# The ''What Fights Have You Watched Today?'' Thread.



## Indigo Pab (May 31, 2012)

Shamelessly stolen from ESB, consider this thread as us paying homage to Ishy.

Let's do this.


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## Indigo Pab (May 31, 2012)

At the request of @ScouseLeader (have I done that right?)...........

Alisher Rahimov vs Sergio Thompson

First off the two separate ring announcers was a weird way to do things. Why not just get one bi-lingual guy to do the job? Anyhow..........

10-9
9-10
10-9
10-9
10-9
10-9
10-9
9-10
9-10
10-9
10-9
9-10

116-112 to Rahimov.

Decent fight for the most part, with the majority of the rounds being relatively easy to score(12th and 10th and some other round I gave to Thompson I think are the ones I found debatable if I remember rightly, been a few hours since I watched it). I was going to make one of my rather monotonous essays but I'll just C&P most of the notes I took down while watching instead.

Both of them were pretty porous defensively, Thompson more so than Rahimov. The Russian had a relatively tight guard, but as a result he left himself vulnerable to the body. Something which Thompson really took advantage of in the rounds that he took. Thompson though, he was open for EVERYTHING. He kept his hands up but he wasn't using them to defend himself, seeing as everything Rahimov threw went past them.

Luckily for Thompson, Rahimov consistently squared himself up when going on the attack and thus nullified almost all of his clean work to a degree. Either Thompson is extremely tough or Alisher really let himself down by not taking his man out relatively early, because he was landing A LOT of flush shots, the majority of which being nowhere near as effective as they should've been.

Early on I thought it appeared as tough Thompson could gradually take over. Rahimov often stays in the same place after throwing while Sergio was landing his left to the body and then spinning away quite well. I thought he could've made better use of that, he had a far superior array of angles but never really utilised them. He contributed to his own downfall really. He also kept on standing inside trying to free up room for his left hook down low, and as a result continued to ship plenty of punishment up the middle, primarily from right uppercuts. There were plenty of exchanges, 90% of which Rahimov came out on top of. He was far more compact when throwing, he was landing 2/3 hooks in the time it took one of Thompson's wide, looping haymakers to come into his range.

Thompson tired a bit around the midway point, his work rate dropped and he presented nowhere near as many angles, and in general was far slower/sluggish. Rahimov slowed a tad himself in the 8th, as he mostly followed Thompson, who in turn increased his own output and consistently threw hooks to the body from both hands. Hence he began to take a few more rounds for himself around this point.

In short Rahimov benefitted from being the busier and more compact puncher. Thompson's straight punches are pretty ineffective, and his left hook to the body aside he displayed a VERY limited arsenal in this one. Due to being so defensively poor, once his movement became restricted Rahimov was able to really rack up the rounds.


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

As Captain Hook once said; Good form (Pab)

I scored the fight 117-111 Rahimov, and I agree with most of the points you made regarding the bout. The main issue for Rahimov was that he smothered his own work by getting too close to Thompson, he couldn't get the correct leverage on his shots which was a big shame because Yeyo was very open and some good connections might have made it an early night. I think you can tell by watching Rahimov that he'd have trouble with a classy boxer who can control the range and stop him from unleashing his shots up close (but who'd have thought it would be Motherfucking Ji Hoon Kim?)

Whilst the commentators over-exaggerated it, I do think that the hand injury hindered Thompson, he looked hesitant to throw his right after it seemed he hurt it early on and I think he could have pushed harder had it not been injured. Could he have won though? I doubt it, Rahimov was just too quick on the inside and blocked far too efficiently for Yeyo to get through. Maybe throwing the right over Rahimov's jab would have worked for Thompson but I reckons Rahimov was too quick.


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## Indigo Pab (May 31, 2012)

What're you doing editing old posts and expecting me to see them you knobber? At least tag me in it like laa.

I didn't particularly rate Thompson's straight punches anyways, obviously it makes him more predictable if he's unable to throw it but for me his left to the body was his only effective shot anyways. Both his jab and right and he pushed out and never really followed through with, and with Rahimov's already rather sturdy guard he wasn't really getting through anyways.

I didn't find either particularly impressive. Rahimov was busy and had a bit of savvy up close with the uppercut, but that aside he wasn't great at closing down range(although he didn't have to be in this fight, as Sergio wasn't a good mover), continually squared himself up while throwing, and as you said he smothered his own work. Good fight though, albeit not of especially high quality.


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

I don't get this tagging malarky.

Yeah, Thompson had a good left to the body but he just couldn't get it going regularly. I still feel he should have made more of an effort to slow Rahimov down, he's not exactly young, and despite his good engine he looked a bit worn later on. Thompson allowed himself to be controlled though.

Yeah, twas an interesting fight with a few exciting elements but one watch is enough for me:yep


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## Indigo Pab (May 31, 2012)

Put someone's username after an @. For example:
@Lunny

And now Lunny will know that he's been mentioned in this thread, the legend.

When you told me to watch it I was expecting more to be honest, normally when it's yourself that suggests something I expect a bout that's either A) difficult to score, B) exciting and/or tactically intriguing, or C) both. Rather than the alright, not so technically impressive fight that was handy enough to score which I did get.:yep


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

Yeah, I only really recommended it cos I watched it recently and it wasn't an awful fight. I think the fact that it was pretty exciting and moderately aesthetically pleasing glossed over the low skill level and intrigue.

I'll recommend summat better next time.


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## Lunny (May 31, 2012)

Pabby said:


> Put someone's username after an @. For example:
> @Lunny
> 
> And now Lunny will know that he's been mentioned in this thread, the legend.
> ...


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

Sumbu Kalambay vs Mike McCallum 

Wow, did not expect this kind of performance from Kalambay. What the fuck were those judges smoking? To have it so close is pretty disgraceful. I had it 117-111 Kalambay and I even thought I was being generous to Mike, who only won one round clearly in my opinion. I'd go as far to say that Kalambay schooled the unbeaten veteran, so why the judges scored it so close, I have no clue.

I've never seen McCallum so outclassed in a ring outside of the Jones Jr fight. He just didn't seem to have a the foggiest clue of how to deal with the slickness of Kalambay. Mike just couldn't get off any of his famed body work, or any decent work on the inside because of Kalambay's constant foot movement. Even when Mike did get in close, Kalambay slipped shots with magnificent poise and anticipation and used some nimble foot movements to stay off the ropes where McCallum could corner and hurt him. It was such a genius defensive performance from the defending champion. When he wasn't evading almost all of McCallums big punches, Kalambay was zipping round the ring firing off a very sharp and accurate jab, which regularly found it's target and allowed Kalambay to set up follow up punches to keep McCallum off him. The way Kalambay blended defense and attack so effortlessly, to bamboozle McCallum with his movement and then fire back almost instantaneously with sharp jabs and stinging right hands to not only score points but even hurt the Iron chinned jamaican is incredibly commendable. McCallum just seemed clueless, not his usual assured and thought out self, really seemed out of his depth here when presented with something he hadn't witnessed before in Kalambay. Excellent all round showing from the man fighting at home. I suppose having that fart Lou Duva in his corner didn't help McCallum much either :yep

Cheers for the recommendation Flea :good


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## Meast (Jun 3, 2012)

This is a classic, haven't seen it in a while.

Williams comes back after being knocked down twice early on


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@ScouseLeader no worries mate, watch their second fight and score that, _much_ more competitive with many hard to score rounds, one of the greatest technical battles I've ever seen :good


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

^^^^ I took your advice Flea Man :yep

Sumbu Kalambay vs Mike McCallum II 

Yep, a much more closely contested battle than the first encounter between these 2 excellent technicians. This time the decision was nowhere near as clear cut, and like Flea Man says there were a lot of close rounds in the contest. I had it 115-113 Kalambay by the end of it. The commentators on Eurosport seemed to see the fight in 2 halves; The first half where McCallum controlled the action, leading strongly with his jab and working the body well against a Kalambay who struggled to find his rythm and get that snappy jab going & The second half where Kalambay seemed to edge out McCallum in most of the rounds as the Jamaican noticeably slowed down and 'Patricio' got his attack going. I saw it in a vaguely similar way, but ended up splitting most of the middle rounds which proved increasingly difficult to score as the tide of the fight changed erraticly in each fighters favour. I felt that Kalambay nicking a few of the early rounds when McCallum seemed to be at his best, coupled with his resurgence in stealing the later rounds allowed him to edge out the decision, but it could definitely have gone either way.

