and Cloud fight alone.

And how is Kovalevs power pretty basic? How is his footwork and balance basic? How is his abillity to throw bombs while moving and keeping balanced basic? How is his abillity to fight and throw bombs at every distance basic? How is his foot speed basic? How is his abillity to keep the right distance basic?

Dude seriously... Hopkins is the hardest fight for Kovalev by far in this LHW division. But you sound like its ridiculous to pick Kovalev against a 49 year old Hopkins. Hopkins cant slow down the pace like he did against Cloud. Kovalev just has too fast footwork. And I dont think Hopkins at 49 years of age can take Kovalevs power. Hopkins looked more fragile with every fight. Again: Compare the Pavlik,Pascal and Cloud fights.

And yes sometimes Judges score fights fair (wich was the case in the Hopkins-Cloud fight) and sometimes they rob people (Campillo fights). But I forgot. Hopkins beat tailor made Cloud. Kovalev has no chance.

BTW: Dawson beat Hopkins and made him cry. I dont think Dawson is so much better then Kovalev. In fact I would pick Kovalev to KO Dawson too.


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

BoxingAnalyst said:


> His chin is perfectly fine? Absolutely, but you claimed he had a great chin, he clearly hasn't.


He does have a good chin, as shown by taking shots on the button by Bellew, Murat etc.. It doesn't matter how good your chin is..if you get nailed on the chin one after another by a murderous puncher then you're getting knocked out. 
Haye-Chisora, Cleverly-Kovalev are examples.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> How is it an insult? There are plenty of fighters with what I would call a basic style - it's a textbook style, it relies on a good jab and maintaining "correct" distance. Oscar De La Hoya had a basic style - it wasn't awfully fancy, he didn't come in with weird shots or anything and he didn't like when he was forced to fight at pace or if someone smothered his work.
> 
> Regardless, saying that Kovalev goes from beating Cleverly to beating even a 48-year old Hopkins is a bit of a stretch. To say he STOPS him is just ludicrous. The guy is touch as nails and a defensive wizard even now. It's fine smashing up guys who don't do a huge amount back, but Hopkins makes everyone he fights look awful and cuts their work down to nothing.


The way you said it was an insult.

DF when will you learn. Its not all about records. Analyse the styles, the outcome is clear.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

BoxingAnalyst said:


> His chin is perfectly fine? Absolutely, but you claimed he had a great chin, he clearly hasn't.


Why hasn't he got a great chin? Nobody would take clean shots from an A+ puncher.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> He does have a good chin, as shown by taking shots on the button by Bellew, Murat etc.. It doesn't matter how good your chin is..if you get nailed on the chin one after another by a murderous puncher then you're getting knocked out.
> Haye-Chisora, Cleverly-Kovalev are examples.


Basic boxing knowledge there. Some posters seem to lack this!


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

smegmaa said:


> He does have a good chin, as shown by taking shots on the button by Bellew, Murat etc.. It doesn't matter how good your chin is..if you get nailed on the chin one after another by a murderous puncher then you're getting knocked out.
> Haye-Chisora, Cleverly-Kovalev are examples.


Don't know about good, Solid more then anything. Murat can't punch for shit at 175, as for Bellew his best stoppage win is over a shot Edison Miranda who took a few cuffing shots and rolled over. Tony has a decent dig, nothing more. Chilemba was renowned for having a bit of a dodgy beard, Bellew landed quite a few power punches and couldn't dent him.


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Why hasn't he got a great chin? Nobody would take clean shots from an A+ puncher.


:deal
Cleverlys chin is very good. Its just the case that Kovalev has ATG punching power.


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Why hasn't he got a great chin? Nobody would take clean shots from an A+ puncher.


You have to prove you have a good chin, prior to getting mullered by Kovalev when did he prove this?


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Rob is right here, Cleverly has more than a good chin; he has taken full blooded shots from genuine heavyweights and not buckled. 

Yet Kovalev turns up and barely flicks his arms out and he crumbles.


----------



## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Basic boxing knowledge there. Some posters seem to lack this!


Yep, Stephen Smith will be a P4P level boxer won't he Bobby?


----------



## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

LuckyLuke said:


> :lol::lol:
> Again you just ignore the age factor. If you cant see that Hopkins gets older with every fight I dont know how to help you. What Hopkins did 10 years ago is meaningless. Just compare Hopkins in the Pascal and Cloud fight alone.


He handled Cloud comprehensively. Schooled him, in fact.



> And how is Kovalevs power pretty basic? How is his footwork and balance basic? How is his abillity to throw bombs while moving and keeping balanced basic? How is his abillity to fight and throw bombs at every distance basic? How is his foot speed basic? How is his abillity to keep the right distance basic?


I think you are struggling with "basic" concepts... Footwork - Am I watching Ray Leonard glide in and out of range? No, Kovalev moves well and keeps his balance, much the same as Golovkin. This is BASIC technique and he executes it correctly. He threw bombs while moving? No, he didn't - he set his feet every time because he's a well-schooled fighter and he made sure he was a) in range and b) in position to punch. He has good footspeed, but it's not like watching Hatton back in the day - that was exceptional. All of these things are BASIC skills and he executes them correctly. It's NOT an insult unless you don't understand what the words "basic" or "insult" mean.

The power looks exceptional, but stylistically Kovalev is a basic fighter - textbook skills, fairly straight up Euro-style fighter. Nothing wrong with that - it worked for Mikkel Kessler, didn't it? He was as basic as they come!



> Dude seriously... Hopkins is the hardest fight for Kovalev by far in this LHW division. But you sound like its ridiculous to pick Kovalev against a 49 year old Hopkins.


No it's ridiculous to suggest there's ample evidence of Kovalev's ability to stop Hopkins.



> Hopkins cant slow down the pace like he did against Cloud. Kovalev just has too fast footwork.


Hopkins used his feet and engaged on the inside to nullify Cloud. We haven't seen Kovalev on the inside much, most guys just try and hold on. Regardless, having "fast feet" (and they're not THAT fast) doesn't win a fight if the other guy is constantly out of position for your shots.



> And I dont think Hopkins at 49 years of age can take Kovalevs power. Hopkins looked more fragile with every fight. Again: Compare the Pavlik,Pascal and Cloud fights.


He has to deliver that power without getting held, without getting countered with that nasty right hand, and without Hopkins slipping away. It's not like Bernard will stand right in front of Kovalev - he'll be stepping to the side, making the Russian punch across himself where his power is diminished.



> And yes sometimes Judges score fights fair (wich was the case in the Hopkins-Cloud fight) and sometimes they rob people (Campillo fights). But I forgot. Hopkins beat tailor made Cloud. Kovalev has no chance.


