# Question for Golovkin fans, were you shocked at how average he is?



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Now that we know Daniel Jacobs beating him wasnt a fluke or off night, are you shocked at how average he is outside of being able to come forward and catch a beating?

Or do you pin it mostly on age? Golovkin got old some time between beating legendary middleweights like Martin Murray and getting pieced up by Kell Brook?


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## Jonnybravo (Jun 4, 2013)

Hi Talcum YDKSAB


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## Floyd_g.o.a.t (Jun 11, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Now that we know Daniel Jacobs beating him wasnt a fluke or off night, are you shocked at how average he is outside of being able to come forward and catch a beating?
> 
> Or do you pin it mostly on age? Golovkin got old some time between beating legendary middleweights like Martin Murray and getting pieced up by Kell Brook?


Come on man at 35 years old GGG looked pretty great and beat a 27 year old at cardio.

I personally think both fighters stock grew after the fight, both in different ways too.

GGG proved at 35 he's still got it, has an incredible chin, great stamina for his age, has excellent footwork and ring intelligence and can compete with the elite fighters in the world, not only the fringe contenders.

Canelo proved he has a great chin, although we knew he has stamina problems he done well to deal with GGG's pressure. He knows how to make rounds close and sneak the closer rounds, his accuracy and precision is second to none and GGG was unable to stop or drop him for all those who thought he had never dealt with a proper puncher before.

A draw was a fair result and the only loser was Byrd. I guess your beef is that you want to see GGG move up in weight? It's never too late, perhaps we will see him at super middleweight one day. I have no doubt that he will become a world champion at that weight class too.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Floyd_g.o.a.t said:


> Come on man at 35 years old GGG looked pretty great and beat a 27 year old at cardio.
> 
> I personally think both fighters stock grew after the fight, both in different ways too.
> 
> ...


So youre subscribing to the idea that Golovkin who has fought no real tough fights in his career outside of Daniel Jacobs and taken no real punishment has lost a step?

Frankly the only thing that impressed me was his chin and will to win.

Otherwise, defense was awful, combination punching non-existent, fairly predictable attack, was dominated any time Canelo decided to step to him and engage and generally survived with his belts by outworking a smaller man with the worst stamina issues ive seen a top fighter have since Jermaine Taylor.

Not particularly impressed no. And Golovkin doesnt need to move up, its likely he loses at middleweight very soon.


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## MadcapMaxie (May 21, 2013)

Haha fuck this troll thread.

GGG is a 36 year old pressure fighter, most pressure fighters seem to be done by their early 30's bar a few exceptions. Hagler was 30 years old when he smashed Hamsho pillar to post and only 33 when he looked significantly older and slower against Mugabi and no it wasn't because he had a step up in competition. Also although Canelo is a very talented boxer, it's hard to look good against someone who keeps running away


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

MadcapMaxie said:


> Haha fuck this troll thread.
> 
> GGG is a 36 year old pressure fighter, most pressure fighters seem to be done by their early 30's bar a few exceptions. Hagler was 30 years old when he smashed Hamsho pillar to post and only 33 when he looked significantly older and slower against Mugabi and no it wasn't because he had a step up in competition. Also although Canelo is a very talented boxer, it's hard to look good against someone who keeps running away


Candle wasn't running away. He did the same thing vs Mayweather as well as every fight he fights. He can't fight for 2 minutes let alone 3 minutes a round so he goes to the rope to take a rest. When he wasn't on the ropes taking a break he was landing at will.

What fight did you notice Golovkin decline? Martin Murray?


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

Golovkin looked great. He fought another top ten ranked P4P fighter who has ten years on him and walked him down for most of the fight.

Canelo showed some amazing counter punching combinations but couldnt put a dent in GGG who kept coming forward and limited his output with his jab.

Whatever you scored the fights thats something that none of Lara, Trout or Cotto could do for large portions of the fight.

Anyone who has attempted to walk Canelo down has usually walked onto counters all night and got themselves put down or stopped. You can single out that Angulo, Kirkland, Khan etc arent great fighters but its clearly a style Canelo usually thrives at yet he wasnt really conpetitive through the middle rounds once Golovkin had got his distance adjusted.

And yeah, sure he does rely on his chin to be effective and his defence is basically his offence but if you have that asset and it works its as good an attribute as anything else.


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## JamieC (Jun 2, 2012)

He beats Jacobs and Canelo and still these threads persist. You're a better poster than this MW


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## Gully Foyle (May 7, 2016)

Dumb thread


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## ThatBoxingGuy2022 (Aug 28, 2014)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.


Punches like this are round winning punches, forget the jabs GGG wouldnt be able to ever land a punch that clean on Canelo


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## JamieC (Jun 2, 2012)

A.C.S said:


> Punches like this are round winning punches, forget the jabs GGG wouldnt be able to ever land a punch that clean on Canelo


Jesus give it up man, GGG won in the eyes of 80%+, that's a pretty clear consensus


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## KERRIGAN (Jul 25, 2012)

A.C.S said:


> Punches like this are round winning punches, forget the jabs GGG wouldnt be able to ever land a punch that clean on Canelo


How good a punch could it have been when it had no effect on Golovkin?


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

I'm sorry that Golovkin is white, MW.


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## ThatBoxingGuy2022 (Aug 28, 2014)

KERRIGAN said:


> How good a punch could it have been when it had no effect on Golovkin?


But thats to do with GGG's chin, Golovkins jabs didnt rock Canelo and Canelos power punches didnt rock Golovkin, power punches score better than jabs


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

A.C.S said:


> But thats to do with GGG's chin, Golovkins jabs didnt rock Canelo and Canelos power punches didnt rock Golovkin, power punches score better than jabs


Power punches dont score more than jabs tbf. The scoring is on clean effective punching, if the jab is doing a better job of that than the power punches coming the other way then the jab scores more.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

This was pretty much the first time I was somewhat impressed with Golovkin.

Although his punch output disappointed me somewhat.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

A.C.S said:


> But thats to do with GGG's chin, Golovkins jabs didnt rock Canelo and Canelos power punches didnt rock Golovkin, power punches score better than jabs


Golovkin's jabs probably have as much power as many of Canelo's power punches.


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## ThatBoxingGuy2022 (Aug 28, 2014)

Chatty said:


> Power punches dont score more than jabs tbf. The scoring is on clean effective punching, if the jab is doing a better job of that than the power punches coming the other way then the jab scores more.





dyna said:


> Golovkin's jabs probably have as much power as many of Canelo's power punches.


Its true GGG did rock Canelo's headback quite a few times but Canelo's counters were beautiful, its like GGG's neck muscles won him the fight lol they literally stopped his head from flying back from hard punches


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## nvs (May 16, 2013)

I just came to for the saltyness, did not get dissapointed.


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## The Sweet Science (Jun 5, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.


No. He doesn't. This thread is cunty and full of shit.


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## MadcapMaxie (May 21, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.


Haha man people are going to remember GGG for a long time...warrior


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

:lol: Golovkin getting KO'd by any Middleweight.


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## rjjfan (May 17, 2013)




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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

A.C.S said:


> Its true GGG did rock Canelo's headback quite a few times but Canelo's counters were beautiful, its like GGG's neck muscles won him the fight lol they literally stopped his head from flying back from hard punches


You somehow continue to astound me.

'GGGs neck muscles won him the fight'

Also threads like this are why I don't want the RBRs to be all in one subforum.And there's a lot of this kind of posting in here (racial,fanboy,agenda driven shite)


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

JamieC said:


> Jesus give it up man, GGG won in the eyes of 80%+, that's a pretty clear consensus


Where did you get that from?


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

MW scores every fight depending on how it affects mayweathers resume.

Sad fuck,just watch and score the fight for fun you waste of skin.


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## JamieC (Jun 2, 2012)

Pedrin1787 said:


> Where did you get that from?


The poll on here, the poll on ESB, the collected press scores. All 80%+ in favour of GGG.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

JamieC said:


> The poll on here, the poll on ESB, the collected press scores. All 80%+ in favour of GGG.


The "could this have been a draw" poll has "draw" clearly ahead, all this tells me is that there were enough swing rounds to NOT have a clear winner.

Also that press scores post on reddit has 20 scores, the Pac Horn had around 60, has it been updated?


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## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedrin1787 said:


> Where did you get that from?


http://checkhookboxing.com/index.php?threads/who-actually-won-poll.99545/

https://www.badlefthook.com/2017/9/17/16322388/canelo-vs-golovkin-how-did-you-score-the-fight


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## JamieC (Jun 2, 2012)

Pedrin1787 said:


> The "could this have been a draw" poll has "draw" clearly ahead, all this tells me is that there were enough swing rounds to NOT have a clear winner.
> 
> Also that press scores post on reddit has 20 scores, the Pac Horn had around 60, has it been updated?


Zzz that's not saying who people thought won though is it? Every poll has GGG 80%+ so that's pretty clear on who people thought won.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

JamieC said:


> Zzz that's not saying who people thought won though is it? Every poll has GGG 80%+ so that's pretty clear on who people thought won.


Out of that 80% how many people had 7-5 scores that they thought could be a draw?


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## JamieC (Jun 2, 2012)

Pedrin1787 said:


> Out of that 80% how many people had 7-5 scores that they thought could be a draw?


If they scored it to 115-113 GGG, who do they think won?

Careful now, we are getting close to 'floored' territory


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

JamieC said:


> If they scored it to 115-113 GGG, who do they think won?
> 
> Careful now, we are getting close to 'floored' territory


Maybe we're arguing 2 different things, my point is regardless who you had winning there were enough swing rounds in there to validate the official draw score.

I think that draw score is just as valid as a 7-5 Golovkin.


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## ThatBoxingGuy2022 (Aug 28, 2014)

One to watch said:


> You somehow continue to astound me.
> 
> 'GGGs neck muscles won him the fight'
> 
> Also threads like this are why I don't want the RBRs to be all in one subforum.And there's a lot of this kind of posting in here (racial,fanboy,agenda driven shite)


Well peoples argument is Golovkin's punches looked more damaging because Canelo's head kept flying back, the reason GGG's head never flies back is because of his neck strength, the guy got uppercutted off the floor by Brook but his neck barely moved


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

JamieC said:


> He beats Jacobs and Canelo and still these threads persist. You're a better poster than this MW


He got a gift vs Jacobs and a draw vs Canelo.

Golovkin fans remain delusional i see.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

dyna said:


> This was pretty much the first time I was somewhat impressed with Golovkin.
> 
> Although his punch output disappointed me somewhat.


Really? His jab was good, kept him in the fight and of course his tenacity, chin and will but in terms of the hype about his skill coming forward he was decidedly average and defense atrocious


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## Cableaddict (Jun 6, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> *Question for Golovkin fans, were you shocked at how average he is?*


I'm shocked at how ridiculous you are.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> :lol: Golovkin getting KO'd by any Middleweight.


1 year avatar bet should the fight come off. Deal?


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## Chip H (Oct 8, 2016)

Pedrin1787 said:


> Where did you get that from?


Google is your friend.


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## Floyd_g.o.a.t (Jun 11, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.


Nah man, Triple G is like Vitali. These guys may age and slow down, but you're not gonna knock them out.


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## Chip H (Oct 8, 2016)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Really? His jab was good, kept him in the fight and of course his tenacity, chin and will but in terms of the hype about his skill coming forward he was decidedly average and defense atrocious


Your clueless. You've also got a twisted agenda.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> 1 year avatar bet should the fight come off. Deal?


All day long mate.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

Chip H said:


> Google is your friend.


We're way past that point bud but good try.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Really? His jab was good, kept him in the fight and of course his tenacity, chin and will but in terms of the hype about his skill coming forward he was decidedly average and defense atrocious


I've never been hyped about his defence, always thought it was quite average to poor really.

Thought Golovkin looked poor against Monroe, first few rounds against Murray too before he experienced that Murray couldn't counter. (add Brook)

It was nice to see the jab win the fight for him instead of brute forcing opponents who can't counter for shit.
He finally showed us his boxing is on par with the elite.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Floyd_g.o.a.t said:


> Nah man, Triple G is like Vitali. These guys may age and slow down, but you're not gonna knock them out.


ever heard of lennox lewis?

To me, it looked a couple of times like canelo hurt or at least stunned ggg...and if he had sustained the attack, I don't know ggg would have been able to keep coming forward...tell you one thing, ggg was feelin them body punches.


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## JeffJoiner (Jun 5, 2013)

Hold on. So a great counter puncher was able to make a pressure fighter think about his attack and therefore limit it somewhat, yet the pressure fighter still won, and we're bashing the pressure fighter?

More like hats off to Canelo for fighting the right fight and props to GGG for not just running into repeated counter right hands.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> ever heard of lennox lewis?
> 
> To me, it looked a couple of times like canelo hurt or at least stunned ggg...and if he had sustained the attack, I don't know ggg would have been able to keep coming forward...tell you one thing, ggg was feelin them body punches.


And Canelo will have no fear, realize Golovkin has no defense, and throw even more bombs the second go around. As we've seen many times in boxing chins eventually crack.

Honestly very worried for Golovkins health going forward.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

MichiganWarrior said:


> He got a gift vs Jacobs and a draw vs Canelo.
> 
> Golovkin fans remain delusional i see.


let's face facts...Jacobs was never NEVER getting the decision against ggg, for the same reason Lara would NEVER get the decision against Paul Williams. The guys that run boxing just aint havin it...so, though we know Jacobs won, that's the reality we have to live with...which is why I have no time for ggg fans claiming "robbery" in a close fight when ggg got the decision against Jacobs in a fight he arguably lost.

but you're absolutely correct. I was more impressed with canelo during the moments he chose to engage, than I was with ggg all night long. ggg did utilize the jab to great effect...but let's be honest, it's a MOTHERFUCKIN JAB!!...a JAB!...Not a power punch. it's supposed to SET UP the power punch, but ggg MISSED the vast majority of his power punches while walking into numerous clean powershots by canelo. and ggg got tired and he got sloppy and his defense got sloppy and he was open canelo's punches and his own punches got slower and sloppier as the fight progressed....nothing to be impressed about there. \

yes, he showed grit and he kept coming, but HE WASN'T LANDING!...I don't care if you stalk a guy all night if you're not landing and you're not throwing that much because you're tired, wtf is there to be impressed with? canelo's Achilles heel is clearly his stamina, but even so, he was able to out-do ggg in the last 3 rounds! how is it the dude with LESS conditioning can outfight the supposed seek-and-destroy warrior in the late rounds? the answer:ggg really aint that good...in reality, ggg got lucky canelo was coming up in weight and is not a devastating puncher...I could see a guy like charlo putting ggg on his ass.