A real technical battle this. And it's intriguing to see the differences between the 2 fighters efforts when they had fought a couple of years earlier in Italy. Kalambay doesn't seem as sharp or assured the second time round, particularly in the early going. Possibly this is due to the shocking defeat he suffered at the hands of Michael Nunn when he was caught cold after 88 seconds, or maybe simply because McCallum put in a better shift than his dissapointing showing the first time round. Mike was much more aggresive and refused to let Kalambay find his range in the early goings, but he eventually tired (he was mid thirties to his credit!) it seemed and Kalambay was allowed to exert that great atheticism to land his jab consistently and sway the action in his favour. Hard to pick flaws in either guy though, great performance from both.


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

Watched Monzon/Benvenuti I and Griffith/Benvenuti I also, both terrific bouts, and were both fights of the year.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@ScouseLeader great analysis mate, agree. Many swing rounds, 115-113 is fair either way, some close mid-to-late rounds with McCallum punching and Sumbu slipping and countering that make you think _what actually happened in that exchange and what was more significant_ and you _can_ stretch 116-112 either way as well (I have before)

Watched it a few times, slightly different each time but I felt Sumbu nicked it. Considering his performances between Nunn and this he really turned it on. Mike, not common for him, started quick and made up any deficit before it happened.

Glad you enjoyed 'em mate, very good era of middles the post-Leonard W12 Hagler lot.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

BoxingAnalyst said:


> Watched Monzon/Benvenuti I and Griffith/Benvenuti I also, both terrific bouts, and were both fights of the year.


Is that the one where Griffith twats Nino big time with the right hand? Only seen a few rounds of that (about five tours I think) is it fully available? Or am I thinking of the 2nd anyway?


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

Flea Man said:


> Is that the one where Griffith twats Nino big time with the right hand? Only seen a few rounds of that (about five tours I think) is it fully available? Or am I thinking of the 2nd anyway?


Yep here it is Flea, the whole fight is on Youtube mate.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

:happy Thanks pal :thumbsup


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## Hitmandann (Jun 6, 2012)

The site looks great guys. Good job.

Watched Marcos Villasana-Jamie Garza last night. Total war where Bantamweight knockout artist Garza gets out punched by the smarming Villasana


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Garza was more super bantam/feather but yes, great scrap that :good

Villasana had one of the greatest chins of all time. A real bruiser. 

I take it you've seen Garza Vs Meza? :yep


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## Hitmandann (Jun 6, 2012)

Cheers Flea. Yeah your right about Garza and I have seen Garza vs Meza but along time ago, will have to revist. Hows things mate?


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

Hitmandann said:


> The site looks great guys. Good job.
> 
> Watched Marcos Villasana-Jamie Garza last night. Total war where Bantamweight knockout artist Garza gets out punched by the smarming Villasana


Thanks for the info, Is it on Youtube?


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Good mate, very happy to see me badgering you on twitter has finally paid off and you're posting again ;-) Written anything lately??


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## antcull (Jun 4, 2012)

Flea, am I right in thinking that you uploaded Villasana v Esparragoza before? Can't seem to find it on Youtube. Had a copy on my computer but lost all my boxing a couple months ago.


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## Hitmandann (Jun 6, 2012)

Haha!! Been busy doing interviews and covering fights for Secondsout and Boxing News Online. Trying to find time inbetween writing and watching fights to post on here!! PS How do you do that "originally posted by" reply?


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## Bajingo (May 31, 2012)

Hitmandann said:


> Haha!! Been busy doing interviews and covering fights for Secondsout and Boxing News Online. Trying to find time inbetween writing and watching fights to post on here!! PS How do you do that "originally posted by" reply?


Reply with quote :good


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## Hitmandann (Jun 6, 2012)

Bajingo said:


> Reply with quote :good


Thanks!!


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## Hitmandann (Jun 6, 2012)

Just watched Carlos Zarate-Puppy Hernandez

Confident start from Hernandez before Zarate's insistant stalking finally breaks his man


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## McKay (Jun 6, 2012)

Was round at my uncles there and we ended up watching Tyson v Reggie Gross for some strange reason and then watched a bit of Sumbu Kalambay v Herol Graham. He's a massive boxing fan and I managed to persuade him to create an account on here (Boxingbaker), hopefully he gets into the habit of posting as he knows his stuff about boxing history.


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

Sumbu Kalambay vs Ayub Kalule

Another great technical battle featuring Kalambay. This time he just loses out to the excellent Ayub Kalule in the last win of his career. Initially it was a battle of Kalambay's right hand and Kalule's Southpaw left, and Kalule appeared to have the upper hand in the early rounds, fainting his way in and then pounding Kalambay with hard overhand lefts. The physical presence of Kalule caused Kalambay problems, as did the angles he used to attack Sumbu. Eventually Kalambay found his feet, and got that great jab of his going, turning the tide of the fight almost with a knockdown in the 5th. The fight however did remain close with a lot of the rounds very hard to split either way. Kalule was on the canvas again in the 11th, but returned to drop Kalambay in the 12th to seal one of the best wins of the Ugandan's career over an emerging star.

Myself, I had it 113-112 Kalambay but certainly I would not argue at all with a Kalule win and I can see myself scoring for him if/when I watch it again. In a lot of the rounds it depends on whether you appreciate Kalambay's jab which he frequently lands, or Kalule's aggression. For a guy coming to the end of his career it was a great performance and I felt that Kalambay was slightly lucky not to get called up on a pair of Knockdowns which the refer deemed slips without much hesitation. I reckon on neutral grounds Kalambay might have been in a bit of trouble in that regard.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

Well I've ran out of my list of fights to get through so I'm not sure where to start watching from now. Think I'm gonna go on an Ezzard Charles marathon, any suggestions.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

antcull said:


> Flea, am I right in thinking that you uploaded Villasana v Esparragoza before? Can't seem to find it on Youtube. Had a copy on my computer but lost all my boxing a couple months ago.


Didn't bother but now you're in need, I'll get it done.



ScouseLeader said:


> Sumbu Kalambay vs Ayub Kalule
> 
> Another great technical battle featuring Kalambay. This time he just loses out to the excellent Ayub Kalule in the last win of his career. Initially it was a battle of Kalambay's right hand and Kalule's Southpaw left, and Kalule appeared to have the upper hand in the early rounds, fainting his way in and then pounding Kalambay with hard overhand lefts. The physical presence of Kalule caused Kalambay problems, as did the angles he used to attack Sumbu. Eventually Kalambay found his feet, and got that great jab of his going, turning the tide of the fight almost with a knockdown in the 5th. The fight however did remain close with a lot of the rounds very hard to split either way. Kalule was on the canvas again in the 11th, but returned to drop Kalambay in the 12th to seal one of the best wins of the Ugandan's career over an emerging star.
> 
> Myself, I had it 113-112 Kalambay but certainly I would not argue at all with a Kalule win and I can see myself scoring for him if/when I watch it again. In a lot of the rounds it depends on whether you appreciate Kalambay's jab which he frequently lands, or Kalule's aggression. For a guy coming to the end of his career it was a great performance and I felt that Kalambay was slightly lucky not to get called up on a pair of Knockdowns which the refer deemed slips without much hesitation. I reckon on neutral grounds Kalambay might have been in a bit of trouble in that regard.