I didn't think Campillo "schooled" Cloud at the time (although he did win, I'd say). he fought a negative, cagey fight and came out on the wrong side of the decision. Hopkins trounced Cloud and had him looking like a fool. All IMO, obviously. Regardless, to use an old trope - styles make fights. Cloud could give Kovalev issues with his aggression, for example.



> *BTW: Dawson beat Hopkins and made him cry.* I dont think Dawson is so much better then Kovalev. In fact I would pick Kovalev to KO Dawson too.


Childish and inaccurate. Dawson, even with his speed and workrate barely landed anything of note in the rematch. He outworked Hopkins who has always had issues with fast, athletic fighters with dynamic styles. Kovalev isn't that. The age factor does play a part, obviously, but Hopkins style isn't reliant on him being super-fast or fleet of foot.

Let's leave this alone. We clearly don't agree, you're not going to change my mind.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> The way you said it was an insult.
> 
> DF when will you learn. Its not all about records. Analyse the styles, the outcome is clear.


I always analyse the styles, but who you beat with that style counts for a lot. You got this one right, it doesn't make you Teddy Atlas.

And you inferred it was an insult. Don't tell me what I meant, I know what I meant.

***EDIT***

I was reading this before the fight - a few really good styles analysts in there felt Clev had a good shot or being competitive at least.

http://ringtv.craveonline.com/blog/180267-who-wins-cleverly-kovalev-ask-the-experts



> Cliff Rold, BoxingScene.com
> 
> Sergey Kovalev KO Nathan Cleverly: This is SUCH a tough fight to call. Sergey Kovalev can box and punch; Nathan Cleverly is quick and gets off in volume. In the end, I like the precision and amateur background of Kovalev in what should be a fun scrap.





> Lee Groves, RingTV.com
> 
> Nathan Cleverly W 12 Sergey Kovalev: It is one thing to destroy Gabriel Campillo, a notoriously slow starter in his 30s, but it's another thing to do the same to a 26-year-old defending belt-holder in his native country.
> 
> ...





> Jeffrey Freeman, www.KODigest.TV
> 
> Nathan Cleverly SD 12 Sergey Kovalev: Nathan Cleverly has good solid boxing skills, and for the past several years, they've been on display at home in the UK against mostly nondescript opponents-undefeated challengers Tony Bellew and Karo Murat notwithstanding.
> 
> ...





> Doug Fischer, Editor of RingTV.com
> 
> Nathan Cleverly UD 12 Sergey Kovalev: Nathan Cleverly will be too fast and too tough for the Russian banger. I also believe that Cleverly is too busy, fluid and mobile for Sergey Kovalev to crowd and overwhelm.
> 
> I think Cleverly will weather an early storm, soften Kovalev up with body shots and combinations in the middle rounds and then pressure the Russian during a strong late-rounds rally to win by close, hard-earned decision.


People get things wrong - it happens. It doesn't mean you've turned into Manny Steward cause you've picked a few. I picked Hopkins to handle Pavlik easily and everyone was telling me I was stupid. I said Mosley would beat Margarito. Then I get some wrong. People get blind spots or they just see things. There is no such thing as a sure thing in boxing.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

So Wladimir isnt an A+ Puncher... Or Lewis, Or Tyson or Tua? Or Golovkin?


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> He handled Cloud comprehensively. Schooled him, in fact.
> 
> I think you are struggling with "basic" concepts... Footwork - Am I watching Ray Leonard glide in and out of range? No, Kovalev moves well and keeps his balance, much the same as Golovkin. This is BASIC technique and he executes it correctly. *He threw bombs while moving? No, he didn't* - he set his feet every time because he's a well-schooled fighter and he made sure he was a) in range and b) in position to punch. He has good footspeed, but it's not like watching Hatton back in the day - that was exceptional. All of these things are BASIC skills and he executes them correctly. It's NOT an insult unless you don't understand what the words "basic" or "insult" mean.


I wont address Hopkins anymore but:

Kovalev throwed plenty of right hands while moving forwards (when Cleverly backed up). So yes: He did throw bombs while moving.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> At what point did some of guys say "Shit.....Rob Palmer was right"??


Why do you have to gloat so much.
Your post with everybodies quotes on who thought cleverly would win is shameful.

29 others on this poll thought kovalev would win and I don't see them all showing off like their the reincarnation of manny steward.
Kovalev was the betting favourite and you said cleverly had a 5 percent chance of winning so its no great revelation is it.

I supported cleverly same as barker because I'm patriotic and I admit I was probaly overly positive about cleverlys chances because of the unwarranted stick he has received made me so want to prove the likes of you wrong.

But well done you were right,I was wrong.

Now be a man about it please.


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## sim_reiss (Jun 6, 2012)

I was a bit of a skeptic about Kov. Looking at his record, the lack of rounds was telling and the lack of quality opposition too. I felt Clev had a good enough chin and boxing skills to be able to establish some authority. As I stated in my prediction, it was about a tight guard without compromising on tempo/intensity.

However, I rewatched the White fight on Saturday morning and it started to dawn on me that Kovalev's power was going to trouble any light-heavy and when it came to the fight you could tell Clev had the same realization. Clev fought like a man who knew he was in deep shit. Literally no other factor in the fight was relevant other than the fact that Kovalev's power was too much for Clev. That doesn't necessarily mean chin-wise too, it influenced Clev's boxing which was poisoned with tentativeness and insecurity...

No problem admitting I was bang wrong. I don't see why you're giving the Barry though Rob. I don't recall there being any derision of people who picked Kovalev, the opposite was true more than anything... :huh


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

Berliner said:


> So Wladimir isnt an A+ Puncher... Or Lewis, Or Tyson or Tua? Or Golovkin?


Wladamir NO
Lewis NO
Tyson YES
Tua NO
Golovkin YES

Whats your point?


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## Jimbob (May 26, 2013)

I'm still amazed that so many people were picking Cleverly to win, just shows how the right promotion and a bit media hype can dictate opinion to those who don't know any better.


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## dkos (Jun 2, 2012)

Rob Palmer's greatest boxing prediction results in him picking the odds on favourite to win...


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

dkos said:


> Rob Palmer's greatest boxing prediction results in him picking the odds on favourite to win...


I am not taking credit for a good pick. I am ripping those that made such a poor one.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> I always analyse the styles, but who you beat with that style counts for a lot. You got this one right, it doesn't make you Teddy Atlas.
> 
> And you inferred it was an insult. Don't tell me what I meant, I know what I meant.
> 
> ...


None of them actually picked Cleverly!