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## Muffy (Jul 8, 2016)

Golovkins jab clearly lands hard enough to be considered a power punch. We've repeatedly seen what it does to his opponents. And I know compubox isn't the most reliable source but people are going on like Canelo was landing so many more power punches than Golovkin. If we are to go off compubox for arguments sake, then Saul only landed several more power punches. Hardly the numbers you would see with the way people are talking


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## Bogotazo (May 17, 2013)

Not trying to hate but even though I enjoyed the fight, there was a point in which I looked at the flaws of both and was like "these guys aren't truly great." Definitely elite, definitely very skilled, but each lacking big in one area.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Bogotazo said:


> Not trying to hate but even though I enjoyed the fight, there was a point in which I looked at the flaws of both and was like "these guys aren't truly great." Definitely elite, definitely very skilled, but each lacking big in one area.


I felt the same watching Ray Leonard vs Roberto Dooran I.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Bogotazo said:


> Not trying to hate but even though I enjoyed the fight, there was a point in which I looked at the flaws of both and was like "these guys aren't truly great." Definitely elite, definitely very skilled, but each lacking big in one area.


Shame. Canelo has all the attributes to be an ATG, but cant fight an entire round without getting tired. Never seen it before


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## Bogotazo (May 17, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> I felt the same watching Ray Leonard vs Roberto Dooran I.


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## Bogotazo (May 17, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Shame. Canelo has all the attributes to be an ATG, but cant fight an entire round without getting tired. Never seen it before


It's truly bizarre


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

If Canelo had Pryor's stamina


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## Ivan Drago (Jun 3, 2013)

quincy k said:


> i will one month ban bet any of the existing flomo golovkin haters that still remain on this forum here that either
> 
> 1. canelo will not land more punches than curtis stevens(97)
> 2. canelo will not throw more punches than david lemuix(335)
> ...





Ivan Drago said:


> I'm no "Flomo" and I like Golovkin but I'd bet that Alvarez exceeds all three of your points.


Is this guy still posting?

@quincy k

Fuck off for a month either way.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Bogotazo said:


>


I scored it a draw too.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Ivan Drago said:


> Is this guy still posting?
> 
> @quincy k
> 
> Fuck off for a month either way.


He's posting at Sherdog these days.

I miss him though.

Fierce debater and generally argued his points well.
Didn't participate in any circlejerk.
He was one of the good guys.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Bogotazo said:


> It's truly bizarre


he's weak.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

Canelo has too much body mass for his weight so thats why he gasses. Dude is small in terms of height at light middle yet weighs in as a light heavyweight on fight night.

Dont think theres a lot he can do about that though he looks like he has more stamina now than a few years back. He is also used to fighters being tentative against him due to his countering and slows the pace down but Golovkin doesnt give a fuck so he just comes at you like a T1000.

Dunno what Canelo can do, he tried to save himself for late on Saturday but basically gave up all the mid rounds for those rallys.


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## scorpion (Jun 24, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.


Terrible example, the replay showed that he rolled with the punch, barely grazed him. Besides when you fight a world class opponent and you look average, just means you are world class lol.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

I think canelo gasses because of the explosive punches he throws,also he won't throw for the sake of it.he is a precise punch picker and doesn't waste much at all.

Listen to him throw every shot,it's with great excertion and he throws multiple combinations with full leverage at all times.

That's why he gasses.


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## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> let's face facts...Jacobs was never NEVER getting the decision against ggg, for the same reason Lara would NEVER get the decision against Paul Williams. The guys that run boxing just aint havin it...so, though we know Jacobs won, that's the reality we have to live with...which is why I have no time for ggg fans claiming "robbery" in a close fight when ggg got the decision against Jacobs in a fight he arguably lost.
> 
> but you're absolutely correct. I was more impressed with canelo during the moments he chose to engage, than I was with ggg all night long. ggg did utilize the jab to great effect...but let's be honest, it's a MOTHERFUCKIN JAB!!...a JAB!...Not a power punch. it's supposed to SET UP the power punch, but ggg MISSED the vast majority of his power punches while walking into numerous clean powershots by canelo. and ggg got tired and he got sloppy and his defense got sloppy and he was open canelo's punches and his own punches got slower and sloppier as the fight progressed....nothing to be impressed about there. \
> 
> yes, he showed grit and he kept coming, but HE WASN'T LANDING!...I don't care if you stalk a guy all night if you're not landing and you're not throwing that much because you're tired, wtf is there to be impressed with? canelo's Achilles heel is clearly his stamina, but even so, he was able to out-do ggg in the last 3 rounds! how is it the dude with LESS conditioning can outfight the supposed seek-and-destroy warrior in the late rounds? the answer:ggg really aint that good...in reality, ggg got lucky canelo was coming up in weight and is not a devastating puncher...I could see a guy like charlo putting ggg on his ass.


Any close fight GGG is in, you will say the other guy won. you are full of shit and a horrible poster.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

MadcapMaxie said:


> Haha fuck this troll thread.
> 
> GGG is a 36 year old pressure fighter, most pressure fighters seem to be done by their early 30's bar a few exceptions. Hagler was 30 years old when he smashed Hamsho pillar to post and only 33 when he looked significantly older and slower against Mugabi and no it wasn't because he had a step up in competition. Also although Canelo is a very talented boxer, it's hard to look good against someone who keeps running away


GGG fought cans for most of his career and went pro at 24. He's a young 36


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

Chatty said:


> Power punches dont score more than jabs tbf. The scoring is on clean effective punching, if the jab is doing a better job of that than the power punches coming the other way then the jab scores more.


no that's not true. A clean right hook should be scored heavier than a jab.



Pedderrs said:


> :lol: Golovkin getting KO'd by any Middleweight.


With the amount of punches Canelo was hitting and countering him with, I think James Toney would have a pretty good chance at TKOing him.


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## Muff (Jun 6, 2013)

Just watched the fight again and didn't quite see this crazy amount that Canelo was landing. I kept laughing at the people saying Canelo was going to continually counter GGG's jab with the pull-counter. Don't get me wrong Canelo got some really good licks in but lets not get all hyperbolic.


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

Finally watched it properly and thought it was fairly close but Golovkin definitely won

Don't think either guy is THAT good though in all honesty


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

Muff said:


> Just watched the fight again and didn't quite see this crazy amount that Canelo was landing. I kept laughing at the people saying Canelo was going to continually counter GGG's jab with the pull-counter. Don't get me wrong Canelo got some really good licks in but lets not get all hyperbolic.


I don't think the argument for Canelo is that he outlanded GGG, but there were rounds where Canelo landed the cleaner, harder, shots yet took portions of the round off where he allowed Gennady to touch him up a bit with jabs. You could argue that Canelo won these due to cleaner, harder punching.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

Ken Barlow said:


> Finally watched it properly and thought it was fairly close but Golovkin definitely won
> 
> Don't think either guy is THAT good though in all honesty


Both guys are top level in the current scene, lets not descredit them simply to be contrarian.


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

Pedrin1787 said:


> Both guys are top level in the current scene, lets not descredit them simply to be contrarian.


Oh they're both easily within the top 10 on ability and record right now, I meant in terms of comparing them historically


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## UK fight fan (Apr 22, 2016)

This is a guy that thought Broner was the next big thing because fellow woman beater Floyd told him


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Medicine said:


> Any close fight GGG is in, you will say the other guy won. you are full of shit and a horrible poster.


well, it's not like ggg has been in a LOT of close fights...he just recently had two close fights because he just recently started fighting quality guys....before that it was a buncha bums.

a lotta people including me thought jacobs beat him, and although i'm in the minority in thinking canelo also beat ggg, i'm willing to accept a draw, so you're dead wrong about me...it's not about race...it's about his performance inside the ring.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Why does ggg still have so many fanboys?..anybody could KO a buncha bums and build up a record as an "exciting" fighter from favorable match-ups...boxing is fulla guys like that. panchito bojado comes immediately to mind. there's a ton more. clearly ggg benefitted from great promotion and having HBO on his team...but he's not the phenomenon they try to make him out to be....max kellerman likes to talk about "special fighters"...but c'mon...clearly, in reality, ggg is NO MORE SPECIAL than canelo or jacobs....and canelo was a smaller guy moving up in weight. y'all need to get off ggg's nutsack. he's been exposed as what he is... a good fighter, maybe even a VERY good one, but far from great or special or anything like that.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> Why does ggg still have so many fanboys?..anybody could KO a buncha bums and build up a record as an "exciting" fighter from favorable match-ups...boxing is fulla guys like that. panchito bojado comes immediately to mind. there's a ton more. clearly ggg benefitted from great promotion and having HBO on his team...but he's not the phenomenon they try to make him out to be....max kellerman likes to talk about "special fighters"...but c'mon...clearly, in reality, ggg is NO MORE SPECIAL than canelo or jacobs....and canelo was a smaller guy moving up in weight. y'all need to get off ggg's nutsack. he's been exposed as what he is... a good fighter, maybe even a VERY good one, but far from great or special or anything like that.


Agreed. Baffles me the fandom this guy carries when he's had an average career.

He's not even as accomplished or as skilled as Mikkel Kessler and Carl Froch.


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## thehook13 (May 16, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.





http://imgur.com/zMKvlip


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

bballchump11 said:


> no that's not true. A clean right hook should be scored heavier than a jab.
> 
> With the amount of punches Canelo was hitting and countering him with, I think James Toney would have a pretty good chance at TKOing him.


Not if the jab is more effective. Ive seen guys wobbled of jabs and not effected by hooks, the jab is effectively a power punch if used that way.


----------



## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

Chatty said:


> Not if the jab is more effective. Ive seen guys wobbled of jabs and not effected by hooks, the jab is effectively a power punch if used that way.


that's true and in a fight like Paulie vs Cotto, I can see that happening often.

But on average, a right hook will have more power and more effect than a jab. I'm not scoring a hard jab the same I would a hard right hook


----------



## OneTime (Nov 10, 2014)

Golovkin would ko Floyd in 1


----------



## OneTime (Nov 10, 2014)

UK fight fan said:


> This is a guy that thought Broner was the next big thing because fellow woman beater Floyd told him


Forget broner he was once up Devon Alexander's ass as the next big thing because Floyd said so.


----------



## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

bballchump11 said:


> that's true and in a fight like Paulie vs Cotto, I can see that happening often.
> 
> But on average, a right hook will have more power and more effect than a jab. I'm not scoring a hard jab the same I would a hard right hook


Oh I agreez its on a fight by fight basis but you can still win rounds with the jab if its more effective than your opponents offence.


----------



## OneTime (Nov 10, 2014)

Cotto usually throws his jab harder than his right hook.


----------



## MamaSaidKnockYouOut (Jun 4, 2013)

Muffy said:


> Golovkins jab clearly lands hard enough to be considered a power punch.


:rofl


----------



## MamaSaidKnockYouOut (Jun 4, 2013)

You don't win a fight by missing all your power shots and landing nothing but pitty pat rangefinder jabs.

Canelo did more damage, landed all the best punches and made Golovkin miss over and over again despite not even having enough stamina to stand upright. 

If Canelo was able to fight more than 30 seconds a round this fight wouldn't even have been competitive.


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MamaSaidKnockYouOut said:


> You don't win a fight by missing all your power shots and landing nothing but pitty pat rangefinder jabs.
> 
> Canelo did more damage, landed all the best punches and made Golovkin miss over and over again despite not even having enough stamina to stand upright.
> 
> If Canelo was able to fight more than 30 seconds a round this fight wouldn't even have been competitive.


If Golovkin punched like George Foreman and fought like Fighting Harada, this wouldn't even have been competitive.


----------



## Bogotazo (May 17, 2013)

One to watch said:


> I think canelo gasses because of the explosive punches he throws,also he won't throw for the sake of it.he is a precise punch picker and doesn't waste much at all.
> 
> Listen to him throw every shot,it's with great excertion and he throws multiple combinations with full leverage at all times.
> 
> That's why he gasses.


I think so too, he only throws at one explosive speed. Has to be more than that though, he throws so few in some rounds.


----------



## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

If a fighter isn't a defensive fighter with amazing head movement theyre shit according to some on here....


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Big Golovkin fan and MW is right in terms of what Golovkin did to impress. His chin was cast iron and his relentlessness wsa top notch. What WASNT impressive was his lack of variety in his punches and his unwillingness to attack Canelo when he was playing on the ropes.


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> I felt the same watching Ray Leonard vs Roberto Dooran I.


From your mom's uterus?


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Ken Barlow said:


> Oh they're both easily within the top 10 on ability and record right now, I meant in terms of comparing them historically


Well, Stanely Ketchel is rated like a top 5 middleweight of all-time. So is Monzon.

Come at me black and whiters :boxing


----------



## GlassJaw (Jun 8, 2013)

I thought Jacobs would put up a good fight for about 6 rounds then get knocked out. I was wrong and I thoght Jacobs won the fight. So that did change my perspective going into the Canelo fight and I went into it 50-50 or favoring Canelo by a slight margin. Being that he fought the best guy of his career and one of the best in the sport and you can't deny that 35 is no spring chicken in boxing by any means, no I'm not really shocked at his performance. There was no way he was going to go in there and blast him out like nothing. But if he looked average, what does that say about Canelo who really should have lost that fight? But now days people are way too biased for being a fanboy of one fighter or extreme hater for another fighter and that definitely clouds their judgement of a fight but they wont admit to it.


----------



## KERRIGAN (Jul 25, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Agreed. Baffles me the fandom this guy carries when he's had an average career.
> 
> He's not even as accomplished or as skilled as Mikkel Kessler and Carl Froch.


GGG needs to go the distance with such greats as Carlos Baldomir and Andre Berto, to prove his greatness. :lol:


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Agreed. Baffles me the fandom this guy carries when he's had an average career.
> 
> He's not even as accomplished or as skilled as Mikkel Kessler and Carl Froch.


just goes to show the power of the HBO hype machine.