Glad you enjoyed. I had it the same I think. And he did suffer; still lost on points ;-)


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## antcull (Jun 4, 2012)

Legend mate, cheers :good


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## Macca L20 (Jun 3, 2012)

Just downloaded a few fights on sky anytime. Haven't watched any Hatto fights for a long time.
Ricky Hatton 119-110 Juan Lazcano. Usual Hatton performance at this level, with high intensity 
pressurising, winging hooks and body shots but lunging in time and time again with left hooks,
looking like a knockout waiting to happen. Gave Lazcano the eighth round and a share of the third.
I can remember every man and his dog getting tickets to this fight and i refused on the grounds that it
was a shit opponent. Never ended up going to a Hatton fight.:-(


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## Jasper Simone (Jun 7, 2012)

Simon Brown vs. Jorge Luis Maysonet . Always like watching Brown. Controversial long 2nd round after Maysonet goes down....for some reason the time keeper stops the clock so when the bout resumes the round should really be over but Maysonet takes more punishment and is then stopped in the 3rd. Quality fighter Brown was.


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## AnthonyW (Jun 2, 2012)

@ScouseLeader

Nelson - Sanchez

Awesome fight. Nelson deserved the final bell, but took some fucking punishment, showed a great chin. Started off fast and had Sanchez puzzled. Crazy how Sanchez is regarded as a veteran.


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

AnthonyW said:


> @ScouseLeader
> 
> Nelson - Sanchez
> 
> Awesome fight. Nelson deserved the final bell, but took some fucking punishment, showed a great chin. Started off fast and had Sanchez puzzled. Crazy how Sanchez is regarded as a veteran.


:good Nelson showed great determination and heart when he was getting pounded by Sanchez late on. Gave Sal a lot of trouble as well early like you said.


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Great to see this thread is still kicking around :good This week ive watched:

Mike McCallum vs Sean Mannion and Michael Watson. Total schoolings by the master technician.

Wilfed Benitez vs Bruce Curry. Very poor decision here, Curry deserved the decision here big time. Excellent fight with a lot of action though.

Antonio Esparragoza vs Stevie Cruz - Esparragoza on fire here, destroyed Cruz in an quality fight. Will have to check out more fights of the big punching Venezuelan.

Iran Barkley vs Roberto Duran - Legendary performance by Duran, great comeback in the latter rounds. Barkley probably never fought as well as he did in this fight, showed underrated skills.

Michael Nunn vs Frank Tate - Very good performance by Nunn, he was some talent in his day, just totally schooled a good fighter in Tate.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

I'm watching calzaghe v kessler again.

i forgot how could calzaghe actually was, makes me rethink the whol joe v carl fight anyways!


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

I'll upload a load of Esparragoza this weekend then


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Cheers flea, you already have a some good one's on your channel, keep them coming:thumbsup


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Calzaghe v Hopkins

1: 8-10
2: 9-10
3: 9-10
4: 9-10
5: 10-9
6: 10-9
7: 10-9
8: 9-10
9: 10-9
10: 10-9
11: 10-9
12: 10-9

114-113

I've scored this fight thrice now and twice in favour of Joe both times I watched it on tv and the one time i scored for nard I watched it on youtube. I'm not watching it again so I'm just gonna stick with this scoreecard for now.

A whole lot of joe's punches were bullshit, but I think his straight lefts were landed more often then hopkins rights down the stretch. In the 10th and 11th Hopkins straight pissed me off with his faking shit and I would say that's how he threw the fight away; he literally just conceeded 2 rounds when he was comfortably ahead at that point. The pace was getting to him and maybe had he not done that joe could have got him in trouble.

I know there's only 1 round in deciding who the winner is here but I'm sticking with it for now.

Despite wasting large parts of his career, Joe was a heck of a fighter and I think ultimately he did prove his skills at the highest level available vs lacy, kessler and hopkins.


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## Jasper Simone (Jun 7, 2012)

Sportofkings said:


> Great to see this thread is still kicking around :good This week ive watched:
> 
> Mike McCallum vs Sean Mannion and Michael Watson. Total schoolings by the master technician.
> 
> ...


Yeah good fights to watch. Nunn especially, he was a special fighter for a time. That particular bout vs Tate I won a good amount in a one on one bet with a mate. Tate wasn't no slouch himself but Nunn was a level above. Real shame how things turned out for him.


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## dftaylor (Jun 4, 2012)

@lufcrazy No one beats Hopkins comfortably though - I think Joe did a good job. I had it 7-5 (with the KD) so I think that's the same score as you.

Not a fight I really want to watch again though.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

dftaylor said:


> @lufcrazy No one beats Hopkins comfortably though - I think Joe did a good job. I had it 7-5 (with the KD) so I think that's the same score as you.
> 
> Not a fight I really want to watch again though.


yeah I think people are blinded by the volume but in the midst of joe's punches, he did land good shots and more than hop imo. not watching it again though.

next on my list is froch v kessler.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Also scored Tarver v Kayode a dead draw 6-6


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## Macca L20 (Jun 3, 2012)

Muhammed Ali v Joe Frazier III.

Had it 8-6 to Ali. Love this fight, looked like it was Frazier's after 11 rounds but Ali came on strong near the end. Ali hardly lands a jab in this fight
which is surprising but he lands plenty of big shots on Frazier early and late on which force Joe's corner to pull him out after 14 pulsating rounds.
It was probably both fighters hardest fight in their careers.


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

Just watched Froch-Pascal, must have seen it at least 10 times.

116-112 Froch, pulled away in the last 4 or 5 rounds using his jab, Pascal really is one of the most clueless fighters in the world if you stick a stiff jab in his face.


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## doug.ie (Jun 3, 2012)

was watching this on youtube while eating me spuds earlier.....one of absolute favourite boxers from the 90's.....had a great trilogy with francis ampofo which i used to have on vhs but not any more...and not on youtube...first fight was a 6 rounder and two classic british title fights....wish they were on youtube...the six rounder was but gone now...
anyway...here's robbie showing what he could do...really exciting boxer he was i thought...


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## dkos (Jun 2, 2012)

Still on there Doug :good


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@antcull @Sportofkings Robbery IMO. Enjoyable though.


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## antcull (Jun 4, 2012)

Your a legend mate. Cheers :good Gonna give it a watch in a min, can't fail to impress with these two :yep


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## antcull (Jun 4, 2012)

OK just watched Esparragoza v Villasana. Great fight! Full of action but I reckon you may not approve of how I scored it. :yep Not quite a robbery IMO. Actually had it 6 rounds a piece, with the point deduction in the 5th just gave the win to Esparragoza on my card.

Villasana: 1, 3, 4, 9, 11, 12
Esparragoza: 2, 5, 6, 7, 8, 10

Now, I know where we're gonna disagree here. Me having Villasana up 3-1 after 4. I thought Villasana was pretty effective in these rounds working his way inside and roughing Esparragoza up, landing some great shots to the body, clubbing shots upstairs and some nice sneaky right uppercuts in there too. In each of these rounds that I scored to Villasana in the first 4 there were some lovely eyecatching shots landed by Esparragoza but overall I felt in these that Villasana had done the more effective and damaging work overall. Loved the first 2 rounds though, if I had just seen them and was told it went the full 12 I would have predicted an ATG fight.

Definitely changed after the fifth though once Esparragoza got his movement sorted. Used lateral movement excellently from rounds 5-8 and had Villasana chasing his shadow and making him pay with some lovely combos. Thought Esparragoza jab was slightly underused here as well, was lovely when he used it, very relaxed.

Villasana poured it on in the final four rounds, landed a couple of super left hooks that would have taken a lesser man out. Round 10 was pretty close but I thought Villasana easily took the last two.

Great fight and a lovely clash of styles. 114-113 Esparragoza IMO.....not too fussed with the verdict of a draw. :yep

Cheers for the upload fella, would be good to see a few more scores on this. :thumbsup


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Thanks for the upload of the Esparragoza fight Fleaman, will give it a watch tomorrow and score it.