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Wladamir NO
> Lewis NO
> Tyson YES
> Tua NO
> Golovkin YES


Rosado took big shots from golovkin only was stopped by cuts. Ouma took many big shots only was stopped in round 10. Bouadla the same. Wasnt even stopped... Also Tyson faced guys who could take his shots... How about Hagler and Mugabi? Both Monster Punchers who trade many big shots... And so far who has Kovalev stopped to rank over Wladimir in punching power? 
And no Tua was a great Puncher. If Haye is one sure Tua is. Just look what Tua did to a Young Ruiz and what HAye did to a old Ruiz. Big difference. Also here Kovalev did nothing to rank over Tua in Terms of punching power and Tua also faced guys who could take his shots. But I bet Hagler isnt a A+ Puncher right?
I think there are guys who can take shots from big Punchers. History proved it time and time again.


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## dkos (Jun 2, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> I am not taking credit for a good pick. I am ripping those that made such a poor one.


Well I did pick Kovalev to win in the end, but I was still included in your 'ripping' list...


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

Berliner said:


> Rosado took big shots from golovkin only was stopped by cuts. Ouma took many big shots only was stopped in round 10. Bouadla the same. Wasnt even stopped... Also Tyson faced guys who could take his shots... How about Hagler and Mugabi? Both Monster Punchers who trade many big shots... And so far who has Kovalev stopped to rank over Wladimir in punching power?
> And no Tua was a great Puncher. If Haye is one sure Tua is. Just look what Tua did to a Young Ruiz and what HAye did to a old Ruiz. Big difference.
> I think there are guys who can take shots from big Punchers. History proved it time and time again.


No fighter can continuously take big shots from an A+ puncher. History have proved this.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

dkos said:


> Well I did pick Kovalev to win in the end, but I was still included in your 'ripping' list...


For even suggesting another outcome. Hang your head in shame!


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> No fighter can continuously take big shots from an A+ puncher. History have proved this.


First you talked about "a decent shot"... or not?
And no History showed fights were fighters took many big shots from huge Punchers. HAgler-Leonard is an example. Lewis-Tua is also. Sam with Tyson-Holyfield.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> For even suggesting another outcome. Hang your head in shame!


Yeah how could he!!!


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> None of them actually picked Cleverly!


Except for three of the four I posted and another four on the original article. Em... sure, none of them picked Cleverly.


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

Hopkins would beat Kovalev, I think. There's always the possibility Hopkins will age overnight but if he turned up in as good condition as he did last time out, he'd make Kovalev miss all night.

I also agree that Cleverly hasn't proven his chin to be great. Taking flush shots off solid punchers doesn't prove a 'great' chin, just a strong one. The way people talk about Cleverly, you'd think he'd walked through a punched like Bob Foster in the past.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

dkos said:


> Well I did pick Kovalev to win in the end, but I was still included in your 'ripping' list...


I'm guessing Rob just feels the need to make himself feel good by trying to run down others. Ignore the fact that most people were simply saying they thought Cleverly could grind it out down the stretch - most conceded he'd need to get through a tough opening half to do so.


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## dkos (Jun 2, 2012)

Seeing as Rob is having a laugh at our expense, let's have a bit of fun and do the same to him.

I knew that he was a big fan of a certain prospect a few years ago, so I thought I'd do some digging over at ESB and found this little doozy of a quote:



robpalmer135 said:


> Domestic Pacquiao maybe. Go up the weights and pick up British title at 7 weights, thats would be awsome.
> 
> Theres nothing at European level from flyweight to bantamweight.


So who was this post talking about?

Well it was the one and only...

Ashley Sexton.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

dkos said:


> Seeing as Rob is having a laugh at our expense, let's have a bit of fun and do the same to him.
> 
> I knew that he was a big fan of a certain prospect a few years ago, so I thought I'd do some digging over at ESB and found this little doozy of a quote:
> 
> ...


Brilliant.

None of us are experts and a fight like last night had so many unanswered questions.

I predicted Nathan cleverly would beat sergey kovalev on points
Gary buckland beat Stephen smith on points
Ovil Mckenzie beat enzo maccarinelli by stoppage
Jonathan Romero best Kiko Martinez by points
Daniel geale beat Darren barker by points

That is appalling but I still think I have a decent understanding of the sport.

So Ashley sexton to win 7 British titles,Stephen smith to be top 10 p4p and his claim to me a couple of weeks ago that John Ryder will be top 10 p4p.

So none of us are perfect eh.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

I was quite clearly being sarcastic!


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

One to watch said:


> Brilliant.
> 
> None of us are experts and a fight like last night had so many unanswered questions.
> 
> ...


The thing is you made your other picks based on evaluations of the fighters. With the Cleverly fight you and others made picks based on whats ifs and gut feeling. Thats why I am ripping in.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> I'm guessing Rob just feels the need to make himself feel good by trying to run down others. Ignore the fact that most people were simply saying they thought Cleverly could grind it out down the stretch - most conceded he'd need to get through a tough opening half to do so.


You really need a sense of humour!


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## Bryn (Jun 2, 2012)

Fucking hell Rob get over yourself. :lol:


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

Bryn said:


> Fucking hell Rob get over yourself. :lol:


You were the worst pick of all hahahaha

You joined a forum just to make fun of me. You think I am not going to give it back?

If Clev had won....what would people be saying to me today!


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## Bryn (Jun 2, 2012)

Notice that was the only post I made on the forum saying Clev would win?  "Future of the LHW division."


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

Bryn said:


> Notice that was the only post I made on the forum saying Clev would win?  "Future of the LHW division."


Domestically maybe!


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

dkos said:


> Seeing as Rob is having a laugh at our expense, let's have a bit of fun and do the same to him.
> 
> I knew that he was a big fan of a certain prospect a few years ago, so I thought I'd do some digging over at ESB and found this little doozy of a quote:
> 
> ...


:rofl


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> You really need a sense of humour!


Rob - it was funny for about three posts, you're just coming across as a douchebag. People not finding it funny doesn't mean they lack a sense of humour, it means it's just not very funny. You got your credit, but it's just getting tired.


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## Bryn (Jun 2, 2012)

"You joined a forum to make fun of me"


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## Stunkie (Jun 4, 2013)

Stunkie said:


> Cleverly ud
> 
> Think Clev will set a furious pace and test the Russians stamina, Clev has a great chin and I don't see Clev being floored even if he is tagged and this will test kovalevs heart. I see Clev fighting in bursts in and out quickly. The only way I see Clev losing is if he loses the head and starts standing and trading.