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

KERRIGAN said:


> GGG needs to go the distance with such greats as Carlos Baldomir and Andre Berto, to prove his greatness. :lol:


the answer to your question is 'YES'...learn some respect, you bum. andre berto was a top ww and a two-time champ still in his 20's and regarded as one of the rising stars in boxing...baldomir had beaten zab judah, a top ww, and ko'd gatti who was still viable at the time, having ko'd undefeated thomas damgaard in his previous fight....floyd won every round against those two guys...a whole lot better than losing to danny jacobs and drawing with canelo alvarez, a smaller fighter.


----------



## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> the answer to your question is 'YES'...learn some respect, you bum. andre *berto was a top ww and a two-time champ still in his 20's and regarded as one of the rising stars in boxing*...baldomir had beaten zab judah, a top ww, and ko'd gatti who was still viable at the time, having ko'd undefeated thomas damgaard in his previous fight....floyd won every round against those two guys...a whole lot better than losing to danny jacobs and drawing with canelo alvarez, a smaller fighter.


You are so full of shit.


----------



## canucks9314 (May 23, 2013)

He isn't close to average. He's a great fighter and a future hofer. Fight was more about Canelo being better than I thought than GGG being worse.


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

canucks9314 said:


> He isn't close to average. He's a great fighter and a future hofer. Fight was more about Canelo being better than I thought than GGG being worse.


well, if you're right, canelo, jacobs and lara are equally great fighters and future hofers.


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

KERRIGAN said:


> GGG needs to go the distance with such greats as Carlos Baldomir and Andre Berto, to prove his greatness. :lol:


:lol which says alot since Zab Judah would be the most accomplished fighter on lil G's resume


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

What im shocked about is some like @Pedderrs who has watched so much boxing doesnt think Golovkin can be Ko'd going on his current career path of blocking punches with his face.

Paul Williams, Manny Pacquiao, Antonio Margarito ect were considered unknockoutable until deading flush shots on their faces finally caught up with them.


----------



## canucks9314 (May 23, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> well, if you're right, canelo, jacobs and lara are equally great fighters and future hofers.


This may make you uncomfortable, but Canelo is absolutely on a HoF trajectory. Being an incredibly popular fighter with the fights and resume he has at this age? It's almost already guaranteed. I mean, people talk about Cotto as a HoF first ballot lock. And they were saying that _before _he became the lineal middleweight champ. Canelo has accomplished significantly more in terms of fame and wins than Cotto had at the same age.

Lara has the talent, but not the fame. And has been unfortunate to not get the decision in what are probably his 2 best wins.

As far as Jacobs goes, anything can happen, but, Simply having a close fight with another HoFer does not get you in. Is Clottey a HOFer for arguably beating Cotto?

GGG is the unified MW champ, has like 20 title defenses with 18 by KO and been p4p ranked already for like 4-5 years. Name a fighter with similar credentials who isn't a HoFer.


----------



## KERRIGAN (Jul 25, 2012)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> the answer to your question is 'YES'...learn some respect, you bum. andre berto was a top ww and a two-time champ still in his 20's and regarded as one of the rising stars in boxing...baldomir had beaten zab judah, a top ww, and ko'd gatti who was still viable at the time, having ko'd undefeated thomas damgaard in his previous fight....floyd won every round against those two guys...a whole lot better than losing to danny jacobs and drawing with canelo alvarez, a smaller fighter.


:lol: :vom:lol:


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> What im shocked about is some like @Pedderrs who has watched so much boxing doesnt think Golovkin can be Ko'd going on his current career path of blocking punches with his face.
> 
> Paul Williams, Manny Pacquiao, Antonio Margarito ect were considered unknockoutable until deading flush shots on their faces finally caught up with them.


Hey dude, there's no question he can be knocked out. Anybody can be knocked out. What I'm saying is that there is nothing in those first 12 rounds to suggest to me that Canelo is going to be the one to knockout Golovkin. He was hit with big shots in virtually every round and at no point was there the slightest suggestion that he was bothered by them. I also don't think Canelo can improve on his performance whereas Golovkin can. People can't just 'improve stamina' over night. They can't radically change their style over night. Canelo has virtually always fought in spurts. He takes rounds off. He has to when he's putting so much into every punch. Throwing silky smooth 5-6 punch combinations must be extremely taxing for a big dude like Canelo. He isn't a Featherweight.


----------



## KERRIGAN (Jul 25, 2012)

Pedderrs said:


> He has to when he's putting so much into every punch. Throwing silky smooth 5-6 punch combinations must be extremely taxing for a big dude like Canelo. He isn't a Featherweight.


Canelo needs to watch Evander Holyfield vs Dwight Qawi I


----------



## ISPEAKUMTROOTH (Jun 10, 2014)

One to watch said:


> You somehow continue to astound me.
> 
> 'GGGs neck muscles won him the fight'
> 
> Also threads like this are why I don't want the RBRs to be all in one subforum.And there's a lot of this kind of posting in here (racial,fanboy,agenda driven shite)


Absolutely,couldnt agree more.

Theres a place for the trolling but it would be good to keep the RBRs relatively serious although fanboys gonna fanboy regardless of the place.


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

canucks9314 said:


> This may make you uncomfortable, but Canelo is absolutely on a HoF trajectory. Being an incredibly popular fighter with the fights and resume he has at this age? It's almost already guaranteed. I mean, people talk about Cotto as a HoF first ballot lock. And they were saying that _before _he became the lineal middleweight champ. Canelo has accomplished significantly more in terms of fame and wins than Cotto had at the same age.
> 
> Lara has the talent, but not the fame. And has been unfortunate to not get the decision in what are probably his 2 best wins.
> 
> ...


you may be right, but all it says is it doesn't take a special fighter to make the HOF and I always thought the hall was reserved for the most accomplished...so, is dariusz michaelzewski in yet?


----------



## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

Wow the WBF on here is just as bad as ESB, full of emotional fanboys.


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> What im shocked about is some like @Pedderrs who has watched so much boxing doesnt think Golovkin can be Ko'd going on his current career path of blocking punches with his face.
> 
> Paul Williams, Manny Pacquiao, Antonio Margarito ect were considered unknockoutable until deading flush shots on their faces finally caught up with them.


Do you think Ward could have stopped him had he moved up?


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

turbotime said:


> Do you think Ward could have stopped him had he moved up?


Oh no doubt.


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

bballchump11 said:


> no that's not true. A clean right hook should be scored heavier than a jab.
> 
> With the amount of punches Canelo was hitting and countering him with, I think James Toney would have a pretty good chance at TKOing him.


McCallum baby!


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Hey dude, there's no question he can be knocked out. Anybody can be knocked out. What I'm saying is that there is nothing in those first 12 rounds to suggest to me that Canelo is going to be the one to knockout Golovkin. He was hit with big shots in virtually every round and at no point was there the slightest suggestion that he was bothered by them. I also don't think Canelo can improve on his performance whereas Golovkin can. People can't just 'improve stamina' over night. They can't radically change their style over night. Canelo has virtually always fought in spurts. He takes rounds off. He has to when he's putting so much into every punch. Throwing silky smooth 5-6 punch combinations must be extremely taxing for a big dude like Canelo. He isn't a Featherweight.


You can say that about any fighter I listed. In Williams vs Martinez 1 he never looked in trouble. PAC never looked hurt in any fight vs Marquez, same with Margarito who looked like he was going to take that Mosley beating all night.

Chins eventually crack. If Golovkin goes another 12 rounds taking the same punches Camelot was hitting him with I'd be shocked. More shocked if we don't see a noticeabl physical decline given the abuse he's taking in these fights


----------



## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

turbotime said:


> McCallum baby!


Him too :smile.

I love watching the body snatcher too. I've been too busy to continue studying him. He'd counter defend, counter again like a champ. Threw smart combinations and always in good position. Great fighter to show young boxers. Cue @V-2 :lol:


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> You can say that about any fighter I listed. In Williams vs Martinez 1 he never looked in trouble. PAC never looked hurt in any fight vs Marquez, same with Margarito who looked like he was going to take that Mosley beating all night.
> 
> Chins eventually crack. If Golovkin goes another 12 rounds taking the same punches Camelot was hitting him with I'd be shocked. More shocked if we don't see a noticeabl physical decline given the abuse he's taking in these fights


This is Haggis territory mate.

Can Canelo KO Golovkin? Yes. Will he? I see no basis to favour it.


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> This is Haggis territory mate.
> 
> Can Canelo KO Golovkin? Yes. Will he? I see no basis to favour it.


I'm not fence sitting like haggis with his .0001% chance bullshit. I'm telling you what will happen based on my experience watching boxing. If they fight again I'm predicting Canelo ko.


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> I'm not fence sitting like haggis with his .0001% chance bullshit. I'm telling you what will happen based on my experience watching boxing. If they fight again I'm predicting Canelo ko.


And I'm telling you that you're gonna be sporting a boss Trump avatar for a year.

We on for an avatar bet?


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> And I'm telling you that you're gonna be sporting a boss Trump avatar for a year.
> 
> We on for an avatar bet?


Yep. I'm gonna ask @Haggis to let me borrow his Facebook profile pic for you to rock


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Yep. I'm gonna ask @Haggis to let me borrow his Facebook profile pic for you to rock


:lol: Pick what you like mate. Golovkin isn't getting stopped by Canelo. And you don't really think it will happen, you just want it to happen. I've been there mate. I've been there.


----------



## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

Team Cinnamon needs to quit playing and call this man.










Give us the fight we deserve.


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> :lol: Pick what you like mate. Golovkin isn't getting stopped by Canelo. And you don't really think it will happen, you just want it to happen. I've been there mate. I've been there.


Nope. That chin is going to crack. Only so much soft tissue damage a man can take. I wouldn't be surprised it happens in his next fight regardless or he looks significantly depleted.


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Nope. That chin is going to crack. Only so much soft tissue damage a man can take. I wouldn't be surprised it happens in his next fight regardless or he looks significantly depleted.


We are grossly overstating the amount of clean power punches Canelo landed against Golovkin. He only fought for 45 seconds in a round. He'll land even less in a rematch.

I'm gonna let @CuckoCuckitas choose your avatar.


----------



## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Nope. That chin is going to crack. Only so much soft tissue damage a man can take. I wouldn't be surprised it happens in his next fight regardless or he looks significantly depleted.


You mean like how Matthysse looked against Provodnikov?

Just very unsteady despite walking through some bad punches.

I don't think Golovkin looked like that and I still don't rate Canelo's power as very good.
Would be very surprising if Canelo stops him on headshots.


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

bballchump11 said:


> Him too :smile.
> 
> I love watching the body snatcher too. I've been too busy to continue studying him. He'd counter defend, counter again like a champ. Threw smart combinations and always in good position. Great fighter to show young boxers. Cue @V-2 :lol:


Mike is one of the more overrated dudes on these forums. You can blame @V-2 for that. And @turbotime just believes everything Hands waxes lyrical about.

Fact is, we've never seen another top fighter outboxed to the same degree Mike was against his dad, Sumbu.


----------



## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Mike is one of the more overrated dudes on these forums. You can blame @V-2 for that. And @turbotime just believes everything Hands waxes lyrical about.
> 
> Fact is, we've never seen another top fighter outboxed to the same degree Mike was against his dad, Sumbu.


Lol I'm just saying I love watching his skills and he does a lot of things by the book.


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Mike is one of the more overrated dudes on these forums. You can blame @V-2 for that. And @turbotime just believes everything Hands waxes lyrical about.
> 
> Fact is, we've never seen another top fighter outboxed to the same degree Mike was against his dad, Sumbu.


Ask Barrera about Papa Pacquiao :dance


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

turbotime said:


> Ask Barrera about Papa Pacquiao :dance


Or Oskee.


----------



## Deebo (Jun 5, 2013)

I don't think GGG's looked like the world beater he was since his father passed a couple years ago. Not taking away from any other fighters in the last few bouts, just saying.


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Or Oskee.


Drained :nono


----------



## OneTime (Nov 10, 2014)

Barerra beat pacquiaos papa morales


----------



## FloydPatterson (Jun 4, 2013)

GGG had better nights, where was the body punching?!?!


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

OneTime said:


> Barerra beat pacquiaos papa morales


morales beat barrera's other papa Jones


----------



## KERRIGAN (Jul 25, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> You can say that about any fighter I listed. In Williams vs Martinez 1 he never looked in trouble.


Williams hit the deck in that fight, he was floored. :lol:


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

turbotime said:


> morales beat barrera's other papa Jones


Then was slapped silly in rematches.

Mab beat Morales 3 times.


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Then was slapped silly in rematches.
> 
> Mab beat Morales 3 times.


:lol: Behave yourself


----------



## Wordup (May 16, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.


Jesus, I bet Canelo though "take that Motherfucker!!!" Only to realise that that punch just bounced off GGG.


----------



## Sittin Sonny (Jun 10, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Now that we know Daniel Jacobs beating him ...


You can pretty much stop reading at that part.


----------



## Juiceboxbiotch (May 16, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Now that we know Daniel Jacobs beating him wasnt a fluke or off night, are you shocked at how average he is outside of being able to come forward and catch a beating?
> 
> Or do you pin it mostly on age? Golovkin got old some time between beating legendary middleweights like Martin Murray and getting pieced up by Kell Brook?


So much bias. GAWD if GGG was black you'd be wearing a picture of yourself massaging his taint as your avatar.


----------



## Juiceboxbiotch (May 16, 2013)

I've been hanging out in the Brit forum a lot lately. I come back to the WBF to see threads like this and I'm instantly reminded why.


----------



## Lester1583 (Jun 30, 2012)

turbotime said:


> Emotions


Oscar's face - 1:25-1:28


----------



## Cableaddict (Jun 6, 2013)

FloydPatterson said:


> GGG had better nights, where was the body punching?!?!


Yeah, it's almost as if Golovkin was purposely trying NOT to KO Canelo.

I'm not saying the fight was fixed, of course. Oh no, not ME ! 
I firmly believe boxing is 100% legit. 
Yep.

:shitstir


----------



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Lester1583 said:


> Oscar's face - 1:25-1:28


TWO fights and Shane landed his best shots, couldn't put Oskee down or even come close. #Iron


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Lester1583 said:


> Oscar's face - 1:25-1:28


sugar shane, baby!:bbb


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Juiceboxbiotch said:


> So much bias. GAWD if GGG was black you'd be wearing a picture of yourself massaging his taint as your avatar.


why is it always about race with you people? MW didn't say he hated ggg for his color, so what makes you think he's racist?...maybe he just sees, like a lot of other people see, that ggg is very overrated and built his record by knocking off a buncha bums and retreads...that's only racist if you're a ggg fan ONLY because of his race.