Just finished watching Brooks-Curry: Savage fight. Loads of trading throughout, and what a finish! Impressed with both men here, Monroe did well, he just couldn't stand to trade with Curry the way he did. Curry very accurate with his punches, until he finally landed that left hook in the 9th, the same punch that nearly rendered Benitez from his sense's in his fight with Bruce.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@antcull I can see that...with the deduction though I cannot see how the official cards rendered that decision!

Nice breakdown, glad you enjoyed it :good


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## antcull (Jun 4, 2012)

Just looked up the cards...pretty odd! One had 116-111 Villasana, another 116-112 Esparragoza and final one 114-114 :huh

Definitely need to clue myself up on Esparragoza more, had far more finesse about his work than I expected. :good


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Got around to watching the Esparragoza-Villasana bout. Good fight, I thought it was a close one which could have gone either way though.

Round 1 10-9 Villasana
Round 2 10-9 Esparragoza
Round 3 10-9 Esparragoza
Round 4 10-9 Villasana
Round 5 10-8 Esparragoza
Round 6 10-9 Esparragoza
Round 7 10-9 Villasana
Round 8 10-9 Esparragoza
Round 9 10-9 Villasana
Round 10 10-9 Esparragoza
Round 11 10-9 Villasana
Round 12 10-9 Villasana

114-113 Esparragoza.


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

Just watched Corrales/Castillo I, haven't watched it in ages.

The ending never fails to make he hairs on my balls stand up.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

I'm going through some close fights atm and listing those I disagreed with the official verdict after the third viewing.

here is my list so far:

pac-jmm 1:jmm
pac-jmm 2: jmm
hopkins-taylor 1: hopkins
holyfield-moorer 1: holyfield
holmes-spinks 2: holmes
ali-young: ali
ali-shavers: shavers
ali-norton 3: norton
johnson -hart: johnson
tarver-johnson 1: tarver
hopkins -pascal 1: hopkins
taylor-wright: wright
de la hoya -tito: de la hoya
de la hoya -mosley 2: mosley
de - la hoya-sturm: sturm
pea's losses: pea
lewis-holyfield 1: lewis
jmm's losses bar floyd: jmm

my computer has just had to be reformatted so my old scorecards are unfortunately lost but I had these guys listed as the winner.

From here on in I'll post my cards on this thread.

Next two I'm watching are Froch -dirrell and Froch -Kessler. Followed by Pac-JMM3 :good


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Just watched dirrell v Froch for the third time, first time round I had Froch a clear winner, second time I had Dirrell a close winner.

third time I had this

Forch v Dirrell

1: 10-9
2: 10-9
3: 9-10
4: 9-10
5: 9-10
6: 10-9
7: 10-9
8: 10-9
9: 9-10
10: 9-9
11: 9-10
12: 10-9

Gave it Froch by 1 point. I gotta say this, as much as Dirrell was able to make Froch miss, he never really made him pay (until the 10th round) and his accuracy itself was pretty woeful. as far as clean punching goes, there wasn't a great deal of it in this fight as both missed tonnes of shots (quietly impressed with Froch's defence in this fight). When clean punching isn't decisive you have to go with effective aggression and by that criteria Froch took most rounds. He was backing Dirrell up, cornering him and outjabbing him at times. he made Andre look like he was fighting scared and I think it all started when Froch threw him down, that really shook Andre and it took him a while to start opening up (well until the 9th round really).

So going into the championship rounds I had Froch needing 1 point to keep his title, the 12th was fairly even until the last 40 seconds when for some inexplicable reason Dirrell just stopped fighting and let himself get cornered repeatedly.

Now i'm not a big believer in punch stats and I always tend to judge myself how effective a punch seems to have been. But whilst I don't think Dirrell did enough to win,he did enough to show he was capable. I can only conclude he felt Froch's power early on, was intimidated by the crowd and was shook by the throw down. At times he looked very good (sitting down on his punches in the 9-10-11) but at others he'd miss with a jab and circle before missing again.

Well anyways, after my third viewing I'm happy with the official decision here, it weren't as if Froch landed nothing and Andre landed everything, both missed far too many shots, but only was really being effective in what he was doing. close win for carl imo.


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## BoxingAnalyst (Jun 4, 2012)

@lufcrazy Froch/Dirrell was certainly close, I've only watched it once which was live, I will never watch the fight again, it was horrendous, I had Dirrell 1 up IIRC.

Glad he didn't get the decision though, he's a fucking fairy.


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

I really want to re-watch Froch - Direll, because I didn't score it the first time.

But I just can't bring myself to sit through that shit again.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@Sportofkings just me then. Even as a big Villasana fan, I felt his workmanlike effort early on was overshadowed by the Venezuelan's variety.

Was I conned by flash?  It can happen, even to the best of us :hey


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

BoxingAnalyst said:


> @lufcrazy Froch/Dirrell was certainly close, I've only watched it once which was live, I will never watch the fight again, it was horrendous, I had Dirrell 1 up IIRC.
> 
> Glad he didn't get the decision though, he's a fucking fairy.


The fight kinda grew on me after the second sittin.

It was shite though, froch come forward missing whilst andre runs away missing.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Froch v Kessler

1: 10-9
2: 9-10
3: 9-10
4: 10-9
5: 10-9
6: 9-10
7: 9-10
8: 9-10
9: 10-9
10: 9-10 
11: 10-9
12: 10-9

Third time I've seen this and I seem to settle on a draw, so many rounds are so close though it's hard splitting them at times. I still after 3 times watching can't see a clear victory for either man. I think Froch outjabbed Mikel at times and Mikel countered brilliantly at times, Froch was successful with wild attacks but left himself open to some beautiful shots.

Ultimately I think Froch pulled out the draw in the last two rounds, once they began really trading I thought he took mikel's shots better and dished out better also seeming to have more left in the tank.

I can easily see 8-4 in either direction to be honest but that's giving close round benefits to each fighter.

Great fight though.

Next up is pac-jmm 3 and pac -bradley.


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## JamieC (Jun 2, 2012)

Coincidentally I watched it as well and scored it 114 -114, I felt froch gave away he win, he didn't work enough and let Kessler off a few times


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

JamieC said:


> Coincidentally I watched it as well and scored it 114 -114, I felt froch gave away he win, he didn't work enough and let Kessler off a few times


yeah at times he really boxed mikel's ears off and had he fought with the discipline he showed against AA I think he'd have took a clear decision.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

My third viewing of pac-jmm 3:

Pacquiao v Marquez 3

1: 10-9
2: 9-10
3: 9-10
4: 9-10
5: 9-10
6: 10-9
7: 9-10
8: 9-10
9: 10-9
10: 9-10
11: 9-10
12: 10-9

First time I had JMM winning, second time a draw, this time JMM winning again.

Early doors JUMM schooled Pac, Pac nicked rounds with flashy combos here and there but it's clear to see who the superior technician was in the ring that night.

JMM fought Pac much better than Bradley did actually which brings me to the next fight I watched.

Pac-Bradley, the early rounds were so one sided I actually stopped scoring after about the 9th round (think I had it 8-1 at that point). The crazy thing is that this is the best Pac has looked in a long time. Since Clottey atleast, since then he's fought shot guys and came up short in a close fight with a lightweight. Pac has clearly slipped though. Tiring late like that isn't a good sign and it made the fight closer than it should have been in reality. Officially it cost him as the championship round rally is what gave tim the nod.

Still, if Pac is capable of clearly defeating a prime p4p rated opponent like Bradley he still has loads to offer boxing. I can't in good faith rank him p4p above Floyd nor JMM though.

It's a shame because when you see his quartet of fights against hoya, hatton, cotto and clottey and compare him to today he looks a level lower. the insane speed advantage is gone as is the killer instinct.

Floyd would most likely school him if they ever fought again (so would JMM imo also).