Clearly I was being sarcastic here Rob :smile


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## Jack (Jul 29, 2012)

I don't know why fans boast when they make a good pick or mock others when they get it wrong. Who cares? If boxing was easy to predict, it wouldn't be a fun sport. I'm sure we've all made shocking picks at times.


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

Bryn said:


> "You joined a forum to make fun of me"


:lol: wtf


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

Jack said:


> I don't know why fans boast when they make a good pick or mock others when they get it wrong. Who cares? If boxing was easy to predict, it wouldn't be a fun sport. I'm sure we've all made shocking picks at times.


that fight was easy to predict.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> Rob - it was funny for about three posts, you're just coming across as a douchebag. People not finding it funny doesn't mean they lack a sense of humour, it means it's just not very funny. You got your credit, but it's just getting tired.


Fair enough.

There is a difference between Mosley v Margorito/Pavlik v Hopkins and this fight by the way!


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## Spangled Orpington (Aug 19, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> You joined a forum just to make fun of me


:lol:


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## Spangled Orpington (Aug 19, 2013)

Was it this forum Rob?


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Fair enough.
> 
> There is a difference between Mosley v Margorito/Pavlik v Hopkins and this fight by the way!


Yeah, I picked two prohibitive underdogs to win and you picked the betting favourite. Hardly Holyfield-Tyson, was it?


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> Yeah, I picked two prohibitive underdogs to win and you picked the betting favourite. Hardly Holyfield-Tyson, was it?


The worst mistake we made is to think that Cleverly would step up his game... He couldnt. And I even didnt say that Cleverly would win just that it could be a Close fight.:lol:


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## norfolkinchance (Jun 9, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Wladamir NO
> Lewis NO
> Tyson YES
> Tua NO
> ...


can we define puncher?

i would say lewis certainly and possibly wlad have more power than tyson. tyson hurt people through speed and people not seeing the punches. not sheer ferocious power imo.

so if we are talking just power and not considering anything else eg speed, technique etc i disagree with your post. and surprised to see golovkin get an aplus when others did not


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

norfolkinchance said:


> can we define puncher?
> 
> i would say lewis certainly and possibly wlad have more power than tyson. tyson hurt people through speed and people not seeing the punches. not sheer ferocious power imo.
> 
> so if we are talking just power and not considering anything else eg speed, technique etc i disagree with your post. and surprised to see golovkin get an aplus when others did not


In his opinion Kovalev already is a more proven Puncher than Tua, Wladimir, Lewis. Also Golovkin already faced guys which he couldnt stop although he landed many good shots.


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## Spangled Orpington (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> The worst mistake we made is to think that Cleverly would step up his game... He couldnt. And I even didnt say that Cleverly would win just that it could be a Close fight.:lol:


The 'worst mistake we made' was not listening to Rob :nono


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## Crean (May 19, 2013)

Im not sure whats going on in here, but if you look at the poll most people picked the right outcome (myself included).


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

Crean said:


> Im not sure whats going on in here, but if you look at the poll most people picked the right outcome (myself included).


It was 50/50.
So Rob has a point. In reality it was not a 50/50 fight. Thats clear now.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

LuckyLuke said:


> It was 50/50.
> So Rob has a point. In reality it was not a 50/50 fight. Thats clear now.


Was clear 4 months ago.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> Yeah, I picked two prohibitive underdogs to win and you picked the betting favourite. Hardly Holyfield-Tyson, was it?


I am not taking credit for being right. I am ripping you for being so wrong!


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> In his opinion Kovalev already is a more proven Puncher than Tua, Wladimir, Lewis. Also Golovkin already faced guys which he couldnt stop although he landed many good shots.


You don't speak for me.


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Was clear 4 months ago.


I picked Kovalev by UD.:lol:
Thought Cleverly could take Kovalevs power.


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## Crean (May 19, 2013)

LuckyLuke said:


> It was 50/50.
> So Rob has a point. In reality it was not a 50/50 fight. Thats clear now.


Thats the way I saw it too. You can check my comments pre -fight in this prediction thread.

I think my exact words were 'I can only see one outcome here, and thats a Kovalev KO/TKO victory. Or maybe im missing something?'.

But as I said, lots of us saw it that way, I think most unbiased people saw it that way and the poll reflects that really.(when you take into account that its a british forum with many welsh posters)


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

norfolkinchance said:


> can we define puncher?
> 
> i would say lewis certainly and possibly wlad have more power than tyson. tyson hurt people through speed and people not seeing the punches. not sheer ferocious power imo.
> 
> so if we are talking just power and not considering anything else eg speed, technique etc i disagree with your post. and surprised to see golovkin get an aplus when others did not


An A+ Puncher is somebody that can hurt you with both hands, that can hurt you with cuffing shots that don't even clean. If they hit you im the right spot to the body or chin your in trouble.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

Crean said:


> Thats the way I saw it too. You can check my comments pre -fight in this prediction thread.
> 
> I think my exact words were 'I can only see one outcome here, and thats a Kovalev KO/TKO victory. Or maybe im missing something?'.
> 
> But as I said, lots of us saw it that way, I think most unbiased people saw it that way and the poll reflects that really.


Rob even picked on People who thought that Cleverly could be competitive. But well this is a Highlight for him.:lol:


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

LuckyLuke said:


> I picked Kovalev by UD.:lol:
> Thought Cleverly could take Kovalevs power.


Thats fair enough. Any fighter can come in to close the show and not get hit clean.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> An A+ Puncher is somebody that can hurt you with both hands, that can hurt you with cuffing shots that don't even clean. If they hit you im the right spot to the body or chin your in trouble.


What have Golovkin and kovalev shown to rank over Lewis, Wladimir or Tua??? And even Tyson (as you said an A+ Puncher) had opponents who could handel his power. Just like Golovkin.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> Rob even picked on People who thought that Cleverly could be competitive. But well this is a Highlight for him.:lol:


Yeh. Because it was a poor prediction! It waa clear from there styles and previous fights this was an easy win for Kovalev.


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## Crean (May 19, 2013)

Kovalev was fucking immense with both hands and throwing combos on Saturday. I was really impressed with his performance (even though Ive never rated Cleverly as a true world level operator). Kovalelv will be a match for anyone at that weight. He will be ducked.


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## Elmo (Jun 14, 2013)

Clev was always getting his shit pushed in.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> What have Golovkin and kovalev shown to rank over Lewis, Wladimir or Tua??? And even Tyson (as you said an A+ Puncher) had opponents who could handel his power. Just like Golovkin.


Wlad & Lewis have hit enough guys clean and dished out punishment for 12 rounds without them topling. Tyson had major size advantages in his career. I havent watched enough Tua to be honest.