----------



## sugarshane_24 (Apr 20, 2013)

Well, if GGG is ordinary, what does it say about Canelo who barely managed a draw against him?


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> why is it always about race with you people? MW didn't say he hated ggg for his color, so what makes you think he's racist?...maybe he just sees, like a lot of other people see, that ggg is very overrated and built his record by knocking off a buncha bums and retreads...that's only racist if you're a ggg fan ONLY because of his race.


I don't even care anymore. Shows their IQ level if the first thing they do to defend the abilities of their fighter is bring up race.

Loma is my p4p number 1. He must be an Albino chinaman


----------



## Strike (Jun 4, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Loma is my p4p number 1. He must be an Albino chinaman


:lol:

I'd love it if that came out as being true. You knew all along. :lol:


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Strike said:


> :lol:
> 
> I'd love it if that came out as being true. You knew all along. :lol:


I didn't. I was skeptical, I don't give a shit about the amateurs. I saw him fight and dominate Gary Russell, a guy that is a p4p talent himself and he proved it. Golovkin never has.


----------



## Strike (Jun 4, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> I didn't. I was skeptical, I don't give a shit about the amateurs. I saw him fight and dominate Gary Russell, a guy that is a p4p talent himself and he proved it. Golovkin never has.


Mate I was making a joke about the albino chinaman bit, not the p4p rating.


----------



## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> why is it always about race with you people? MW didn't say he hated ggg for his color, so what makes you think he's racist?...maybe he just sees, like a lot of other people see, that ggg is very overrated and built his record by knocking off a buncha bums and retreads...that's only racist if you're a ggg fan ONLY because of his race.


His Asianness?


----------



## Juiceboxbiotch (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> why is it always about race with you people? MW didn't say he hated ggg for his color, so what makes you think he's racist?...maybe he just sees, like a lot of other people see, that ggg is very overrated and built his record by knocking off a buncha bums and retreads...that's only racist if you're a ggg fan ONLY because of his race.


Other people here have known him longer, but I've been posting and reading his posts on ESB and CHB since 2008. That's how I know this is very much about race. And the fact that no matter who GGG has fought and/or beat, this motherfucker is still gonna be on here making threads about how overrated he is... not only that, but he's gonna word the thread title in a way that assumes everyone here agrees with him that GGG "looked average" against one of the best fighters on the planet... a fight many many people THINK HE WON.

Come on man. If it's not about the fact that GGG isn't black (something he denies over and over when he makes these kinds of hater threads about non-black fighters), then what the hell is it about? And furthermore, there aren't that many GGG fan-boys here... we are, for the most part, fans of the sport of boxing and not of one particular fighter. Very few people are on CHB because GGG started fighting. Who exactly are these threads even aimed at, and why does he think his audience is CHB, of all places? There are tons of Facebook groups and Subreddits where he can post all this gay fanboy hater bullshit.


----------



## Juiceboxbiotch (May 16, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> I don't even care anymore. Shows their IQ level if the first thing they do to defend the abilities of their fighter is bring up race.
> 
> Loma is my p4p number 1. He must be an Albino chinaman


Thats the thing though... because someone thinks the assertion in your thread is absolutely ridiculous, that must mean GGG is "their fighter".


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Juiceboxbiotch said:


> Other people here have known him longer, but I've been posting and reading his posts on ESB and CHB since 2008. That's how I know this is very much about race. And the fact that no matter who GGG has fought and/or beat, this motherfucker is still gonna be on here making threads about how overrated he is... not only that, but he's gonna word the thread title in a way that assumes everyone here agrees with him that GGG "looked average" against one of the best fighters on the planet... a fight many many people THINK HE WON.
> 
> Come on man. If it's not about the fact that GGG isn't black (something he denies over and over when he makes these kinds of hater threads about non-black fighters), then what the hell is it about? And furthermore, there aren't that many GGG fan-boys here... we are, for the most part, fans of the sport of boxing and not of one particular fighter. Very few people are on CHB because GGG started fighting. Who exactly are these threads even aimed at, and why does he think his audience is CHB, of all places? There are tons of Facebook groups and Subreddits where he can post all this gay fanboy hater bullshit.


well, i think back to floyd mayweather's career.....you mean ALL them people that hated him throughout his many years at the top of the sport were nothing more than a buncha racists? i mean, i'm like you...."what the hell was all that hate for floyd about?" but of course they kept telling us it wasn't about race at all...it was about floyd being boring or about his abrasive personality, or about the fact that he was ducking everybody...are you willing to come forward and admit it was all some racist hate directed at floyd?...and while you're at it, what the hell is all that hate for al haymon, a guy who has actually created some of the biggest fights we've seen this generation AND pays guys what they deserve for putting their lives on health on the line....that's nothing more than some racist shit for sure.

and also, if MW is racist, why does he rank loma pfp?...even i don't have loma in my top 10 pfp and people call me racist...i don't see a racist who hates white fighters ranking a relatively unproven white fighter at #1.


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> His Asianness?


lol...now he's asian, huh?...he's white when it suits your purpose and asian when that fits your agenda...


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Juiceboxbiotch said:


> Thats the thing though... because someone thinks the assertion in your thread is absolutely ridiculous, that must mean GGG is "their fighter".


He beat Jacobs controversially and drew Alvarez controversially. Besides thar given the hype and pedigree his resume is abysmal for the hype. Tell me why i should consider him more than average? Do you believe Jacobs and Alvarez to be great fighters?


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

MichiganWarrior said:


> He beat Jacobs controversially and drew Alvarez controversially. Besides thar given the hype and pedigree his resume is abysmal for the hype. Tell me why i should consider him more than average? Do you believe Jacobs and Alvarez to be great fighters?


the jacobs fight was pretty clear-cut in jacobs favor, IMO...the people giving the fight to ggg have a clear agenda.


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## ElKiller (Jun 14, 2014)

Did Hagler look mediocre when he fought Leonard? And not I'm not comparing the 4 you fucktard.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

ElKiller said:


> Did Hagler look mediocre when he fought Leonard? And not I'm not comparing the 4 you fucktard.


I have no idea what this is supposed to mean El cooner. Hagler fought a fellow ATG who would've capped a hall of fame ATG career. Golovkin fought a guy who lost 12-0 to a 36 year old Mayweather and barely beat Lara and Austin Trout and got a draw.

Please explain what your logic here Felip..sorry Phil


----------



## ElKiller (Jun 14, 2014)

MichiganWarrior said:


> I have no idea what this is supposed to mean El cooner. Hagler fought a fellow ATG who would've capped a hall of fame ATG career. Golovkin fought a guy who lost 12-0 to a 36 year old Mayweather and barely beat Lara and Austin Trout and got a draw.
> 
> Please explain what your logic here Felip..sorry Phil


Your shit's all over the place, as usual, but at least you knew "fucktard" referred to nobody else but you. Good eye fucktard,...sorry Talcum.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> lol...now he's asian, huh?...he's white when it suits your purpose and asian when that fits your agenda...


He's part Korean I think his Grandmother was Korean. I've never said Golovkin is white because ethnically he's not. Then again I'd have to ask him what he self identifies as... Not that it matters to me but real racists they wouldn't support a mixed race fighter...

Funny you accuse others of having an agenda, when your one of the most agenda driven posters on this site.


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## Chip H (Oct 8, 2016)

MichiganWarrior said:


> He beat Jacobs controversially and drew Alvarez controversially. Besides thar given the hype and pedigree his resume is abysmal for the hype. Tell me why i should consider him more than average? Do you believe Jacobs and Alvarez to be great fighters?


Check my avator, I'm a GGG fan.
IMO He lost to Jacobs but beat Canelo, i thought he was superb doing so.
I cant understand why the mods round here put up with your hate filled shit. Its clearly driven by race.

You and that shiny disco fella are absolute bell ends of the highest caliber.


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## Juiceboxbiotch (May 16, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> He beat Jacobs controversially and drew Alvarez controversially. Besides thar given the hype and pedigree his resume is abysmal for the hype. Tell me why i should consider him more than average? Do you believe Jacobs and Alvarez to be great fighters?


You could look at the fact that he put Jacobs on his ass and made Canelo run away for a lot of their fight.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Juiceboxbiotch said:


> You could look at the fact that he put Jacobs on his ass and made Canelo run away for a lot of their fight.


those are ignorant arguments that show ydksab.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> He's part Korean I think his Grandmother was Korean. I've never said Golovkin is white because ethnically he's not. Then again I'd have to ask him what he self identifies as... Not that it matters to me but real racists they wouldn't support a mixed race fighter...
> 
> Funny you accuse others of having an agenda, when your one of the most agenda driven posters on this site.


yeah, sure fella...golovkin sure LOOKS Asian, right? Most of his fans support him because they THINK he's white...they have no idea of his Asian background...and you know this and it's extremely disingenuous for you to act like you don't.

and, yes...I have an agenda...to recognize the BEST fighters in boxing. it just so happens they're ALL black. How does that make ME a bad guy?...don't blame me, blame all the black fighters who keep beating up the white fighters...blame the white fighters for not being good...I'm sure it's not BECAUSE they're white that they're not good.... I really have no idea why....but I'm supposed to throw I a few white guys to appease people like you? fuck off, dude.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Chip H said:


> Check my avator, I'm a GGG fan.
> IMO He lost to Jacobs but beat Canelo, i thought he was superb doing so.
> I cant understand why the mods round here put up with your hate filled shit. Its clearly driven by race.
> 
> You and that shiny disco fella are absolute bell ends of the highest caliber.


at least we have ONE honest guy in the house...damn, when I think of what it musta taken for you to admit Jacobs beat ggg...whooo!

and as far as ggg-canelo, look at the scores of the fight...ONE judge had it even...one had it 7-5 ggg...that's two judges with less than one swing round between them....with those kinds of margins, why would you not acknowledge a draw is very plausible?


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> those are ignorant arguments that show ydksab.


Golovkin fans smh


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> yeah, sure fella...golovkin sure LOOKS Asian, right? Most of his fans support him because they THINK he's white...they have no idea of his Asian background...and you know this and it's extremely disingenuous for you to act like you don't.
> 
> and, yes...I have an agenda...to recognize the BEST fighters in boxing. it just so happens they're ALL black. How does that make ME a bad guy?...don't blame me, blame all the black fighters who keep beating up the white fighters...blame the white fighters for not being good...I'm sure it's not BECAUSE they're white that they're not good.... I really have no idea why....but I'm supposed to throw I a few white guys to appease people like you? fuck off, dude.


Good for them they're as dumb as you....

At least you've practically admitted you're a racist cunt. People like you have ruined this forum.

So Fuck off and die of aids you racist piece of shit :good


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin fans smh


Wilfully aligning yourself with the man who ranks GRJ over Lomachenko.

A low point for you mate.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)




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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Wilfully aligning yourself with the man who ranks GRJ over Lomachenko.
> 
> A low point for you mate.


What is this politics now?


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> What is this politics now?


I suspect it is, MW.

He's talked utter nonsense in here but you'll support him regardless because he loves the brothas.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

@ShinyDiscoBall is either a shit stirring alt or mentally handicapped.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

Pedrin1787 said:


> @ShinyDiscoBall is either a shit stirring alt or mentally handicapped.


Both

I think he's a SweetHomoBama alt.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Pedderrs said:


> I suspect it is, MW.
> 
> He's talked utter nonsense in here but you'll support him regardless because he loves the brothas.


"loves the brothas"...yeah, that shows a lot about your mentality.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> I suspect it is, MW.
> 
> He's talked utter nonsense in here but you'll support him regardless because he loves the brothas.


So because we both think Golovkin is average i support everything he says? Or is because we are both black?









Let the man cook. He aint hurtin nobody.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> Good for them they're as dumb as you....
> 
> At least you've practically admitted you're a racist cunt. People like you have ruined this forum.
> 
> So Fuck off and die of aids you racist piece of shit :good


Are you a moron?...cite ANYTHING in my post that constitutes an admission that I'm racist. go ahead, show me what I said that tells you I'm against white fighters because of their race.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

Yeah I have disagreed with a lot of what @ShinyDiscoBall has said, especially like how Don King isn't a crook and his ranking of Gary Russel Jr and Lomachenko. But he's not wrong about everything he says.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> Are you a moron?...cite ANYTHING in my post that constitutes an admission that I'm racist. go ahead, show me what I said that tells you I'm against white fighters because of their race.


"All the good boxers are black" when they're not, anyone who is white and does well you claim its only because of racism.

You hate white fighters or anyone who you perceive white people as liking because you're racist.

You probably score every black fighter vs white fighter as 120-108 because you are racist.

You have absolutely no objectivity at all when it comes to boxers because you are obsessed with their skin colour....


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Pedderrs said:


> Wilfully aligning yourself with the man who ranks GRJ over Lomachenko.
> 
> A low point for you mate.


"aligning" himself?...wtf?....I guess it's war, huh? lol!!...look here, dude. I think lomachenko has a LONG way to go to prove himself worthy of pfp consideration. MW, thinks the exact opposite....so, how tf is he "aligning" himself with me?


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

Only a someone with an agenda or someone mentally ill could score Loma vs GRJ for GRJ


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> "All the good boxers are black" when they're not, anyone who is white and does well you claim its only because of racism.
> 
> You hate white fighters or anyone who you perceive white people as liking because you're racist.
> 
> ...


No, I NEVER said all the GOOD boxers are black...in fact, iin a previous post I said there are MANY good white fighters and I listed them by name...what I said was all the BEST fighters happen to be black...at least the top 8 or 9....of course that's just my opinion, but it's one that I feel is based on a very good knowledge of boxing.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> Only a someone with an agenda or someone mentally ill could score Loma vs GRJ for GRJ


I don't believe i scored it for grj...as i remember, I scored it close. one of the judges also had it a draw....