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Watched Stevie Johnston vs Jose Luis Castillo 1.

Good solid action fight here. It was all power punching and no jabbing by each fighter, with uppercuts and hooks to the head and body being the weapon of choice for both men. The bout was fought almost entirely on the inside, where Johnston made the big mistake of fighting an excellent pressure fighter like Castillo at his own game, while utilizing none of his boxing skills, movement or good jab.But even fighting one of the best pressure fighters of this era, Stevie still did well and brought him right to the wire, which is a testament to his versatility and grit. 

This wasnt exactly a great performance by either man though, particularly from Stevie, who never got into his groove and produced some of his fluid boxing, but I suppose a lot of that had to do with facing a fighter as good as Castillo. Its also interesting to see that this bout was awarded ring magazines upset of the year for 2000. Obviously nobody knew just how good the unknown Castillo was at this point:yep

Really hard fight to score.Jose landing with the harder shots and Stevie with the slightly greater number of punches. One thing to note is that Castillo had a point taken away from him in the fourth for repeatedly holding Johnstons arm, a foul employed by him throughout the fight. Most rounds were nip and tuck and could have gone either way, but I felt Castillo nicked it with some really good rally's in rounds 8-10, where he clearly out landed Johnston to the head and body and took the rounds.

My scorecard:
Round 1 10-9 Castillo
Round 2 10-9 Castillo
Round 3 10-9 Johnston
Round 4 9-9 Even
Round 5 10-9 Johnston
Round 6 10-9 Castillo 
Round 7 10-9 Johnston
Round 8 10-9 Castillo
Round 9 10-9 Castillo
Round 10 10-9 Castillo
Round 11 10-9 Johnston
Round 12 10-9 Johnston

114-113 Jose Luis Castillo.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

Been cleaning my computer out of the fights i'll probably not watch again and just re-watched Molina-Kirkland, had Molina a mile in front and although legit was still a shit and needless decision from the ref. Gonna watch some of his other fights as they reckon he is always getting robbed, gonna watch the Lara, Alvarado and Chavez jnr fights tonight and see what the score is.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@chatty I definitely thought he won the first Chavez fight and the Lara fight. Ain't seen Molina Vs Alvarado though.


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## dkos (Jun 2, 2012)

Nkosinathi Joyi-Katsunari Takayama II

1. 9-10
2. 10-9
3. 10-9
4. 10-9
5. 10-8
6. 10-9
7. 10-9
8. 9-10
9. 9-10
10. 10-9
11. 9-10
12. 9-10

Joyi 115-112 

For the first 10 rounds, it was a pretty commanding performance from Joyi. The rounds I gave to Takayama in that period could've went either way, whilst Joyi generally won his clearly - including a knockdown in the 5th. Takayama, to his credit, had endless stamina and finished the contest strongly, having his best spell in the last two rounds; both of which I thought he won without a doubt. It was a good fight :good


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Stevie Johnston vs Angel Manfredy.

A real gruelling war of attrition from both men, and an excellent slugfest. Angel put up a very good fight, and showed some of the quality work that had made him a top fighter, as he increasingly targeted Stevie's body with brutal hooks as the fight wore on. His success largely came when he pushed Johnston against the ropes and put the pressure on him, where he was able to set himself and land some really nice combinations. Johnston's activity, accuracy and superior defense came into play a lot though, as he often clearly took rounds with his cleaner work and stole most of the close ones with great workrate, often throwing Almost 100 punches a round. Manfredy seemed to fade around the half way mark, and this is where Stevie really stamped his dominance on the contest, controlling Manfredy with a good right jab and landing some excellent counters. Angel had something of a second wind in the last round, as he pressed Johnston, who had the air of a man who knew he had already done enough in the judges eyes. It wasnt enough, and couldnt turn the tide in the challengers favour.

Overall it was a reasonably competitve affair, and Manfredy succeded in winning his fair share of rounds,. I was impressed with his hand speed and body work, but he was up against it, as he was facing a superior techinician who was having one of the best nights of his career. Johnston is one well conditioned mofo, looks as fresh in the late rounds as he did in the first. Definitely one of the best wins of the his career, as Manfredy was one of the most distinguished contenders of the late 90's/2000's. 

Id reccomend this fight to anyone, as I was surprised just how good it was on first viewing. Never heard it so much as get a mention before either, Definitely a contest for the forgotten classics thread:good

My scorecard:
Round 1 10-9 Johnston
Round 2 10-9 Johnston
Round 3 10-9 Johnston
Round 4 10-9 Manfredy
Round 5 10-9 Manfredy
Round 6 10-9 Johnston
Round 7 10-9 Manfredy
Round 8 10-9 Johnston
Round 9 10-9 Johnston
Round 10 10-9 Johnston
Round 11 10-9 Johnston
Round 12 10-9 Manfredy

116-112 Stevie Johnston.


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Watched Lucas mathysse vs Zab Judah.

I cant see any way in which Judah won this fight tbh, he was outworked in most of the rounds, and in the rounds he did win. he never won them clearly. He was often relying on a couple of flashy shots to steal the session. Mathysse on the other hand, while very patient himself, was working consistently to the body and scoring points. In the late rounds he seemed to switch to the head a bit more and did some real damage, especially in the 10th and 11th rounds. My scorecard at the end:

Round 1 10-9 Judah
Round 2 10-9 Mathysse
Round 3 10-9 Mathysse
Round 4 10-9 Mathysse
Round 5 10-9 Judah
Round 6 10-9 Mathysse
Round 7 10-9 Judah
Round 8 10-9 Judah
Round 9 10-9 Mathysse
Round 10 10-8 Mathysse
Round 11 10-9 Mathysse
Round 12 10-9 Judah

so 115-112 for Lucas Mathysse. Considering he was taking a big step up in comp, Lucas perfromed well. I could see him taking Judah out by mid rounds in a rematch. How did the rest of you score it?


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

@DrMo watched this after reading your comment on my thread

Bowe v Holyfield 2

1: 10-9
2: 9-10
3: 10-9
4: 9-10
5: 9-10
6: 9-10
7: 10-9
8: 9-10
9: 10-9
10: 10-9
11: 9-10
12: 10-9

114-114


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## DrMo (Jun 6, 2012)

@lufcrazy rewatched this morning & scored it 115-113

Bowe 1,2,3,7,9,10,12

Holy 4,5,6,8,11,

10 & 11 were close rounds that you could argue either way imo

The decision was the closest in HW title history & is the only time the belt changed hands by a margin of a single point


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

DrMo said:


> @lufcrazy rewatched this morning & scored it 115-113
> 
> Bowe 1,2,3,7,9,10,12
> 
> ...


Correct me if wrong Mo, but didnt the Norton-Holmes title fight end with Holmes taking the title by a single point on two scorecards? So that would make it the closest title fight ever.


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## DrMo (Jun 6, 2012)

Sportofkings said:


> Correct me if wrong Mo, but didnt the Norton-Holmes title fight end with Holmes taking the title by a single point on two scorecards? So that would make it the closest title fight ever.


Had to check on boxrec & I was wrong :good


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

DrMo said:


> @lufcrazy rewatched this morning & scored it 115-113
> 
> Bowe 1,2,3,7,9,10,12
> 
> ...


Round 2 is the only one we disagree on I think :good

Yeah there's been robberies before imo (ali - young for example) but I agree that no fight has been this close. The styles meshed and changed throughout, at times both were the better man at range and both were the better man in close.

The fight was actually quite different from how I remembered it originally. No HW from 92-96 beats Bowe imo. From the first Golota fight onwards I think Tyson might stop him and Lewis would get the edge if I were betting but 92-93-94-95 he smokes the lot imo. Moorer, Lewis, Foreman would all get stopped and HOLy actually did do.

10 and 11 were wars, punch for punch I would give the edge to Big Daddy but Holy landed some beautifully clean shots at times.