Golovkin went rounda while he was on the rise. He is more powerful now.

Dont talk for me ever again!


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Dont talk for me ever again!


? What? You can be sure that at one Point both Golovkin and Kovalev will face an Opponent who can handle theire power. And then they wont look that good. Just like when Tyson faced Holyfield.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Crean said:


> Kovalev was fucking immense with both hands and throwing combos on Saturday. I was really impressed with his performance (even though Ive never rated Cleverly as a true world level operator). Kovalelv will be a match for anyone at that weight. He will be ducked.


Kovalev is still very beatable, for the very reasons people listed in this thread. Keep it long range for 4 rounds, use the jab and fight at a high pace while not getting hit. Its just crazy that people all of a sudden thought Cleverly was a world class fighter with a great jab and defence, when all along we could see he was just a tall, fast guy that threw allot of shots with a decent chin


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Kovalev is still very beatable, for the very reasons people listed in this thread. Keep it long range for 4 rounds, use the jab and fight at a high pace while not getting hit. Its just crazy that people all of a sudden thought Cleverly was a world class fighter with a great jab and defence, when all along we could see he was just a tall, fast guy that threw allot of shots with a decent chin


Cleverly showed a good defense in the first two rounds. But he decided to open in round three wich was way to soon.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> Cleverly showed a good defense in the first two rounds. But he decided to open in round three wich was way to soon.


No he didn't!!!! A journeyman can survive 2 rounds without getting hit clean. Thats really not what the art of boxing is all about.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> No he didn't!!!!


He wasnt hit clean? What the fuck are you talking????? At round three he began to get Close and to throw more than a jab. HE also began to stand in front of Kovalev wich he didnt in the first two rounds. Watch the fight. Was Cleverly hit clean by Kovalev in the first two rounds or not? No he wasnt. So the defense wasnt bad for me.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> No he didn't!!!! A journeyman can survive 2 rounds without getting hit clean. Thats really not what the art of boxing is all about.


Boxing is about not getting hit clean? He took the shots on the gloves and didnt stayed in fron of Kovalev. And if a journeyman can survive two rounds against Kovalev without getting hit clean he showed a good defense in These two rounds. or not?


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## Teeto (May 31, 2012)

Cleverly has a very poor defense

On trying to not get hit by him as a strategy to beat him, well yeah obviously not getting hit by this monster would be good, but I think it's far easier said than done, because it looks like he cuts the ring down very well. Obviously Cleverley is no lateral movement man so the only thing is that the jury is out on whether Kovalev can close that ring off against top level ring generals.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> He wasnt hit clean? What the fuck are you talking????? At round three he began to get Close and to throw more than a jab. HE also began to stand in front of Kovalev wich he didnt in the first two rounds. Watch the fight. Was Cleverly hit clean by Kovalev in the first two rounds or not? No he wasnt. So the defense wasnt bad for me.


You don't know what good defence is just like you didn't know what inside fighting is.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> Boxing is about not getting hit clean? He took the shots on the gloves and didnt stayed in fron of Kovalev. And if a journeyman can survive two rounds against Kovalev without getting hit clean he showed a good defense in These two rounds. or not?


No. You are wrong. I would explain but you don't listen.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> No. You are wrong. I would explain but you don't listen.


So how do you dont Show a good defense if you dont get hit clean? Cleverly didnt stayed in front of Kovalev, had his Hands always up (he didnt when Kovalev hit him in round three) Cleverly wasnt often in punching reach for Kovalev. He avoided the right Hand by moving to the right. Cleverly wasnt hit clean although Kovalev tried! If Cleverly would have shown a bad defense in These first two rounds Kovalev already would have clipped him.
Explain please. how do you Show bad defense if an Opponent cant hit you clean? Please big master:lol: 
To the Thing with inside fighting: English isnt my first languag. I am honest: I just dont like your Little ass. Thats why I always disagree with you. Ist fun. But here I am serious! How did Cleverly Show bad defense in the first two rounds when he wasnt hit clean at all?


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Very honest talk in front of camera. Barry having Geale by one point due to pessimism and Barker saying when he went down ''i didn't wanna go out like Macklin''.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> So how do you dont Show a good defense if you dont get hit clean? Cleverly didnt stayed in front of Kovalev, had his Hands always up (he didnt when Kovalev hit him in round three) Cleverly wasnt often in punching reach for Kovalev. He avoided the right Hand by moving to the right. Cleverly wasnt hit clean although Kovalev tried! If Cleverly would have shown a bad defense in These first two rounds Kovalev already would have clipped him.
> Explain please. how do you Show bad defense if an Opponent cant hit you clean? Please big master:lol:
> To the Thing with inside fighting: English isnt my first languag. I am honest: I just dont like your Little ass. Thats why I always disagree with you. Ist fun. But here I am serious! How did Cleverly Show bad defense in the first two rounds when he wasnt hit clean at all?


He didn't show bad defense. He didn't show good defense either. Thats what you said.

Good defense is avoiding and blocking punches while in your opponents punching range, while being in a position to throw back your own shots. Boxing is NOT about not getting hit, its about hitting while NOT getting hit.

Cleverly not getting hit in the first 2 rounds had more to do with hiM being out of range and Kovalev not really going for it. As soon as the Russian opened up, it was over.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Mandanda said:


> Very honest talk in front of camera. Barry having Geale by one point due to pessimism and Barker saying when he went down ''i didn't wanna go out like Macklin''.


LOL thats a burn!


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## Crean (May 19, 2013)

Bit of a difference between Golovkin and Geale.

Truth is Macklins performance Vs Sturm was equal to that of Barkers against Geale. Only difference was that Macklin didnt get the nod from the judges.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Crean said:


> Bit of a difference between Golovkin and Geale.
> 
> Truth is Macklins performance Vs Sturm was equal to that of Barkers against Geale. Only difference was that Macklin didnt get the nod from the judges.


I never felt Macklin won that fight. Looking back its become a bit of a myth as if he won every round.

But you are right. Golovkin and Geale are worlds apart.


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## Crean (May 19, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> I never felt Macklin won that fight. Looking back its become a bit of a myth as if he won every round.
> 
> But you are right. Golovkin and Geale are worlds apart.


I dont think anyone said he won every round.

Im not that big a Macklin fan, but it was at least a draw, at the least, and personally I had him winning by a round, but knew it would go the other way because it was in Germany.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Agreed about Golovkin and Geale being different. But can see Darren's point is never nice seeing a fighter on floor in agony from a bodyshot. You don't want to be remembered for that etc. Probably is a dig at Macklin who Murray dislikes and i presume Darren does as well.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Mandanda said:


> Agreed about Golovkin and Geale being different. But can see Darren's point is never nice seeing a fighter on floor in agony from a bodyshot. You don't want to be remembered for that etc. Probably is a dig at Macklin who Murray dislikes and i presume Darren does as well.