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

bballchump11 said:


> Yeah I have disagreed with a lot of what @ShinyDiscoBall has said, especially like how Don King isn't a crook and his ranking of Gary Russel Jr and Lomachenko. But he's not wrong about everything he says.


but it's an OPINION FORUM!....people come here to express and debate their opinions and views...it's OK if people disagree! we're human and we're gonna see things different...its completely fine if people disagree with me....I disagree with a lot of what's posted on here, but you don't see me going around calling everybody racist because they don't see things same as me.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> but it's an OPINION FORUM!....people come here to express and debate their opinions and views...it's OK if people disagree! we're human and we're gonna see things different...its completely fine if people disagree with me....I disagree with a lot of what's posted on here, but you don't see me going around calling everybody racist because they don't see things same as me.


That's one thing I'll agree with you on, being an idiot or biased doesn't automatically make you a racist.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> No, I NEVER said all the GOOD boxers are black...in fact, iin a previous post I said there are MANY good white fighters and I listed them by name...what I said was all the BEST fighters happen to be black...at least the top 8 or 9....of course that's just my opinion, but it's one that I feel is based on a very good knowledge of boxing.


Yeah its an opinion based on extreme bias and you know it is. 4 of the top 10 lb lb are black and one of the (Ward) has just retired, so you some are but not all or even close to being the majority. You come across as at the very least very racially biased. I'm pretty sure you're an alt as well.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> I don't believe i scored it for grj...as i remember, I scored it close. one of the judges also had it a draw....


It wanst close, not by a long shot.

Golovkin Jacobs was close, the first Kovalev Ward fight was close.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

back when pacquiao was on top of his game, before he refused PED testing, I had him in the top 3....why would I have him so high if I was racist?...using the term "racist" against people who don't share your views is fucked up... there is racism and race bias in boxing...but I think if we're having a debate and we're both basing our differing views on rational, logical analysis, there's no need to revert to that kind of name-calling.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> back when pacquiao was on top of his game, before he refused PED testing, I had him in the top 3....why would I have him so high if I was racist?...using the term "racist" against people who don't share your views is fucked up... there is racism and race bias in boxing...but I think if we're having a debate and we're both basing our differing views on rational, logical analysis, there's no need to revert to that kind of name-calling.


When you made a whole thread basically saying Loma only got any attention because he's white, well that comes across as racist. Like me if I were to say Neil deGrasse Tyson is only popular because he is black, I would be totally wrong and called a racist.

Coupled with your racial bias towards black fighters it seem makes you seem racist.

It doesn't help when people say something legitimate like when i said I found ward boring and you said "maybe dont like him because of another reason/agenda" or something like that as if trying to imply I'm racist for finding him generally boring and tedious to watch, like you did before when I told you GGG isnt ethnically white (or purely white because he isnt)


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## Chip H (Oct 8, 2016)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> at least we have ONE honest guy in the house...damn, when I think of what it musta taken for you to admit Jacobs beat ggg...whooo!
> 
> and as far as ggg-canelo, look at the scores of the fight...ONE judge had it even...one had it 7-5 ggg...that's two judges with less than one swing round between them....with those kinds of margins, why would you not acknowledge a draw is very plausible?


Because i thought GGG won the fight. That's why. Quite comfortably on my card.
I thought he was fucking ace against a fantastic young fighter.

As for admitting about who wins fights, i judge by how i see things, not who i want to win or where a fighter comes from.
I'm in it to be entertained and not on some xenophobic fan boy trip.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> but it's an OPINION FORUM!....people come here to express and debate their opinions and views...it's OK if people disagree! we're human and we're gonna see things different...its completely fine if people disagree with me....I disagree with a lot of what's posted on here, but you don't see me going around calling everybody racist because they don't see things same as me.


Yeah some of these guys may get their feelings hurt if they go to another forum. They'll find a lot of "racists" who don't just accept anything GGG does. A lot of group think takes place here.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> It wanst close, not by a long shot.
> 
> Golovkin Jacobs was close, the first Kovalev Ward fight was close.


No, it was close...grj won the early rounds and lomachenko took the second half of the fight...Jacobs-ggg was not close at all...Jacobs near-dominated that fight 8 rounds to 4. the first kovalev ward fight WAS close...coulda gone either way. I thought ward won it by outdoing kovalev down the stretch...so, you see we can agree on ONE thing.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> No, it was close...grj won the early rounds and lomachenko took the second half of the fight...Jacobs-ggg was not close at all...Jacobs near-dominated that fight 8 rounds to 4. the first kovalev ward fight WAS close...coulda gone either way. I thought ward won it by outdoing kovalev down the stretch...so, you see we can agree on ONE thing.


I really dont see it, maybe you just dont like Loma, I dunno but that thread you started was bad...

Yeah Im sure we'll have more in common than we think :good


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Chip H said:


> Because i thought GGG won the fight. That's why. Quite comfortably on my card.
> I thought he was fucking ace against a fantastic young fighter.
> 
> As for admitting about who wins fights, i judge by how i see things, not who i want to win or where a fighter comes from.
> I'm in it to be entertained and not on some xenophobic fan boy trip.


ok....no argument from me there. I'm the same way.


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> I really dont see it, maybe you just dont like Loma, I dunno but that thread you started was bad...
> 
> Yeah Im sure we'll have more in common than we think :good


dude, I have nothing against loma...I have no feelings about the guy one way or another...he seems like a pretty decent guy from what I can tell, but if we're talking pfp, he's not on my list.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> dude, I have nothing against loma...I have no feelings about the guy one way or another...he seems like a pretty decent guy from what I can tell, but if we're talking pfp, he's not on my list.


I have him in my top 10 but some way to go for him to be number 1, IMO he needs to rematch Salido and beat Rigondaux at least to be in contention. FWIW I had Ward as number 1...


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> I have him in my top 10 but some way to go for him to be number 1, IMO he needs to rematch Salido and beat Rigondaux at least to be in contention. FWIW I had Ward as number 1...


but you have to admit, it was REALLY disrespectful for teddy atlas to rank loma #1 pfp over the likes of andre ward, Crawford, Thurman, canelo, etc...that was the point of my lomachenko thread....to me it shows how fulla shit teddy atlas is, with his constant self-righteous rants against the flaws of boxing when he himself is pretty foul.


----------



## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> but you have to admit, it was REALLY disrespectful for teddy atlas to rank loma #1 pfp over the likes of andre ward, Crawford, Thurman, canelo, etc...that was the point of my lomachenko thread....to me it shows how fulla shit teddy atlas is, with his constant self-righteous rants against the flaws of boxing when he himself is pretty foul.


I dont know if its disrespectful or more just because the guys an idiot. I dont see how anyone can make a case for Loma being above Ward, Crawford is above him for me, as well. Not sure about Spence and Thurman yet, I'd have Loma over Thurman, Spence I'd probably say is a tie.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> When you made a whole thread basically saying Loma only got any attention because he's white, well that comes across as racist. Like me if I were to say Neil deGrasse Tyson is only popular because he is black, I would be totally wrong and called a racist.
> 
> Coupled with your racial bias towards black fighters it seem makes you seem racist.
> 
> It doesn't help when people say something legitimate like when i said I found ward boring and you said "maybe dont like him because of another reason/agenda" or something like that as if trying to imply I'm racist for finding him generally boring and tedious to watch, like you did before when I told you GGG isnt ethnically white (or purely white because he isnt)


the thing about loma getting attention because he's white is legit...here is a guy who has about 10 fights and he's getting all this publicity and all this hype and to me, he hasn't really earned it. especially when you have guys who HAVE earned it and loma gets ranked over them...and his performance that night wasn't even pfp worthy. what other reason can you think of that he'd be ranked #1 pfp over more proven fighters?...I'm asking sincerely because I've racked my brain and I can't think of one....so, maybe you can enlighten me.

I have NO racial bias toward black fighters....NONE. look at my post about "favorite fighters"...I have all races on my list.

and it's not about racism when I question what your real reason for not liking ward is....it's kinda like when lara challenged ggg, people were like "no, ggg shouldn't fight him, because lara's boring"...and I'm like, "that's a stupid reason for ggg not to take the fight." CLEARLY those fans were actually SCARED that lara would expose ggg for what he is...a mediocre fighter with a big punch. THAT was my reason for questioning your dislike of ward...that there are fans who hate certain fighters because they KNOW those fighters are better than the fighter they love, but instead of admitting it, they disguise their fear by citing some other reason to discredit the other guy.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> I dont know if its disrespectful or more just because the guys an idiot. I dont see how anyone can make a case for Loma being above Ward, Crawford is above him for me, as well. Not sure about Spence and Thurman yet, I'd have Loma over Thurman, Spence I'd probably say is a tie.


is it possible he has loma ranked #1 because loma is a white fighter?...I know you gonna think that makes ME racist for bringing it up...but i'm not the one ranking him #1....i'm just asking is it plausible that a guy might be more infatuated with a fighter because of his race and rank him, undeservedly over more deserving guys?...if that's the case, it proves my point that the hype around loma is partly because he's white.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> the thing about loma getting attention because he's white is legit...here is a guy who has about 10 fights and he's getting all this publicity and all this hype and to me, he hasn't really earned it. especially when you have guys who HAVE earned it and loma gets ranked over them...and his performance that night wasn't even pfp worthy. what other reason can you think of that he'd be ranked #1 pfp over more proven fighters?...I'm asking sincerely because I've racked my brain and I can't think of one....so, maybe you can enlighten me.


I just dont see that, sorry. Loma got hyped so much because it was pretty clear from his amateur days he was special, just look at his record. How many gold medals has he won? Khan was hyped over here in the UK because he did well at the Olympics and he was nowhere near as special as Loma was, then Loma got his deal with HBO and Arum and challenged for a world title in his 2nd fight narrowly losing to a guy with over 50 fights who weighed considerably more. I honestly cant see what gets to you so much about this. His skill level is blatantly something special.



> I have NO racial bias toward black fighters....NONE. look at my post about "favorite fighters"...I have all races on my list.
> 
> and it's not about racism when I question what your real reason for not liking ward is....it's kinda like when lara challenged ggg, people were like "no, ggg shouldn't fight him, because lara's boring"...and I'm like, "that's a stupid reason for ggg not to take the fight." CLEARLY those fans were actually SCARED that lara would expose ggg for what he is...a mediocre fighter with a big punch. THAT was my reason for questioning your dislike of ward...that there are fans who hate certain fighters because they KNOW those fighters are better than the fighter they love, but instead of admitting it, they look for OTHER reasons to discredit the other guy


Average fighter with a punch? Come on....

I wanted him to fight Lara, I think GGG would have Ko'd him but then he'd have got shit on for it because Lara would be coming up a division with no fights at the weight. I personally think Lara is overrated. That said still would have been a decent win and I was 100% for it. But then i dont follow fighters like they're my football team....


----------



## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> is it possible he has loma ranked #1 because loma is a white fighter?...I know you gonna think that makes ME racist for bringing it up...but i'm not the one ranking him #1....i'm just asking is it plausible that a guy might be more infatuated with a fighter because of his race and rank him, undeservedly over more deserving guys?...if that's the case, it proves my point that the hype around loma is partly because he's white.


Possibly, we know many people are racial biased towards people who look like them, is it racist? Yeah its racist to support a fighter because of their race.


----------



## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Juiceboxbiotch said:


> I've been hanging out in the Brit forum a lot lately. I come back to the WBF to see threads like this and I'm instantly reminded why.


Stay with us mate,your very welcome.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> I just dont see that, sorry. Loma got hyped so much because it was pretty clear from his amateur days he was special, just look at his record. How many gold medals has he won? Khan was hyped over here in the UK because he did well at the Olympics and he was nowhere near as special as Loma was, then Loma got his deal with HBO and Arum and challenged for a world title in his 2nd fight narrowly losing to a guy with over 50 fights who weighed considerably more. I honestly cant see what gets to you so much about this. His skill level is blatantly something special.
> 
> Average fighter with a punch? Come on....
> 
> I wanted him to fight Lara, I think GGG would have Ko'd him but then he'd have got shit on for it because Lara would be coming up a division with no fights at the weight. I personally think Lara is overrated. That said still would have been a decent win and I was 100% for it. But then i dont follow fighters like they're my football team....


yeah, we know other fighters with great amateur pedigree...guys like rigo for example...how come teddy didn't try and label HIM the #1 pfp after he dominated donaire? I mean, doesn't rigo have as many gold medals as loma?...so, the argument that loma's amateur background was so strong it marked him as a special fighter who deserved to leapfrog over pfp guys with more accomplished records in the pro ranks INCLUDING RIGO, I'm not buying it...

if you're gonna be fair, you have to admit that either the justification given is bullshit or there's ANOTHER reason!...the actual justification is just not being discussed because the whole conversation is a dishonest one...either that or guys are refusing to see the whole picture.

my whole point is, If you're gonna say "loma was such a special amateur that he fought for a title in his third pro fight", I'm like "sure, but he LOST"...to SALIDO! a guy he was supposed to beat on the strength of loma's vast talent and amateur experience. So, how does that get him ranked over rigo?...ok, so if you want to consider the grj fight, fine. I think donaire was the better win. if you want to talk about walters, I think agbeko's name is AT LEAST of equal status...so, I can't justify anybody ranking loma #1 if they know about boxing unless there's some reason other than his ability in the ring....it's the process of elimination.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

hey y'all, I know there are people out there who will NEVER admit that there's racist motives for the way they or others rank fighters...they deliberately and purposefully circumvent a rationalization that leads to racist motives and actively look for a justification that's not racist, even if they have to twist themselves into a pretzel making that argument, which even so, still doesn't stand up to a little scrutiny....sorry, but I stand by what I said about loma after the marriaga fight....the whole attempt to elevate him to undeserved levels of stardom is based on his race.


----------



## Kid Cubano (Jun 5, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin gets Kod in a rematch.


he took that monster shot and didn't even wobbled and you predict he gets KO next.
whats your analysis?


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Kid Cubano said:


> he took that monster shot and didn't even wobbled and you predict he gets KO next.
> whats your analysis?