A draw would have been fair, especially with how on top Bowe was when fan-man jumped in.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@lufcrazy Bowe's defence too porous. The bigger hitters would've starched him IMO, Lennox would batter him IMO.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Flea Man said:


> @lufcrazy Bowe's defence too porous. The bigger hitters would've starched him IMO, Lennox would batter him IMO.


His defence is shit, but I think he has one of the best chins in history and would beat any of the 92-94 lot in a trade off. Lewis couldn't exchange hooks with McCall and I don't see him exchanging successfully with Bowe. Foreman would be battered into submisson. Moorer would be dropped numerous times. I think Bruno losses a come from behind tko. McCall loses a comeptitive UD.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

His chin was great but he could be hurt, as for Lennox I don't think the McCall fight is indictative of his general standard at the time. 

Bowe wanted nothing to do with Lennox. He'd fall to bits, and as Lennox hits about ten times harder than Holyfield and Golota I doubt Bowe would stand up to him any better than he did at the Olympics. 

I don't think Bowe would another Lennox on the inside consistently as Mercer did either. Even though I'd say Bowe is one of the most talented in-fighters I've seen regardless of weight he was explosive there. Mercer worked hard there.

Bowe wasn't consistent enough nor with proven longevity for me to consider him a proven H2H force, too erratic IMO. I'd say Riddick of Holyfield I was the absolute best in terms of physicality, conditioning and application though. Brilliant fighter.


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## Koki Kameda (Jul 5, 2012)

Koki Kameda


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## Laughing Bruno (Jun 13, 2012)

Koki Kameda said:


> Koki Kameda


heh heh heh


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Flea Man said:


> His chin was great but he could be hurt, as for Lennox I don't think the McCall fight is indictative of his general standard at the time.
> 
> Bowe wanted nothing to do with Lennox. He'd fall to bits, and as Lennox hits about ten times harder than Holyfield and Golota I doubt Bowe would stand up to him any better than he did at the Olympics.
> 
> ...


Not indicative of his general standard but it showed he was willing to take a shot to land one as well as showing he couldn't always take that shot. Bowe could be hurt but always seemed to battle through.

He wanted nothing to do with lewis, I completely agree, but I just feel that the way Lewis fought in that time frame gives Bowe too much opportunity for victory, especially considering during that time bowe fought at a higher level.

between the first and third holy fightsbowe did enough for me to consider him a very good fighter. resume and achievement wise I put him in the same group as dempsey, sullivan and wills. I thin he beats all 3 hence I rank him above them which places him 14th in my list.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@lufcrazy all fair points, @McGrain holds Wills in much higher regard than you and I (I'd have him in the 15-20 region from what I know)


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Flea Man said:


> @lufcrazy all fair points, @McGrain holds Wills in much higher regard than you and I (I'd have him in the 15-20 region from what I know)


 yes I've noted his high ranking of him before. I believe he's firmly in the same bracket as dempsey as he's beaten slightly better people but suffered more prime losses. between 1917 and 1926 the two ruled the division. I give Dempsey a slight edge as I personally think he'd have beaten Wills but the two sit at number 15 and 17 on my list.


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## Meast (Jun 3, 2012)

Just caught up with Soto vs Matthysse, great fight while it lasted!


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

*George Foreman Vs Jimmy Young*

FOREMAN: 2; 3(-1); 4; 5; 7; 10;
YOUNG: 1; 6; 8; 9; 11; 12(+1)

An interesting and sometimes exciting bout, well known of course. Have never scored it before and lending the eye to analysis rather than unadulterated enjoyment makes the earlier rounds more interesting than I remember them. A lot of Young threatening, a little popping, but more Big George just marauding :lol: With Foreman, as it;s his style I tend not to look for clean effective blows from him but end up seeing his swings to arms and shoulders as effective just on the basis you can tell how effective they actually are :scaredas:

Some early close rounds due to George not being that effective but trying, but the 3rd was a 9-9 for a seemingly rash move from the ref' to take a point from George for pushing Young to the floor.

Obviously Young came back into it. As a Foreman fan I admit that I can't have it both ways, his often ugly and brutish manhandling of his foes would naturally lend itself to points deductions (I don't think he was particularly sneaky just all out bad and rough) and even if the early deduction seemed soft and possibly brought upon by Young's camp making a fuss about Foreman's style to the referee beforehand, George made up for it throughout the contest :lol:

Young ups his flurries later on and starts to time his sweet right hand counter, the sharpness of which has George stumbling a few times. The last point deduction meant I'd have it a win for Young regardless of the referee's decision to reprimand Foreman for fouling, with the Phili' spoiler dropping George in the last round with a right hand to the side of the head. Quality heavyweight contest. Certainly one of Young's more watchable showings, after five rounds or so anyway, and I can't say he didn't implement the right gameplan.

Foreman 112-114 Young

*German Torres Vs Yuto Kazaki*

Big punching Mexican Torres is always a pleasure to watch, even when he's losing. Here, he gets one of literally countless undefeated Jap' or Korean midgets that get chucked in, executed, and either disappear or go on to get sparked in every match afterwards. Kazaki San in the latter :hey

TORRES: 2(+1); 3; 4; 5
KAZAKI: 1;

The Japanese did the slightly better work in a first round that featured both men limbering up more than anything else. A heavy handed swing from Torres caused a flash knockdown, but all credit to Kazaki, whilst he employed a lot of lateral movement on his toes he was no runner, looking to punch in sporadic bursts but not too far from Torres.

Which, ultimately is a bad move. Torres cut the distance enough in his patient way, landing the better shots and throwing just a bit more frequently than the Japanese. He doesn't land with the same thudding power 'til the end of the 5th round where a short hook seems to Kazaki hurt, he holds on, and then Torres steams into him again with his free hand. The beginning of the end.

At the beginning of the 6th Torres swings hard and briefly looks ragged and wild, allowing the Japanese to step out and avoid the more telling blows that Torres attempts. He seems to realise this immediately, bringing his hands up and languishing at mid-range for a moment, biding his time. Then, when he draws a jab from the Jap' he throws a counter out of the handbook Juan Manuel Marquez musta read later, a right uppercut that smacks the Jap' silly. poor Kazki is in desperation mode after that, and then Torres backed him up and stepped in with a right uppercut from underneath, detaching his man from his senses again. More proof of this mans heavy hands (as also seen in the Eleoncio Mercedes fight)

As Torres comes forward looking to finish his man off the Japanese springs forward with a right cross counter that lands bang on the chin, eliciting a rapturous raw from the crowd. Torres responds by twatting him with another right uppercut, and follows it up with a short left uppercut that floors him for a third time in the round and ends it.

Good showcase for Torres against a not too dangerous but also not too shabby opponent, who, like many fighters from the Orient, was game to the last.

*Jeff Fenech Vs Satoshi Shingaki I*

FENECH: 1; 3; 4; 5; 7; 8;
SHINGAKI: 2; 6;

I remembered Shingaki's name but couldn't remember why, it certainly wasn't for being a champion at bantam, which he was (IBF) going into this fight. I looked him up, and I see he suffered his first loss to a fighter I rate, Dodie Boy Penalosa. The only other opponent I recognise on his ring record before facing Jeff Fenech, one of the scariest bantamweights ever, is Yong-Hyun Kim (a draw) so effectively I have no idea why the Jap' was the IBF titlist (the guy he beat for it is a complete non-entity as I've never heard of him  and has an incomplete record on boxrec I imagine so I couldn't even draw on that) but hey, Fenech was fighting every other month at this point so I can't begrudge him this mullering and chance to grab a title. The IBF knew nothing of the lighter weights. The World was about to find out more about Jeff Fenech, well, whoever read about him in the mags I can't imagine this being televised too many places in the World (the joys of youtube :happy)

They're wearing big stupid gloves that make me think I'm watching a fight from the modern era. Some hard to score rounds with some pleasing back and forth, and with both men showing tight guards and decent defensive work for offensive orientated fighters, so some harder to score rounds but mainly all Fenech in a competitive bout, the Jap' looks well schooled and has poise, but is unspectacular.