There is something a bit more dignified about getting stopped on your feet or by a head shot.


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

My mate, who is a casual sports fan, rung me about 11am Sunday asking about Darren Barker.

He was really taken back by how nice a guy he was in his interviews after the fight.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> There is something a bit more dignified about getting stopped on your feet or by a head shot.


Agreed.

Also think people forget even i did not only was Darren having injury problems but was nearly out of sport because of thugs beating him unconscious as he tried to save someone who was getting beaten up.

Hope he's back in London for next fight. When you see him in flesh box his talent is there for all to see. Very fluid and technically sound.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Really feel bad for Geale. He goes to America fights a good fight and lays it all on the line and interviewer is calling him Gio in dressing room. To his credit he just carries on with interview. Felt bad for him there..


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## Grant (Jun 6, 2012)

Mandanda said:


> Really feel bad for Geale. He goes to America fights a good fight and lays it all on the line and interviewer is calling him Gio in dressing room. To his credit he just carries on with interview. Felt bad for him there..


And he refused to say he thought he'd won the fight when Kellerman was teeing it up for him to do so.


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## Mandanda (Jun 2, 2012)

Grant said:


> And he refused to say he thought he'd won the fight when Kellerman was teeing it up for him to do so.


Yeah i noticed that. Very classy guy not sure if people heard about what he did before Sturm fight?.

He was gloving up and noticed he was given a pair of 8oz gloves and no one had even noticed. So he told the commissioner that the gloves he was given were 2oz's to small.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Grant said:


> And he refused to say he thought he'd won the fight when Kellerman was teeing it up for him to do so.


Was very dignified. His time will come again. I think Geale will end up getting the Golovkin fight though.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> I am not taking credit for being right. I am ripping you for being so wrong!


You clearly have reading comprehension issues then. I thought Cleverly could handle the early rounds and outwork Kovalev down the stretch to scrape a tight decision. I never said it was a lock or that Nathan would make the Russian look silly, just that it wasn't out of the realm of possibility that Clev could pull it out.

And I wasn't alone in that prediction, along with quite a few other folk - including some journalists who spend much more time around the sport that either of us.

So if I got it "so wrong", so did they. You'll get fights massively wrong in the future. So will I. Difference is I won't act like a five-year old making out like I've made some great point when you do.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> You clearly have reading comprehension issues then. I thought Cleverly could handle the early rounds and outwork Kovalev down the stretch to scrape a tight decision. I never said it was a lock or that Nathan would make the Russian look silly, just that it wasn't out of the realm of possibility that Clev could pull it out.
> 
> And I wasn't alone in that prediction, along with quite a few other folk - including some journalists who spend much more time around the sport that either of us.
> 
> So if I got it "so wrong", so did they. You'll get fights massively wrong in the future. So will I. Difference is I won't act like a five-year old making out like I've made some great point when you do.


It was out of the realms of possibility.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> It was out of the realms of possibility.


And many felt there was no way Hopkins could beat Pavlik. They were wrong, it happens. Stop being such a baby over it.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

dftaylor said:


> And many felt there was no way Hopkins could beat Pavlik. They were wrong, it happens. Stop being such a baby over it.


Whats your point?


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

Crean said:


> Bit of a difference between Golovkin and Geale.
> 
> Truth is Macklins performance Vs Sturm was equal to that of Barkers against Geale. Only difference was that Macklin didnt get the nod from the judges.


The same with Murray. Those guys dindt got robbed. No way you can say Macklin and Murray were robberies. And yes I thought Macklin beat Sturm and I thought Sturm beat Murray,Geale and Soliman. Thats just how close these fights were. 
And I predict another very close fight between Sturm and Barker too. Because Barker is not above the likes of Macklin,Murray and Geale imo.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

robpalmer135 said:


> Whats your point?


Because, simply looking at styles there was no way that Pavlik could have beaten Hopkins. But some people felt that, because of his size, power and consistency (plus the fact Hopkins was getting older) that he could pull it off.

I knew he was going to win and plenty of people said I was an idiot, that I was a Pavlik hater, etc. I wasn't, I just didn't see it going well for Pavlik.

And when Hopkins won, I didn't make a big song and dance about it.

I felt Cleverly's activity and relentless approach would let him scrape a decision. I was wrong. Others were wrong. You've gone from making a good pick to simply coming over a bit pathetic.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

LuckyLuke said:


> The same with Murray. Those guys dindt got robbed. No way you can say Macklin and Murray were robberies. And yes I thought Macklin beat Sturm and I thought Sturm beat Murray,Geale and Soliman. Thats just how close these fights were.
> And I predict another very close fight between Sturm and Barker too. Because Barker is not above the likes of Macklin,Murray and Geale imo.


Outside of Golovkin its a competitive division. I actually think Sturm could beat Barker. I felt like that was a once in a lifetime performance from him and he might not be able to bring that same edge to the ring again. Remember what Woodhall said on that Sky show. He reached the top of the mountain and he had nothing left.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Outside of Golovkin its a competitive division. I actually think Sturm could beat Barker. I felt like that was a once in a lifetime performance from him and he might not be able to bring that same edge to the ring again. Remember what Woodhall said on that Sky show. He reached the top of the mountain and he had nothing left.


Sturm-Barker will be a Close fight. There are guys who say that Sturm is shot. Well he isnt. Maybe not in his prime anymore but even out of prime Sturm will give Barker a hard fight. Close UD. Fightr can go either way.
And yes Golovkin beats everybody. Sturm already knew Golovkin from Universum (they trained together) and I bet thats why he ducked Golovkin. I knew him well and he knew what this guy would do to him.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> Sturm-Barker will be a Close fight. There are guys who say that Sturm is shot. Well he isnt. Maybe not in his prime anymore but even out of prime Sturm will give Barker a hard fight. Close UD. Fightr can go either way.
> And yes Golovkin beats everybody. Sturm already knew Golovkin from Universum (they trained together) and I bet thats why he ducked Golovkin. I knew him well and he knew what this guy would do to him.


Will be interesting to see Sturm outside of Germany where he cannot steal rounds. Since he came back, he has been very clever in putting in his best work in the last 30 seconds to steal close rounds. Outside of Germany that won't be able to work.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Will be interesting to see Sturm outside of Germany where he cannot steal rounds. Since he came back, he has been very clever in putting in his best work in the last 30 seconds to steal close rounds. Outside of Germany that won't be able to work.