So what. Pacquaio was taking monster shots from Marquez for 3 fights and was never wobbled, eventually chins crack. Sustained punishment wears on fighters especially come forward sluggers of which Golovkin is more and more resembling. You will start to see a noticeable physical decline. I wouldnt be shocked he loses his next fight if he picks a credible opponent even if he doesnt rematch Jacobs or Canelo


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> So what. Pacquaio was taking monster shots from Marquez for 3 fights and was never wobbled, eventually chins crack. Sustained punishment wears on fighters especially come forward sluggers of which Golovkin is more and more resembling. You will start to see a noticeable physical decline. I wouldnt be shocked he loses his next fight if he picks a credible opponent even if he doesnt rematch Jacobs or Canelo


Jacobs gained a lot of confidence as the fight wore on with GGG. He was taking it to him in the later rounds. I think he could knock him out with the right gameplan


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

MichiganWarrior said:


> So what. Pacquaio was taking monster shots from Marquez for 3 fights and was never wobbled, eventually chins crack. Sustained punishment wears on fighters especially come forward sluggers of which Golovkin is more and more resembling. You will start to see a noticeable physical decline. I wouldnt be shocked he loses his next fight if he picks a credible opponent even if he doesnt rematch Jacobs or Canelo


it's not just the cumulative effect of punches that ko's guys with iron chins...sometimes it's a punch they don't see...doesn't even have to be that hard a shot...i've seen tough guys like nigel benn get ko'd with a jab...that's why finesse fighters are dangerous, because they're able to deliver combos from angles that will catch the other guy off step and do a lotta damage.


----------



## ElKiller (Jun 14, 2014)

bballchump11 said:


> Jacobs gained a lot of confidence as the fight wore on with GGG. He was taking it to him in the later rounds. I think he could knock him out with the right gameplan


And a baseball bat.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

ElKiller said:


> And a baseball bat.


We've both seen GGG bothered to the body. You know it's possible


----------



## paloalto00 (Jun 7, 2013)

I'm more disappointed on how much he's changed his style from his amateur days. He's very flat footed now, he used to actually box and apply pressure behind a jab instead of trying to walk everyone down straight on


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## pipe wrenched (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> yeah, we know other fighters with great amateur pedigree...guys like rigo for example...how come teddy didn't try and label HIM the #1 pfp after he dominated donaire? I mean, doesn't rigo have as many gold medals as loma?...so, the argument that loma's amateur background was so strong it marked him as a special fighter who deserved to leapfrog over pfp guys with more accomplished records in the pro ranks INCLUDING RIGO, I'm not buying it...
> 
> if you're gonna be fair, you have to admit that either the justification given is bullshit or there's ANOTHER reason!...the actual justification is just not being discussed because the whole conversation is a dishonest one...either that or guys are refusing to see the whole picture.
> 
> my whole point is, If you're gonna say "loma was such a special amateur that he fought for a title in his third pro fight", I'm like "sure, but he LOST"...to SALIDO! a guy he was supposed to beat on the strength of loma's vast talent and amateur experience. So, how does that get him ranked over rigo?...ok, so if you want to consider the grj fight, fine. I think donaire was the better win. if you want to talk about walters, I think agbeko's name is AT LEAST of equal status...so, I can't justify anybody ranking loma #1 if they know about boxing unless there's some reason other than his ability in the ring....it's the process of elimination.


Man the whole damn commentary team, and then even Bob Arum just beat on like crazy that it was SO BORING...even said some shit about Rigo going back to obscurity and shit...

Was some bull shit...


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## Juiceboxbiotch (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> those are ignorant arguments that show ydksab.


And ad hominem is what people do when they don't have a proper response for a sound argument.


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

pipe wrenched said:


> Man the whole damn commentary team, and then even Bob Arum just beat on like crazy that it was SO BORING...even said some shit about Rigo going back to obscurity and shit...
> 
> Was some bull shit...


boring is what they call fighters when they're looking for an excuse to avoid them.


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## pipe wrenched (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> boring is what they call fighters when they're looking for an excuse to avoid them.


They played it out like (even if they did consider it boring) it was all Rigo's fault. No blame given to Nonito at all...

NOW...everybody calls it one of the best wins of the modern era. :conf


----------



## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> No, it was close...grj won the early rounds and lomachenko took the second half of the fight...Jacobs-ggg was not close at all...Jacobs near-dominated that fight 8 rounds to 4. the first kovalev ward fight WAS close...coulda gone either way. I thought ward won it by outdoing kovalev down the stretch...so, you see we can agree on ONE thing.


LMAO

You claim GGG-Jacobs was a blow out for Jacobs.... Yet Garcia-Broner (Which was an actual blow out for Mikey) you barely had Garcia winning.

You have Jacobs Blowing out GGG in a close fight...Have Mikey scraping out a win in a Blow out against Broner, You of course have Ward beating Kovalev in fight 1 and had Canelo beating GGG in a fight where GGG was the clear winner.

And according to you Loma is only praised because he is white, Lara was your number 1 fighter of all time and Kim Kardashian is the sexiest woman to ever live.

Fuck off.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

pipe wrenched said:


> They played it out like (even if they did consider it boring) it was all Rigo's fault. No blame given to Nonito at all...
> 
> NOW...everybody calls it one of the best wins of the modern era. :conf


especially Agbeko. He felt the power once and then ran the whole fight not looking to open up.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

bballchump11 said:


> especially Agbeko. He felt the power once and then ran the whole fight not looking to open up.


Rigo Agbeko was boring as shit, that's not HBO making it up, that's just what it was. I remember you could see the crowd leaving while the fight was going on, and in this case I do think Rigo shares the blame with Agbeko considering he's at least a level or two above.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

Pedrin1787 said:


> Rigo Agbeko was boring as shit, that's not HBO making it up, that's just what it was. I remember you could see the crowd leaving while the fight was going on, and in this case I do think Rigo shares the blame with Agbeko considering he's at least a level or two above.


it was boring, but Rigo was chasing him most of the fight


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> yeah, sure fella...golovkin sure LOOKS Asian, right? Most of his fans support him because they THINK he's white...they have no idea of his Asian background...and you know this and it's extremely disingenuous for you to act like you don't.
> 
> and, yes...I have an agenda...to recognize the BEST fighters in boxing. it just so happens they're ALL black. How does that make ME a bad guy?...don't blame me, blame all the black fighters who keep beating up the white fighters...blame the white fighters for not being good...I'm sure it's not BECAUSE they're white that they're not good.... I really have no idea why....but I'm supposed to throw I a few white guys to appease people like you? fuck off, dude.


Your a stain on this forum.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Medicine said:


> LMAO
> 
> You claim GGG-Jacobs was a blow out for Jacobs.... Yet Garcia-Broner (Which was an actual blow out for Mikey) you barely had Garcia winning.
> 
> ...


there was nothing close about Jacobs-ggg. except for the 4th and 5th rounds, and a few sporadic bursts of ggg aggression, danny controlled him and got to beating him up in close quarters and at long range as the fight progressed.

Garcia-broner was a cautiously fought match where neither guy sustained much action....a lot of rounds were close....in then end I had the right man winning.

loma is praised PRIMARILY because he's white....the reason I say this, is there are other fighters who have done JUST as much as he has or far more in both the amateur and pro-ranks and he gets ranked above them pfp...if it's not because he's white enlighten me about why he's ranked by so many in boxing as #1 pfp.

yes, lara is my FAVORITE fighter of all time...#1 would not say he's the best ( Floyd and roy and others are, of course, better)

and yes, kim kardashian is a super hot piece of ass and one of the most beautiful women in the world (along with bria myles and Jessica dime) and unless you a d**k suckin f*g, you would recognize...


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Hold on, Disco had Garcia-Broner close?


----------



## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Hold on, Disco had Garcia-Broner close?


8-4 like the judges iirc.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Hold on, Disco had Garcia-Broner close?


And Loma is only rated because he is white?


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

So the rings new P4P rankings post Andre ward retirement have.....

GGG at no 1


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## nvs (May 16, 2013)

GGG is very average for being ranked P4P numero uno or how was it :think1


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

bballchump11 said:


> it was boring, but Rigo was chasing him most of the fight


OK, i gotta bare my chest on this "boring" thing....first of all, it takes TWO to make a fight. take lara for example...he's called boring, but he was in one of the greatest fights i've seen in recent memory in his war with angulo...that's because angulo pressed the action and MADE it exciting. a boxing match is not the same as a barroom brawl. boxing is the art of self-defense....what incentive does a pure boxer have for getting into trench warfare when he can win a decision using his god-given abilities and superb skills? the answer is NONE!......trench warfare is a stupid risk if you can box your way to a clear victory.

it pissed me off that SO MANY people blamed floyd for the pac fight being boring....i thought pac was supposed to be the aggressor who would chase floyd down and MAKE him fight....but NOBODY blamed pac!...i was watching a fight at a bar the other day and i overhear some dude talking about "mayweather ripped off the fans with the pac fight"...does it ever occur to ANYBODY that pac had a responsibility in that fight as well?!

and this is my last point..i was listening to dontaesboxing nation the other day, and some upcoming contender is listing his top ten pfp and he DOESN'T include rigo...and the reason he gives is: you can't be pfp and only throw 6 punches a round like rigo in the agbeko fight...and instantly i'm thinking back to when i was a kid and i'd hear my dad and some of the old-timers gushing about how willie pep once won a round WITHOUT THROWING A PUNCH, which attested to what a superlative defensive wizard pep was...so, lemme get this straight...when pep wins a round without throwing a punch, he's a defensive genius, but when rigo wins a round by throwing 6 punches, he's a boring bum whose fights shouldn't be carried on premium tv?...imagine if rigo had thrown ZERO punches...they'da made him give back his money AND taken his license at the same time!...boxing is fulla hypocritical, bullshit double-standards like that...for example, the way they make loma a star when he lost to salido...if rigo had lost to amagasa, he'd be long forgotten by now...but loma gets a second chance..and after rigo beats his ass, watch them give him a THIRD chance, then a fourth...and we all know why even though we won't say it out loud for fear of offending certain people.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

One to watch said:


> So the rings new P4P rankings post Andre ward retirement have.....
> 
> GGG at no 1


oscar the self-licking ice cream cone


----------



## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

dyna said:


> 8-4 like the judges iirc.


Nope, he had it 7-5 @Pedderrs

Check out the round by round, he was doing everything in his power to score a Broner win..


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## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> and this is my last point..i was listening to dontaesboxing nation the other day.


Did you hear the part where even the notorious GGG Hater Dontae said GGG clearly beat Canelo?


----------



## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> OK, i gotta bare my chest on this "boring" thing....first of all, it takes TWO to make a fight. take lara for example...he's called boring, but he was in one of the greatest fights i've seen in recent memory in his war with angulo...that's because angulo pressed the action and MADE it exciting. a boxing match is not the same as a barroom brawl. boxing is the art of self-defense....what incentive does a pure boxer have for getting into trench warfare when he can win a decision using his god-given abilities and superb skills? the answer is NONE!......trench warfare is a stupid risk if you can box your way to a clear victory.
> 
> it pissed me off that SO MANY people blamed floyd for the pac fight being boring....i thought pac was supposed to be the aggressor who would chase floyd down and MAKE him fight....but NOBODY blamed pac!...i was watching a fight at a bar the other day and i overhear some dude talking about "mayweather ripped off the fans with the pac fight"...does it ever occur to ANYBODY that pac had a responsibility in that fight as well?!
> 
> and this is my last point..i was listening to dontaesboxing nation the other day, and some upcoming contender is listing his top ten pfp and he DOESN'T include rigo...and the reason he gives is: you can't be pfp and only throw 6 punches a round like rigo in the agbeko fight...and instantly i'm thinking back to when i was a kid and i'd hear my dad and some of the old-timers gushing about how willie pep once won a round WITHOUT THROWING A PUNCH, which attested to what a superlative defensive wizard pep was...so, lemme get this straight...when pep wins a round without throwing a punch, he's a defensive genius, but when rigo wins a round by throwing 6 punches, he's a boring bum whose fights shouldn't be carried on premium tv?...imagine if rigo had thrown ZERO punches...they'da made him give back his money AND taken his license at the same time!...boxing is fulla hypocritical, bullshit double-standards like that...for example, the way they make loma a star when he lost to salido...if rigo had lost to amagasa, he'd be long forgotten by now...but loma gets a second chance..and after rigo beats his ass, watch them give him a THIRD chance, then a fourth...and we all know why even though we won't say it out loud for fear of offending certain people.


Of course it takes two to make a fight but when you're THAT good and you're fighting someone at least a couple levels below, you should put in some effort to put on a show.

When I say "put on a show" I'm not talking about windmilling like Bumsquad Wilder with no defense. I'm talking about using your superior boxing skills to "hit" your inferior opponent while "not getting hit".

Look at the best fighter in the world right now, Vasyl Anatoliyovich Lomachenko, against Marriaga. Sure Marriaga was willing to mix it up a bit early in the fight, but he soon discovered that he was in way over his head, so he went into full survival mode.

Did Vasyl chose to lower his punch output and do the bare fucken minimum to pull an easy and safe UD and in the process send everyone in the venue home early?

Fuck no, it didn't matter that his opponent wasn't keeping his end of the bargain to make it a show, Loma gave us a show and got his man outta there without losing his composure because he's THAT good.

I expect more from top 10 p4p level fighters when they're fighting someone inferior.


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

Medicine said:


> Nope, he had it 7-5 @Pedderrs
> 
> Check out the round by round, he was doing everything in his power to score a Broner win..


That RBR is clear evidence that this guy is either a moron or someone's trolling alt.


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## Strike (Jun 4, 2012)

The Pep winning a round without throwing a punch is a complete myth. Not a shred of evidence for it, and it all stems from one piece by Don Riley who wrote his account...24 years after the fight in question. He claimed it was in the third round. Only...people have managed to find a newspaper report of the fight from the time, and here is what the ringside reporter, Joe Hennessy, for the St Paul Pioneer Press at the time wrote of the third round...

"A clicker couldn't count the blows, Pep punched Jack into the ropes as the most even round of the evening ended."

http://www.espn.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=3522638


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Pedrin1787 said:


> Of course it takes two to make a fight but when you're THAT good and you're fighting someone at least a couple levels below, you should put in some effort to put on a show.
> 
> When I say "put on a show" I'm not talking about windmilling like Bumsquad Wilder with no defense. I'm talking about using your superior boxing skills to "hit" your inferior opponent while "not getting hit".
> 
> ...


hit and not get hit...yes, indeed...that's what loma did, lol....dude, did you see loma's face after the fight? even HE admitted he needed to improve his defense. And you're comparing marriaga, a washed up smaller guy with agbeko, a former champ who had arguably beaten abner mares a couple of fights prior...would you have advised ANY fighter in that weight class to fight agbeko the way loma fought marriaga?

loma was just lucky he was in with marriaga tryna unnecessarily mix it up like that... a big puncher woulda made damn sure the rigo fight never happened.