The Jap' is feint heavy early but not even threatening. Fenech taking his time, not an all-out buzzsaw yet. Then in the second round: classic Fenech! All over his man...breathtaking! A short right hand from the southpaw has Fenech in a bit of bother, but he quickly regroups.

In the 3rd though, Shingaki comes forward consistently, but Fenech shows his ability to box his man, picking his shots and making his bursts count. In the 4th Fenech finds another solution, spinning his man and throwing combinations. When Shingaki lows blows him late in the round he gets another taste of Jeff Fenech, with another blistering two-handed assault. Love it.

Follows a similar pattern through the next few rounds, Fenech taking command by the end of the rounds, his combos the more telling work, looking the better man whenever he's in position to let his hands go.

Some great Aussie commentary summing up why Fenech was such a double hard bastard. "Got hit in the face with a shovel in the playground when he was 8 or 9 years old" :lol: And "some of the hardest fights were against the fathers, he'd beat up the sons and then their dads would come and want to have a go"!

In the 7th, Fenech puts on a pretty much punch perfect display. Apart from two shots very late in the bout his defence is airtight, impossible to breach at all, even body shots barely touching him. As for his offence, it's mind blowing. Consistently landing perfect right hand counters, using angles to land his hooks, and eventually backing his man up and putting the pressure on. Shingaki was game throughout, so not a 10-8, but Fenech was superb here.

The 8th is very competitive, but as it goes on Shingaki seems to have finally blown himself out, he's throwing a lot but his shots have lost all of their zip, Fenech visibly breaking him down. In the 9th, after an etended barrage, the ref thinks he's seen enough, might've been a touch early but at that point the Jap' had taken a barrage on the ropes and not offered much back. I will say I'll have to have more of a dig around for info' on him, knowing who he's in with and when he's in with him his performance here is admirable.

*Jeff Fenech Vs Satoshi Shingaki II*

Never mind he got a rematch :lol: Fenech's first 'defence' although I can't think I'd pick many around at the time to beat him, though fights with Happy Lora and Alberto Davila (even at that stage) would've been very interesting contests. I've seen all his main fights after this (I don't think I've seen the Greg Richardson fight though) and Zaragoza, Samart and McCrory were all very good wins. The Zarate one not great but decent enough. Shame about the conclusion of course.

FENECH: 1;
SHINGAKI:

Jeff is sharp from the get go here. Ring general, perfect grasp of range and knowing when to punch. Pure class. Despite me not really knowing the real quality of opponent here (doesn't look bad as I say, organised again in this fight) it does reaffirm what I think of Fenech as a H2H force, especially at 118lbs.

In the second round it becomes clear how far Fenech has pulled away from Shingaki since their last meeting. In a short space of time he's become so refined (and of course he's probably more comfortable against an oppnent he's already beaten well) that he's three or four levels above. Shingaki is cut and that exacerbates his problems, and against a stylist like Fenech impaired vision is the the last thing you need !!!! They pull Shingaki out a few rounds later, I abandoned scoring, it was a drubbing by a complete fighter to a decent one.


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## Yiddle (Jul 10, 2012)

kaylor/gumbs
kaylor/christie


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Ike Quartey vs Jung-Oh Park: Basically Ike bludgeoning his outmatched foe for 4 rounds. Fair play to the Korean though, he came to fight, kept throwing lesther at Quartey, and even landed a few shots. With his non-existent defense he was just getting ripped apart by Ike's power shots, and ram rod jab, and it was battering in the end. Great stuff to watch though.

Meldrick Taylor vs Glenwood Brown: This is a last glimpse of a Taylor who was still somewhat in his prime, even though his best days were likely over after his loss to Chavez. Taylor had no easy time with Brown, as he was knocked down on two occasions and hit with some hard shots through the fight. I think he ultimately took over the fight as it came into the middle portion, and did just enough, landing some good shots in spurts. I had it 114-112 for him in the end.

Tony DeMarco vs Carmen Basilio: Aclassic turn around by the hard as nails Basilio in the end. Demarco had a great start and hit Basilio with some huge left hooks and right hands in the first part of the fight, rocking him on several occasions. How Basilio stayed up after his legs doing that jig in the 7th round I dont know. 

As Tony slowed down Carmen managed to find his rhythm somewhat and fight his way back into the fight, even while the left side of his face was a mess. The tide turned in the the 12th as several right hands had DeMarco badly hurt. He got up, but practically out on his feet, he was put down again in a brutal knockout. Great stuff.


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

Just sat and watched Froch - Dirrell, it actually wasn't as bad as I remembered it, still not in any rush to go and watch it again.

I had Froch winning by 1 point, I think my scorecard was almost identical to Lufcrazy's. Dirrell pretty much threw this fight away imo, so many of the rounds I gave Froch I think had Dirrell been willing to put combos together instead of landing a single shot and getting on his bike then he would have won wide on my card. As Luf said Froch's defence was at times better than I think i've ever seen from him, at other times though he'd just charge in with a wild right hand and get hit off balance as Dirrell avoided him easily. 

Also although there were a lot of close rounds, I don't really see how a lot of Americans scream robbery in this fight, it was very close, with lots of rounds that really could have gone either way. And even though the scores may have been a little wide there wasn't any way either fighter won clear enough for it to be a robbery.


I also scored Froch - Pascal earlier, I had forgotten how much fun the fight was. I had it even after 8, but had Froch sweeping the final 4 rounds.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@Sportofkings Demarco was a brutal fighter. Basilio just a little more so :yep


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@Unknown Poster Dirrell fought a Greg Richardson-esque fight. Painful stuff.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Kennedy McKinney Vs Welcome Ncita I

McKinney: 3; 5; 7; 8; 9; 
Ncita: 1; 2; 10

Battle of undefeated fighters, 32-0 IBF titlist Ncita of South Africa attempts his 8th defence against 21-0-1 '88 Olympic Gold Medalist Kennedy McKinney of the United States.

Looks like 4th and 6th rounds are missing.. Think it's a Sky replay, so I'll have to track down the full fight.

3rd and 9th rounds were hard to score. Ncita is not a million miles off a Kalambay-type of fighter, but without the feet and defensive radar. His right hand was not all that succesful here, and McKinney's choppy right, his signature punch, was accurate down the stretch and once McKinney found space for it over Ncita's lazily hung left he worked it in pretty consistently. Ncita took a long time to show the sharpness he showed against Jesus Salud prior to this.

Two good operators. McKinney's Olympic-honed style was fine tuned to hammer home with that right, and for those that have seen him Vs Barrera will know he can make for an exciting fight. I've always fought Bungu was the superior fighter out of him and Welcome Ncita, and I'm sticking by it. Ncitita is fairly stylish, but here doesn't look _that_ talented. He is not consistently accurate, and McKinney is often able to step out of range of his sometimes sloppy swings. But he does have a nice left hook when it lands and variety with it, but whilst primarily left handed he did employ his right cross and land with it when he was in range, problem being that McKinney found the measure of it after a few rounds and was able to fire back with his stepping to the right.

As for Ncita, I still think he _was_ better against Salud (quicker, and looked sharper in terms of movement and therefore generalship), but that's down to McKinney's effort as well as his size advantage; he fights hard here and outworks a good fighter and in the end Ncita is forced into making a big effort to pull back and makes mistakes because of it. The 10th was the first for a while where Ncita really looked the boss, he stunned McKinney a few times and kept the pressure on and had his man backpedaling most of the round. McKinney used all his nous to take the edge off some of the work and make the champ' miss. Still a pretty dominant round for Ncita.

Either way, scoring was redundant. The only part of this fight I've seen before is the Ring Magazine Knockout Of The Year (1992) at the end. To start the 11th Ncita hits McKinney with a barrage including a hurtful looking right hand-left hook combination, and the Olympic champion turns away and takes a knee to get a respite.