Yes because Close rounds sure will go to the Champion and home fighter. Sturm has to do more. He Claims that he always had to drain himself and that he was tired in fights because of that. Now he Claims that he dont has to lose that much fight. Before he had to lose 30 Pounds coming in Training camp. For is last fight he was at fight weight many weeks before the fight wich was the first time for him.

Well Nobody knows if it will improve him or not. He looked better in his last fight but that was because his Opponent was weak. But STurm really has to work more if he wants to win clearly wich he has to get the decision.


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## LuckyLuke (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Will be interesting to see Sturm outside of Germany where he cannot steal rounds. Since he came back, he has been very clever in putting in his best work in the last 30 seconds to steal close rounds. Outside of Germany that won't be able to work.


Hearn needs to pay a shitload of money if he wants that fight in england.
Here Hearn can prove that he spends money to get the best out for his fighters. Personally I dont think he will out bid Sturm.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

LuckyLuke said:


> Hearn needs to pay a shitload of money if he wants that fight in england.
> Here Hearn can prove that he spends money to get the best out for his fighters. Personally I dont think he will out bid Sturm.


Barker is the champion. If Sturm doesn't wanna come he will have to give up his sport. They only have to pay Sturm 25%. Sturm isn't going to make a massive bid when 75% of that cash will go elsewhere.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Barker is the champion. If Sturm doesn't wanna come he will have to give up his sport. They only have to pay Sturm 25%. Sturm isn't going to make a massive bid when 75% of that cash will go elsewhere.


Yeah I also dont think so. Also Sturm is his own promoter. So it would be his own Money. I really doubt it will go to purse bids. The Thing is: Barker could make 1 Million € in Germany. Could he make the same in London? Sturm got one Million against Soliman. Sturm-Barker would generate MUCH more Money. So 1 Million is a very realistic number for Barker.
But it would look bad if you go to Germany in your first defense. So I also think that this fight happens in Londond. Except Sturm really offers huge Money for Barker. MAybe 2 Million € or something like that. Then it could be hard to refuse such a deal.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> Yeah I also dont think so. Also Sturm is his own promoter. So it would be his own Money. I really doubt it will go to purse bids. The Thing is: Barker could make 1 Million € in Germany. Could he make the same in London? Sturm got one Million against Soliman. Sturm-Barker would generate MUCH more Money. So 1 Million is a very realistic number for Barker.
> But it would look bad if you go to Germany in your first defense. So I also think that this fight happens in Londond. Except Sturm really offers huge Money for Barker. MAybe 2 Million € or something like that. Then it could be hard to refuse such a deal.


Thing is Hearn will know if he wins the bids he can sell the rights to the German TV stations. He has the relationship with the Sauerlands and can go through them. If the fights in London he can still get German TV. Barker would probably do about 10,000 in London now.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Thing is Hearn will know if he wins the bids he can sell the rights to the German TV stations. He has the relationship with the Sauerlands and can go through them. If the fights in London he can still get German TV. Barker would probably do about 10,000 in London now.


The Thing is, ARD wont Show anything from Sturm. I cant imagin that Hearn can sell the fight to a Station. Sturm only fights at Sat1. But your right. Sat1 will Show the fight anyway. Dont matters where the fight takes place. But would Barker get Money from them? Wladimir got PPV Money from SKY as far I know. But I dont know if Barker would get something from the big Sat1 Money...


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> The Thing is, ARD wont Show anything from Sturm. I cant imagin that Hearn can sell the fight to a Station. Sturm only fights at Sat1. But your right. Sat1 will Show the fight anyway. Dont matters where the fight takes place. But would Barker get Money from them? Wladimir got PPV Money from SKY as far I know. But I dont know if Barker would get something from the big Sat1 Money...


Why won't ARD show Sturm?

It all depends how the deal works out. If Hearn won the purse bids, all the money would go into the pot and be split 75/25. If Sturm wins all the money goes into the pot and is split 75/25. German TV probably pay more than Sky Sports. So Hearn is gonna want that German TV cash.

If the fight were to go to purse bids the bid would be in excess of $1million.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Why won't ARD show Sturm?
> 
> It all depends how the deal works out. If Hearn won the purse bids, all the money would go into the pot and be split 75/25. If Sturm wins all the money goes into the pot and is split 75/25. German TV probably pay more than Sky Sports. So Hearn is gonna want that German TV cash.
> 
> If the fight were to go to purse bids the bid would be in excess of $1million.


 I think Sturm has an exclusive deal with Sat1. And I know that ARD also just works with Sauerland Events. Would Barker get geman TV Money even if the fight is in London? I dont know... I think Barker just would get Sky Money and Sturm gets his german Money. But I am not sure about that. I mean what does Hearn do if Sturm makes an offer for 2€ for a fight in Germany? Refuse that Money?


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> I think Sturm has an exclusive deal with Sat1. And I know that ARD also just works with Sauerland Events. Would Barker get geman TV Money even if the fight is in London? I dont know... I think Barker just would get Sky Money and Sturm gets his german Money. But I am not sure about that. I mean what does Hearn do if Sturm makes an offer for 2€ for a fight in Germany? Refuse that Money?


If Hearn won the purse bids it would overrule the Sat1 contract. If the fight goes to purse bids all the money goes into a pot.

If Sturm makes an offer of $2million then Barker makes $1.5million and all are happy.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> If Hearn won the purse bids it would overrule the Sat1 contract. If the fight goes to purse bids all the money goes into a pot.
> 
> If Sturm makes an offer of $2million then Barker makes $1.5million and all are happy.


How does it overrule the Sat1 contract? Sturm has a contract with Sat1 that he only fights on theire channel. (of course only for german TV). The outcome of the purse bid wont Change that. This is a contract between Sat1 and Sturm. Not Barker and Sturm. But well this is OT anyway.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> How does it overrule the Sat1 contract? Sturm has a contract with Sat1 that he only fights on theire channel. (of course only for german TV). The outcome of the purse bid wont Change that. This is a contract between Sat1 and Sturm. Not Barker and Sturm. But well this is OT anyway.


Yes it would. Who ever owns the rights to the fight would decides the TV deal.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> Yes it would. Who ever owns the rights to the fight would decides the TV deal.