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Medicine said:


> Did you hear the part where even the notorious GGG Hater Dontae said GGG clearly beat Canelo?


did you hear the part where dontae said he missed the first four rounds?....everybody with any sense who scored it, had it very close either way or a draw...

know what dude? i gave you a chance, but i'm gettin sick and tired of your shit...you're either a moron or a mental case. how the fk are you gonna call garcia-broner a blowout? do you even know what a blowout is? FYI, it's when ONE guy wins practically every round. but tell me more about all these blowouts i missed...like how luke campbell blew out linares this last weekend...or how kudryashov was blowing out dorticos before he himself got starched...


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> hit and not get hit...yes, indeed...that's what loma did, lol....dude, did you see loma's face after the fight? even HE admitted he needed to improve his defense. And you're comparing marriaga, a washed up smaller guy with agbeko, a former champ who had arguably beaten abner mares a couple of fights prior...would you have advised ANY fighter in that weight class to fight agbeko the way loma fought marriaga?





Strike said:


> The Pep winning a round without throwing a punch is a complete myth. Not a shred of evidence for it, and it all stems from one piece by Don Riley who wrote his account...24 years after the fight in question. He claimed it was in the third round. Only...people have managed to find a newspaper report of the fight from the time, and here is what the ringside reporter, Joe Hennessy, for the St Paul Pioneer Press at the time wrote of the third round...
> 
> "A clicker couldn't count the blows, Pep punched Jack into the ropes as the most even round of the evening ended."
> 
> http://www.espn.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=3522638


you're missing the point...the point is, pep was deemed a defensive marvel for his ability to slip, duck and evade punches...he wasn't known for his ko power or high output...but he was still recognized and respected for his defensive abilities...the same abilities rigo is criticized for, except rigo is breakin guys jaws and knocking em out...so, he's BETTER than pep, but gets LESS respect...i know, it's the cuban thing....cuban boxers have very few fans in the US, so they have very little pull with the promoters, media, etc.. but as a boxing fan what i'm pissed at is the the constant double standard. it's, where, for another example, one fighter gets praised, like loma for his two gold medals, while the other fighter, rigo, gets ignored despite his same number of gold medals...rigo has had his boring fights and gets fierce criticism...and loma has looked lackluster in a couple of fights and got NO criticism.

i just wonder what the reason could be? hmmmmm......


----------



## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> did you hear the part where dontae said he missed the first four rounds?....everybody with any sense who scored it, had it very close either way or a draw...
> 
> know what dude? i gave you a chance, but i'm gettin sick and tired of your shit...you're either a moron or a mental case. how the fk are you gonna call garcia-broner a blowout? do you even know what a blowout is? FYI, it's when ONE guy wins practically every round. but tell me more about all these blowouts i missed*...like how luke campbell blew out linares this last weekend*...or how kudryashov was blowing out dorticos before he himself got starched...


Linares was the clear winner IMO.

Also you just called Jacobs Vs. GGG a blow out but scored it 8-4, now you are claiming a blow out is winning 12-0.

It's YOUR SHIT that everybody is getting sick and tired of.


----------



## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Medicine said:


> Linares was the clear winner IMO.
> 
> Also you just called Jacobs Vs. GGG a blow out but scored it 8-4, now you are claiming a blow out is winning 12-0.
> 
> It's YOUR SHIT that everybody is getting sick and tired of.


show me where i used the word "blowout" to describe jacobs-ggg you lying sack of shit!


----------



## Strike (Jun 4, 2012)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> i just wonder what the reason could be? hmmmmm......


Yawn. Wlad of course never got criticised for being boring. :lol: Maybe Pep having a record of 229-11-1 and Rigo having one of 17-0 and still being active is something to do with all time ranking. :lol: Nah....cos Rigo's black. :lol:

Carry on professional victim. Remind us all again how black guys don't get endorsement deals and aren't financially rewarded properly in boxing. Here's a little song for you to have as your theme tune in life...






Don't bother replying, as I won't be replying again.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Strike said:


> Yawn. Wlad of course never got criticised for being boring. :lol: Maybe Pep having a record of 229-11-1 and Rigo having one of 17-0 and still being active is something to do with all time ranking. :lol: Nah....cos Rigo's black. :lol:
> 
> Carry on professional victim. Remind us all again how black guys don't get endorsement deals and aren't financially rewarded properly in boxing. Here's a little song for you to have as your theme tune in life...
> 
> ...


who said anything about racism?...not me to be sure...i don't see color. i think people need to stop talking about racism. racism is a thing of the past. nobody has time for racism anymore. class trumps race. it's racist to point out racism. no such thing as racism in boxing.


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Medicine said:


> Nope, he had it 7-5 @Pedderrs
> 
> Check out the round by round, he was doing everything in his power to score a Broner win..


So why is @dyna saying 8-4?

Where did you get 8-4 from @dyna?


----------



## steviebruno (Jun 5, 2013)

One to watch said:


> So the rings new P4P rankings post Andre ward retirement have.....
> 
> GGG at no 1


Worst P4P no. 1 in the history of boxing.


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

One to watch said:


> So the rings new P4P rankings post Andre ward retirement have.....
> 
> GGG at no 1





nvs said:


> GGG is very average for being ranked P4P numero uno or how was it :think1


Legitimately may be the worst number 1 ranked fighter of all time

Shane Mosley
Bernard Hopkins
Roy Jones Jr
Floyd Mayweather Jr
Manny Pacquiao
Roman Gonzalez
Andre Ward

Yep he is.


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Only great fighters have ever been legitimately considered p4p number 1, so what we're saying here really isn't all that damning. Golovkin's not as good as Hopkins, Jones, Mayweather or Pacquiao? Wow, that's damning.


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Only great fighters have ever been legitimately considered p4p number 1, so what we're saying here really isn't all that damning. Golovkin's not as good as Hopkins, Jones, Mayweather or Pacquiao? Wow, that's damning.


Golovkin isn't great. Not even close. You don't think he's great do you? :think1


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Golovkin isn't great. Not even close. You don't think he's great do you? :think1


Well he's been Middleweight champion for 7 years, he's undefeated, 87% KO ratio, holds virtually all of the belts, and has wins over Jacobs and Canelo in my opinion.

Yes, he's a great fighter.


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## Strike (Jun 4, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Legitimately may be the worst number 1 ranked fighter of all time
> 
> Shane Mosley
> Bernard Hopkins
> ...


Yeah he is, but that doesn't really mean much. The Ring have only been doing p4p for 28 years, and in that time a total of 12 men have been at number 1 (including GGG). So that just means that there have been 11 guys over 28 years who were a lot better than him on a p4p basis. No shame in that. He's an excellent fighter, who is just not as good as that ranking usually requires, but even though I would put Crawford at number 1...if he was there, he would also be the worst p4p number 1 ever.


----------



## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Strike said:


> Yeah he is, but that doesn't really mean much. The Ring have only been doing p4p for 28 years, and in that time a total of 12 men who have been at number 1 (including GGG). So that just means that there have been 11 guys over 28 years who were a lot better than him on a p4p basis. No shame in that. He's an excellent fighter, who is just not as good as that ranking usually requires, but even though I would put Crawford at number 1...if he was there, he would also be the worst p4p number 1 ever.


Yeah, this is basically what I was trying to say, but as always you said it better.


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Well he's been Middleweight champion for 7 years,


Fighting bums. The middleweight division has been atrocious for 20 years and he hasn't beat one fighter of any championship pedigree. Miguel Cotto would've accomplished the same if he fought that horrid list of fighters.


> Jacobs and Canelo in my opinion.


Even if you're so biased as to believe he beat Jacobs and Canelo, neither is anything special. Calling Golovkin great is an insult to guys like Cotto, Kessler, Kovalev, Froch, ect who were on the cusp of being the best but lost to transcendent fighters something Golovkin has never come against.

Golovkin real talk ain't shit


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Strike said:


> Yeah he is, but that doesn't really mean much. The Ring have only been doing p4p for 28 years, and in that time a total of 12 men have been at number 1 (including GGG). So that just means that there have been 11 guys over 28 years who were a lot better than him on a p4p basis. No shame in that. He's an excellent fighter, who is just not as good as that ranking usually requires, but even though I would put Crawford at number 1...if he was there, he would also be the worst p4p number 1 ever.


True. Golovkin is the Trump of boxing. However, at least Crawford has potential, Golovkin is what he is and will only decline from here. Rather put a guy who is undisputed than a guy who drew Canelo and got lucky against Jacobs


----------



## Strike (Jun 4, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> True. Golovkin is the Trump of boxing. However, at least Crawford has potential, Golovkin is what he is and will only decline from here. Rather put a guy who is undisputed than a guy who drew Canelo and got lucky against Jacobs


Aye, I do think GGG has declined already...not by much I should add, Jacobs and Canelo were his best opponents and would have been a handful 5 years ago, but he does look a little slower and his output seems to have dropped a tad. I think Jacobs could become the man at the division.


----------



## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

Honestly I'm not that impressed by Crawford either. I guess Postol was a good lil fighter.


Winner of Loma vs Rigo is P4P number 1 to me. I wouldn't sleep on Kovalev either if he comes back from losing mentally nobody is gonna beat him



Omg I'm becoming the old jaded boxing fan. I'm a hater now, the transformation is complete


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Cotto probably loses to Lemieux, MW, and he lost handily to Canelo.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

JamieC said:


> He beats Jacobs and Canelo and still these threads persist. You're a better poster than this MW


He's not though.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Only great fighters have ever been legitimately considered p4p number 1, so what we're saying here really isn't all that damning. Golovkin's not as good as Hopkins, Jones, Mayweather or Pacquiao? Wow, that's damning.


Exactly.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Legitimately may be the worst number 1 ranked fighter of all time
> 
> Shane Mosley
> Bernard Hopkins
> ...


:lol: hard to disagree


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> So why is @dyna saying 8-4?
> 
> Where did you get 8-4 from @dyna?


Because he's right.
http://checkhookboxing.com/index.ph...hampionship-boxing.98276/page-20#post-3098993

Shiny later used the judges's scorecards (8-4) as an example to prove why Broner had more success than giving credit for.

The 8-4 stuck with me, 7-5 didn't.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

dyna said:


> Because he's right.
> http://checkhookboxing.com/index.ph...hampionship-boxing.98276/page-20#post-3098993
> 
> Shiny later used the judges's scorecards (8-4) as an example to prove why Broner had more success than giving credit for.
> ...


Fair enough.

I mean, that's an absolutely dreadful scorecard. Truly worrying stuff from Disco there.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

And Disco should be the last person referencing official scorecards as evidence for anything considering he vehemently disagreed with the scores in the Jacobs-Golovkin fight.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

http://www.boxingforum.com/boxing-history/9101-past-pound-pound-lists.html
87 is missing.
Mike Tyson was rated P4P #1 in 1988 and 89.

Golovkin's resume is clearly stronger than an 88 Tyson.
Although he's not as dominant.

At best Golovkin is the 2nd worst P4P fighter, at worst below Tyson. :think1


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Objectively speaking, 1988 Tyson was a better fighter than any version of Golovkin.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Objectively speaking, 1988 Tyson was a better fighter than any version of Golovkin.


And this is why these arguments go around in circles.


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## KERRIGAN (Jul 25, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> I wouldn't sleep on Kovalev either if he comes back from losing mentally nobody is gonna beat him


No one at 175 is going to stop Beterbiev, now that Ward has retired.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

dyna said:


> http://www.boxingforum.com/boxing-history/9101-past-pound-pound-lists.html
> 87 is missing.
> Mike Tyson was rated P4P #1 in 1988 and 89.
> 
> ...


I'm sure there was an earlier list that had Zarate 1 and Conteh 2 or 3. Can't remember which publication though.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

Strike said:


> Aye, I do think GGG has declined already...not by much I should add, Jacobs and Canelo were his best opponents and would have been a handful 5 years ago, but he does look a little slower and his output seems to have dropped a tad. I think Jacobs could become the man at the division.


Then certain people would be suddenly saying its the best division in boxing....


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Cotto probably loses to Lemieux, MW, and he lost handily to Canelo.


I like Cotto but he isnt beating Jacobs either.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Objectively speaking


On what metric?


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

dyna said:


> On what metric?


Do you actually think Golovkin is a better fighter than 88 Tyson or not because I'm not getting into a pedantic argument with you, Dyna. That's your bread and butter.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Do you actually think Golovkin is a better fighter than 88 Tyson because I'm not getting into a pedantic argument with you, Dyna. That's your bread and butter.


You should know that putting "objectively speaking" in your post is going to be a guaranteed reply.

And I don't rate Golovkin as high as most, I definitely don't think he's better than Tyson in a H2H P4P sort of way.
Golovkin has been one of the more overrated fighters for a long time.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

dyna said:


> You should know that putting "objectively speaking" in your post is going to be a guaranteed reply.
> 
> And I don't rate Golovkin as high as most, I definitely don't think he's better than Tyson in a H2H P4P sort of way.
> Golovkin has been one of the more overrated fighters for a long time.


Great then we have nothing to argue about.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> Great then we have nothing to argue about.


Yes we do, semantics.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Fighting bums. The middleweight division has been atrocious for 20 years and he hasn't beat one fighter of any championship pedigree. Miguel Cotto would've accomplished the same if he fought that horrid list of fighters.
> 
> Even if you're so biased as to believe he beat Jacobs and Canelo, neither is anything special. Calling Golovkin great is an insult to guys like Cotto, Kessler, Kovalev, Froch, ect who were on the cusp of being the best but lost to transcendent fighters something Golovkin has never come against.
> 
> Golovkin real talk ain't shit


How is Kessler better than Golovkin?

Dude has a win he edged over Froch but after that its a toss up between Andrade, Mundine and Allen Green for his second biggest win.

If you think Kessler was great then Hes not even close to GGG and I dont think GGGs resume is particularly that good for an ATG middleweight.


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## Strike (Jun 4, 2012)

dyna said:


> Yes we do, semantics.


:lol:


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## Strike (Jun 4, 2012)

Chatty said:


> How is Kessler better than Golovkin?
> 
> Dude has a win he edged over Froch but after that its a toss up between Andrade, Mundine and Allen Green for his second biggest win.
> 
> If you think Kessler was great then Hes not even close to GGG and I dont think GGGs resume is particularly that good for an ATG middleweight.


Yeah Kessler has not got many better wins than GGG and nor has Kovalev for that matter. I am not taking 2014 Hopkins as a great win, as incredible as Hopkins' longevity was, the 2014 version was way past it. Many argue that he was not at his best against Calzaghe...that was fucking 2008. I will still say it's a good win, because Hopkins was not shot to bits, he was't the 2016 version, but it's not a great win at that stage.

That leaves Pascal as Kovalev's best win. After his best win, his top 3 wins are no better than GGG's, in fact they're arguably worse. Canelo and Jacobs are both tougher opponents than Pascal, although I had Jacobs winning myself.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Pedderrs said:


> Fair enough.
> 
> I mean, that's an absolutely dreadful scorecard. Truly worrying stuff from Disco there.


dude, give it a rest. you're so fulla shit....


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

KERRIGAN said:


> No one at 175 is going to stop Beterbiev, now that Ward has retired.


bitterbeef is target practice for barrera...hell, I'd love to see Stevenson take a crack at him.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Strike said:


> Yeah Kessler has not got many better wins than GGG and nor has Kovalev for that matter. I am not taking 2014 Hopkins as a great win, as incredible as Hopkins' longevity was, the 2014 version was way past it. Many argue that he was not at his best against Calzaghe...that was fucking 2008. I will still say it's a good win, because Hopkins was not shot to bits, he was't the 2016 version, but it's not a great win at that stage.
> 
> That leaves Pascal as Kovalev's best win. After his best win, his top 3 wins are no better than GGG's, in fact they're arguably worse. Canelo and Jacobs are both tougher opponents than Pascal, although I had Jacobs winning myself.


Kessler is roughly equal to ggg in terms of ability and accomplishments... Kessler's best victims were by and large better than the guys ggg beat. on the other hand, canelo and Jacobs are better than Kessler...I think ggg's loss to Jacobs and draw with canelo alone disqualify him from top pfp ranking.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> dude, give it a rest. you're so fulla shit....


It wasn't close mate. You need professional help.


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## Muff (Jun 6, 2013)

Holy shit shiny is retarded. I don't know why people keep debating anything with him.


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## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> bitterbeef is target practice for barrera...hell, I'd love to see Stevenson take a crack at him.


WOW... This guy is a piece of work.


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## Medicine (Jun 4, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> Kessler is roughly equal to ggg in terms of ability and accomplishments... Kessler's best victims were by and large better than the guys ggg beat. on the other hand, canelo and Jacobs are better than Kessler...I think ggg's loss to Jacobs and draw with canelo alone disqualify him from top pfp ranking.


I'm pretty sure this might just be a white guy posing as a team slick member to troll people. Even worse MW has totally bought it and backs his BS up.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Wasn't Forrest P4P #1?


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## sugarshane_24 (Apr 20, 2013)

turbotime said:


> Wasn't Forrest P4P #1?


I don't think so, Shane was. Then Forrest beat him who catapulted to iirc number 3.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

sugarshane_24 said:


> I don't think so, Shane was. Then Forrest beat him who catapulted to iirc number 3.


Any link or info on this? I actually had the issue but it got ruined in the fucking basement years ago along with all my other RING mags.


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## pipe wrenched (Jun 4, 2013)

turbotime said:


> Any link or info on this? I actually had the issue but it got ruined in the fucking basement years ago along with all my other RING mags.


Damn...I feel ya on that one

I had tons of them with near the same fate...:sad5


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

pipe wrenched said:


> Damn...I feel ya on that one
> 
> I had tons of them with near the same fate...:sad5


I was so pissed. I had every issue from early '99 up to about 2006


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## sugarshane_24 (Apr 20, 2013)

turbotime said:


> Any link or info on this? I actually had the issue but it got ruined in the fucking basement years ago along with all my other RING mags.


Try this one mate. This is the yearly rating but i think this is good enough. It was a bad year for Shane. He lost to Forrest twice and dropped out of the welterweight rankings altogether.

http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/The_Ring_Magazine's_Annual_Ratings:_2002


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## IsaL (Jun 5, 2013)

Pedderrs said:


> I'm sorry that Golovkin is white, MW.


Canelo is as white as you can get. Golovkin is asian/oriental.


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## MichiganWarrior (Jun 4, 2013)

IsaL said:


> Canelo is as white as you can get. Golovkin is asian/oriental.


Lomachenko and Kovalev are from Uganda


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

MichiganWarrior said:


> Lomachenko and Kovalev are from Uganda


Golovkin is Asian though isn't he.

In geography and facial features.

Why don't you like that?


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Bellew is black.

In case you think I'm joking, google his mother.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

One to watch said:


> Golovkin is Asian though isn't he.
> 
> In geography and facial features.
> 
> Why don't you like that?


Most people still see it as a Soviet state as it was the last to declare independence. Thats probably why. Golovkin is from the very East if Kazakhstan as well, hes nearer China than Europe.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

IsaL said:


> Canelo is as white as you can get. Golovkin is asian/oriental.


Yes but Floyd beat Canelo. The more he achieves now, the better it is for Floyd, Trout and Lara.

Do you not know how this works mate?


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Medicine said:


> I'm pretty sure this might just be a white guy posing as a team slick member to troll people. Even worse MW has totally bought it and backs his BS up.


hey, team ponderous, this is an anonymous forum...it makes no sense for me to pretend to be something I'm not, otherwise, what's the whole point of being anonymous?


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

IsaL said:


> Canelo is as white as you can get. Golovkin is asian/oriental.


first of all, canelo is MEXICAN!...that automatically disqualifies him from being white to most white people. Just watch that movie American Me...secondly, golovkin is from EASTERN EUROPE. in the perceptions of most white people, that makes him WHITE...and he doesn't really look very Asian. his brother is very Asian looking....most of the kazakhs in the showtime reality series were Asian looking, but golovkin might not be a typical looking Kazakh because he doesn't have those strong Asian features...if he looked like provodnikov, he probably wouldn't have gotten the HBO hype heaped on him like he did.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> first of all, canelo is MEXICAN!...that automatically disqualifies him from being white to most white people. Just watch that movie American Me...secondly, golovkin is from EASTERN EUROPE. in the perceptions of most white people, that makes him WHITE...and he doesn't really look very Asian. his brother is very Asian looking....most of the kazakhs in the showtime reality series were Asian looking, but golovkin might not be a typical looking Kazakh because he doesn't have those strong Asian features...if he looked like provodnikov, he probably wouldn't have gotten the HBO hype heaped on him like he did.


Just fuck off eh?


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## Pedrin1787 (Dec 24, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> first of all, canelo is MEXICAN!...that automatically disqualifies him from being white to most white people. Just watch that movie American Me...secondly, golovkin is from EASTERN EUROPE. in the perceptions of most white people, that makes him WHITE...and he doesn't really look very Asian. his brother is very Asian looking....most of the kazakhs in the showtime reality series were Asian looking, but golovkin might not be a typical looking Kazakh because he doesn't have those strong Asian features...if he looked like provodnikov, he probably wouldn't have gotten the HBO hype heaped on him like he did.


Mexican is not a race you idiot.

Wait why am I doing this shit again with this retard....


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

I think beterbiev is one of the most overrated fighters in boxing...the top lhw including Stevenson, barrera and jack would destroy that man...

usyk is also a very overrated prospect...he's lucky to have faced a lotta weak comp...I'd like do see him against tabiti or dorticos...I have them both to beat


Pedrin1787 said:


> Mexican is not a race you idiot.
> 
> Wait why am I doing this shit again with this retard....


ok, well, you're obviously not American...if you're euro, you probably think of canelo as like a white dude from another country like spain or something like that...however, in America where I live, white Mexicans are not considered "white"...it may sound strange to you, but it's kinda like how black Africans living in America are not really considered "African americans"...even though they may be American citizens...its about social/historical context.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

Usyk is very good, but he's overrated by the guys who said he'd go to heavyweight and dominate Joshua. And yes I have seen people claim that. I do think he'll win the cruiserweight tournament though and deserve a spot on the p4p list.


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

bballchump11 said:


> Usyk is very good, but he's overrated by the guys who said he'd go to heavyweight and dominate Joshua. And yes I have seen people claim that. I do think he'll win the cruiserweight tournament though and deserve a spot on the p4p list.


yeah, well I've seen posts where guys said ggg would have beaten joe Louis, marvin hagler and Muhammad ali...I know about crazy on boxing message boards.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

bballchump11 said:


> Usyk is very good, but he's overrated by the guys who said *he'd go to heavyweight and dominate Joshua*. And yes I have seen people claim that. I do think he'll win the cruiserweight tournament though and deserve a spot on the p4p list.


Really? Wow! :lol:


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> I think beterbiev is one of the most overrated fighters in boxing...the top lhw including Stevenson, barrera and jack would destroy that man...
> 
> usyk is also a very overrated prospect...he's lucky to have faced a lotta weak comp...I'd like do see him against tabiti or dorticos...I have them both to beat
> 
> ok, well, you're obviously not American...if you're euro, you probably think of canelo as like a white dude from another country like spain or something like that...however, in America where I live, white Mexicans are not considered "white"...it may sound strange to you, but it's kinda like how black Africans living in America are not really considered "African americans"...even though they may be American citizens...its about social/historical context.


Doriticos is in the WSB tourny isnt he? I'll do a one month avatar bet he doesn't beat Usyk if they fight.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

Dazl1212 said:


> Doriticos is in the WSB tourny isnt he? I'll do a one month avatar bet he doesn't beat Usyk if they fight.


Hes s gotta get through Gassiev first.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

Chatty said:


> Hes s gotta get through Gassiev first.


I know mate.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Dazl1212 said:


> Really? Wow! :lol:


Quite a common view in the brit forum.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

One to watch said:


> Quite a common view in the brit forum.


Thats crazy, seen nothing of Usyk at heavyweight so have no idea how he'd cope with shots from AJ


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Dazl1212 said:


> Thats crazy, seen nothing of Usyk at heavyweight so have no idea how he'd cope with shots from AJ


WSB counts!


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

dyna said:


> WSB counts!


Did he fight anyone who hits as hard as AJ? Genuine question as I dunno.


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## One to watch (Jun 5, 2013)

Dazl1212 said:


> Thats crazy, seen nothing of Usyk at heavyweight so have no idea how he'd cope with shots from AJ


He competed v super heavys in WSB.


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## Eoghan (Jun 6, 2013)

Dazl1212 said:


> Did he fight anyone who hits as hard as AJ? Genuine question as I dunno.


Well when you take into account the bigger gloves, no, but Medzhidov is a huge puncher


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

One to watch said:


> He competed v super heavys in WSB.





Eoghan said:


> Well when you take into account the bigger gloves, no, but Medzhidov is a huge puncher


I really rate Usyk, I really do, I just havent seen anything to suggest he could beat Joshua at Heavy. I havent seen anything to suggest he cant either mind you.

Would need to see him go up and beat a decent heavy before I'd put anything on him beating Joshua..


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## Eoghan (Jun 6, 2013)

Dazl1212 said:


> I really rate Usyk, I really do, I just havent seen anything to suggest he could beat Joshua at Heavy. I havent seen anything to suggest he cant either mind you.
> 
> Would need to see him go up and beat a decent heavy before I'd put anything on him beating Joshua..


Saying Usyk would beat the likes of Wilder and Joshua is a stretch, but it's certainly not impossible, the speed difference would be enormous


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> I really rate Usyk, I really do, I just havent seen anything to suggest he could beat Joshua at Heavy. I havent seen anything to suggest he cant either mind you.
> 
> Would need to see him go up and beat a decent heavy before I'd put anything on him beating Joshua..


dorticos will take care of usyk,


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> dorticos will take care of usyk,


Avatar bet then, we agree on the avatar beforehand so theres no shenanigans.

We could do it for Loma Rigo since that fight is signed instead if you like?


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## ShinyDiscoBall (Apr 10, 2015)

Dazl1212 said:


> Avatar bet then, we agree on the avatar beforehand so theres no shenanigans.
> 
> We could do it for Loma Rigo since that fight is signed instead if you like?


either way is fine with me...let's do it.


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## Dazl1212 (May 16, 2013)

ShinyDiscoBall said:


> either way is fine with me...let's do it.


OK we'll do it for Loma Rigo then, can do the other fight if it gets made.

Loma wins heres your avi









:good


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

If Usyk wins the Cruiser WSSB then he'll be heading to heavyweight, only real fight for him outside this at the weight is Lebedev unless some of the LHW stars move up.

Ill be very interested to see how he does at heavy. He might well not be the guy but he should fit in as a very good contender at least.

He offers something very different to a lot of other heavys as well with his movement, speed and technical ability. I think hell cause a lot of guys a lot of problems but for sure he could get sparked by one of the giants.

We saw Joshua compketely puzzled by a cruiserweight with good movement in the Olympics. Hes improved massively since then and that was over three rounds but weve never seen him fight that style of fighter again so we dont know whethrr he would have a lot of problems with this style in particular.

Of course Joshua could walk through and beat the shit out of him as well but thats what makes it an interesting fight if we get to that.

Simarly with Wilder, he seems to be going life or death or getting outboxed in most of his fights and has some of the worst technique Ive seen from a world level boxer in any weight yet he has massive punch power and he gets guys out so I could see Usyk outboxing Wilder and Wilder might just chin him with a ferocious windmill.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

Which cruiserweights have moved up and "dominated" heavyweight? Evander Holyfield didn't even do that.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

bballchump11 said:


> Which cruiserweights have moved up and "dominated" heavyweight? Evander Holyfield didn't even do that.


Evander was out and out numver one in the heavyweight division though tbf. Beat Tyson, Bowe, Moorer, Foreman, Holmes.

No one really conpletely dominates an era like that but he was the best for a period.


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## bballchump11 (May 17, 2013)

Chatty said:


> Evander was out and out numver one in the heavyweight division though tbf. Beat Tyson, Bowe, Moorer, Foreman, Holmes.
> 
> No one really conpletely dominates an era like that but he was the best for a period.


He was undisputed champion and all, but he did struggle at heavyweight compared to cruiserweight. And true that era was extremely stacked.


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## Pedderrs (Jun 1, 2012)

Usyk besting Joshua. :lol:


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