Yeah for the Country in wich the fight takes place? I doubt that hearn can decide at wich german Station the Sturm fight will be if he wins the purse bid. Sturm has an exclusive contract with Sat1. This is a contract between Sturm and Sat1 alone. Hearn cant win the purse bids and then decide that this fight will be on another TV Station. Plus no other TV Station will Show that fight anyway. 
Don King tried the same. He won the purse bids for Huck.Afolabi and tried to Show it on ARD. they couldnt Show it because they already had an exclusiv contract with Sauerland that they dont Show anyother boxing Events except Sauerland Events. At the end Don King couldnt sell shit. I truly doubt that Hearn would overule a german contract between Sturm and Sat1 just by winning the purse bid.But anyway we both arent experts and this is offic Topic. Sturm only fights at Sat1 And his fight will be shown at Sat1. No matter how the purse bids (if there is one) go along.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> Yeah for the Country in wich the fight takes place?* I doubt that hearn can decide at wich german Station the Sturm fight will be if he wins the purse bid.* Sturm has an exclusive contract with Sat1. This is a contract between Sturm and Sat1 alone. Hearn cant win the purse bids and then decide that this fight will be on another TV Station. Plus no other TV Station will Show that fight anyway.
> *Don King tried the same. He won the purse bids for Huck.Afolabi and tried to Show it on ARD.* they couldnt Show it because they already had an exclusiv contract with Sauerland that they dont Show anyother boxing Events except Sauerland Events. At the end Don King couldnt sell shit. I truly doubt that Hearn would overule a german contract between Sturm and Sat1 just by winning the purse bid.But anyway we both arent experts and this is offic Topic. Sturm only fights at Sat1 And his fight will be shown at Sat1. No matter how the purse bids (if there is one) go along.


You just proved my point! fucking hell

You are wrong. Whoever wins the purse bids controls the rights for both fighters for that fight. They decide the venue, the TV channels, the gloves, the ring size. Everything. You don't need to be an expert to know this. its common knowledge.


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## Berliner (Jun 6, 2013)

robpalmer135 said:


> You just proved my point! fucking hell
> 
> You are wrong. Whoever wins the purse bids controls the rights for both fighters for that fight. They decide the venue, the TV channels, the gloves, the ring size. Everything. You don't need to be an expert to know this. its common knowledge.


And he couldnt Show it because ARD still had theire exclusive contract with Sauerland! That means theire contract didnt get overuled at all. So I didnt proved your Point at all. Not even Close.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2013)

Berliner said:


> And he couldnt Show it because ARD still had theire exclusive contract with Sauerland! That means theire contract didnt get overuled at all. So I didnt proved your Point at all. Not even Close.


That was because of ARD's exclusive contract with Sauerland, not because he didn't own the rights the the fight. If another German TV station wanted to show the fight, King would have been able to sell it to them.

You did prove my point. You acknowledged that whoever wins the purse bids dictates the TV channel. Thats the point you disagreed with.


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## Lunny (May 31, 2012)

Bryn said:


> Just dropping in to give my final prediction for bragging rights later. :deal
> 
> Cleverly will dust off his boxing skills and show the world he his truly the future of the 175lbs division, and more than a decent engine and chin. Kovalev will be made to look one paced and lacking ideas while Cleverly builds up a lead on the scorecards, Nathan will hit the deck at some point but recover well. First few rounds Cleverly will spend on the back foot, jabbing, circling in changing directions, Kovalev tires chasing Cleverly down and then Cleverly ups his pace and takes rounds with combination punching, parrying and slipping the shots of Kovalev while effectively landing his own.
> 
> Clev PTS.


:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov:kov


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## Smeg (Jul 25, 2013)

smegmaa said:


> Kovalev by KO.
> Cleverly stopped on his feet by the 4th.


:deal Deal with it


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## Danny (May 31, 2012)

smegmaa said:


> :deal Deal with it


Got stopped as he touched down on the canvas. Shit prediction.


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## Guest (Aug 25, 2014)

slow day.....bump


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## Eoghan (Jun 6, 2013)

I just can't fathom how so many people thought Cleverly was going to avoid KOvalev for 12 rounds (PS, that was my best typo ever, so I just left it as such haha)


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## adamcanavan (Jun 5, 2012)

The Rigo-Donaire thread was funnier, dft in particular was quite funny


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## Guest (Aug 26, 2014)

adamcanavan said:


> The Rigo-Donaire thread was funnier, dft in particular was quite funny


Two fights last year @dftaylor got so wrong were Rigo v Donaire & Broner v Maidana.

In fairness I though Yuri Foreman was gonna beat Cotto!


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## adamcanavan (Jun 5, 2012)

Fredo Warren said:


> Two fights last year @dftaylor got so wrong were Rigo v Donaire & Broner v Maidana.
> 
> In fairness I though Yuri Foreman was gonna beat Cotto!


Yeah we all get predictions wrong. I just found DF's funny because of how adamant he was that there was no other possible result


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

Apologies again @DrMo for putting far too much faith in Clev's chin! Although for me this was the fight that really confirmed Kovalev's power as being something out of the norm because Clev does actually have a really solid beard. Unfortunately, Kovalev had to do little more than walk up to Clev to find an opening though.

But Mr Hopkins will have watched the fight and been more encouraged by what he saw from Kovalev rather than scared.

As for Clev he seems happy to regress to mixing it with Bellew in the same head-down fashion


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## DrMo (Jun 6, 2012)

Canastota said:


> Apologies again @DrMo for putting far too much faith in Clev's chin! Although for me this was the fight that really confirmed Kovalev's power as being something out of the norm because Clev does actually have a really solid beard. Unfortunately, Kovalev had to do little more than walk up to Clev to find an opening though.
> 
> But Mr Hopkins will have watched the fight and been more encouraged by what he saw from Kovalev rather than scared.
> 
> As for Clev he seems happy to regress to mixing it with Bellew in the same head-down fashion


:lol: Its Nathan's fault, not yours!

Clev has had a strange career, his progression up to before he won a world title was perfect. Once he got the title he didn't improve, if anything he went backwards


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## Canastota (Jul 12, 2013)

DrMo said:


> :lol: Its Nathan's fault, not yours!
> 
> Clev has had a strange career, his progression up to before he won a world title was perfect. Once he got the title he didn't improve, if anything he went backwards


And the Kovalev debacle was his chance to have a watershed moment and finally get some proper training in. It seemed the hard part would be giving his old man his p45 so after doing that it seems it's never going to happen now.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

Fredo Warren said:


> Two fights last year @dftaylor got so wrong were Rigo v Donaire & Broner v Maidana.
> 
> In fairness I though Yuri Foreman was gonna beat Cotto!


Yes, not my finest hour.


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## PaulieMc (Jun 6, 2013)

I made the mistake of predicting Cleverly too, though it was more about the fact that I didn't believe in Kovalev's hype more than the fact that I rated Cleverly. How wrong I was, the man is a monster.


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