Ncita follows up but McKinney sucks it up, and starts to fire back with accurate straight punches that stop Ncita in his tracks momentarily. He continues to come forward though, but McKinney is punching with him all the way. Backed up against the ropes, again McKinney pulls out his trump card, responding to a sharp right hand from Ncita with one of his own over the African's hanging out left, wasting him violently in heinous fashion :yep Ncita is making angels in the snow, his body stammers to a half sitting position before he flops again. Sparked in the 11th round. Very good fight between two talented fighters.


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

I watched this not too long ago, good action fight. The venue was a bit puzzling though, a world title fight between an American and a South Africa, in some obscure part of Italy, odd.

McKinney was one fighter who could always value for money. The 90's was a good time for exciting fights around that weight.


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## Libertarian (Jun 2, 2012)

Dirrell ought to have defeated Froch 118-110.

If he'd fought the full 12 rounds the way he fought the last couple he would have done. Froch was shite all night, though he tried hard.

I think the referee did Froch a favour waiting so long to deduct a point from Dirrell, he ought to have done it in the 3rd or 4th round.

Still, if you ''fight'' like that, you deserve to get fired by the judges, whether you've won enough rounds or not. No excuses.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Sportofkings said:


> I watched this not too long ago, good action fight. The venue was a bit puzzling though, a world title fight between an American and a South Africa, in some obscure part of Italy, odd.
> 
> McKinney was one fighter who could always value for money. The 90's was a good time for exciting fights around that weight.


Yeah, I think Conteh-Lopez was in Denmark :lol: The international Market was always big for World title fights, was Ncita based in Italy at all do you know?


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

I dont know flea tbh, he seems to have had a lot of fights in there from his boxrec, so either Ncita, or a promoter/manager was based in Italy at one time im guessing. He must have built up something of a following there at some point anyways!


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Floyd Patterson Vs Pete Rademacher

PATTERSON: 3(+1) 5(+4)
RADEMACHER: 1; 2(+1); 4;

Obviously Floyd gets shit for this and rightly so, as he defends, and actually has a fight with and gets dropped by, debuting Olympic Gold medalist Rademacher. Obviously Floyd was the smaller man and Rademacher had a pro' style and the amateurs were closer to the pro's then and Floyd came to fight, all of these things make it believable, but he understandably gets shit for it because you'd expect an experienced World champ' to blow away a debutant!

Skimmed over this before, remember the knockdown and finish but thought I'd look at it again and see what Rademacher really had about him. The first thing that strikes me is his similarity stylistically to Carl Froch! He keeps Patterson was cutting the distance and landing his left hook by pumping his jab. In the second Floyd forces a firefight, but the challenger is poised and lands the better shots in the exchanges, then backing Floyd up and catching him with a right hand, knocking him down! Inredible performance from Rademacher here, and Patterson struggles to get back into the round at all.

In the 3rd Patterson starts to put both hands on the Olympian, dropping him towards the end. Rademacher gets himself together, and tries to impose his size on Floyd in the 4th, but Patterson manages to push his tiring man off and fire back with his much loved combinations. Rademacher's a gamer though, and fires back in close with raking right uppercuts. In the 5th Rademacher starts to measure his shot with the jab again, backs the champ' up and lets fly with some hurtful looking rights to head and body. Patterson bursts off the ropes and lets fly, dropping Rademacher very heavily. He just about gets to his feet but Patterson doesn't let up, dropping him with a similar two punch combo. Rademacher sits for 8, bounces back up and bravely carries on.

This is where his lack of pro' experience will have hurt him IMO. He's getting hit with harder punches than he's ever been hit with a fellow Olympic Gold medallist with bags of experience as a pro' against smaller guys (Maxim) and bigger guys (Ingo) and Rademacher has nothing else to show him. 

Floyd is known for his booming left hook but his right was a spiteful weapon, and against the low and wandering left hand of Rademacher he works it in to great effect, bludgeoning him to the deck again. Pete somehow survived the 5th and I lost track of knockdowns :lol: I think it was four.

In the 5th Rademacher appears recovered, but again he's too open and doesn't offer much in the way of head or upper body movement so as he comes forward Patterson nails him with the right again. He gets up again! A left hook crashes into his jaw shortly afterwards as the right follows, and although Rademacher gets to his feet and seems with it, he turns his back on Patterson and it's over. 

Incredible showing of heart, strength, jab and dig from Rademacher. Goes to show how the amateurs could really prepare a man for the pro's. Not quite enough, but then again there's a reason the champion gets all the flak for this fight and not the challenger. 

Personally, I don't give Patterson too much shit for this. It's what Rademacher brought to the table that caused him problems (we all know Patterson wasn't the perfect or most infallible Heavyweight Champion) but he came through it and battered his man his much than the other way around. Knowing Floyd as a slow starter and vulnerable early, I can see why a strong 3 round fighter like Rademacher, older and riding the wave of Olympic success, was felt a viable choice both in terms of Floyd making a defence against him and a no-lose situation for the debutant. 

Taking everything out of the equation, a very fun fight between two game fighters.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Tae-Shik Kim Vs Peter Mathebula (black & white Korean TV version)

KIM: 2; 3; 4; 5; 9; 12; 14;
MATHEBULA: 1; 6; 7; 8; 10; 11; 13; 15

Great Flyweight fight that I'd previously seen in colour thanks to @McGrain that's always worth a re-watch and re-score, especially a different version.

Kim, if anyone here hasn't seen him, has to be seen to believed. Aesthetically he's like a little Michael Katsidis, the way he works inside for shots and throws his left hook and turns his right hand over are identical, although his workrate is even higher and he's an even scarier animal! Mathebula was pretty unheralded from what I know but he pulls away a the fight goes on with a great left hand, variety and poise.

Funnily enough it's the South African that starts stronger, backing Kim up with his jab and just letting the right hand go off it, very fluid. Kim starts to get going in the last 20 seconds or so. Exciting comic book-esque character.

In the 2nd, 3rd and 4th it's classic Kim, letting his hands go and bringing the pressure. But Mathebula doesn't panic, he doesn't freeze, he keeps his hands up, re-establishes his jab and has some success. He gets stung and clobbered a few times, but he's blocking and stepping out making the Korean miss as well, and at the end of the rounds he's imposing himself on the titlist. In the 5th it's more even but Kim finishes stronger.

Applying Kim's style over the duration was always going to be tough, and having to pick his shots and limit his rushes allows Mathebula to get into a rhythm at mid-range, and Kim isn't poor in a jabbing battle but outmatched here as he has to lunge with it to land. At the end of the 7th Mathebula disarms and stuns the champ', letting rip with both hands in a textbook fashion; lovely left and right uppercuts, offensive variety in combination and accuracy. Kim can only cover up and survive to the bell under the sustained barrage. Absolutely top drawer from Mathebula here. Fans of current midget darling Ioka should check him out, although he looks like Juan Manuel Marquez here as well. Very tidy operator.

Mathebula started the 8th well (must watch the early part of the round where he rips to the body with both hands and switches upstairs) and he poked his jab out, but Kim seemed to be getting off with heavy handed shots as the round progressed. Mathebula took it for me. 11th sees both men taking turns but Mathebula scoring with his left and following it up well with the straight right. Hits well to head and body, left hand sometimes straight, hooks off jab, fires it to body, a bit Mike Spinks-esque there IMO, less awkward more textbook though. Kim lands the more telling blows in the 12th.

The Championship rounds: Kim has his moments in a hard to score 13th, but for that round and the majority of the 14th he's boxing his way in, and Mathebula is just sharper and quicker in that domain. But Kim has a breakthrough in the 14th, rocking Mathebula and forcing a clinch, and probably having his best moments of the fight, pinning Mathebula against the ropes and replicating some of his Ibarra form, letting his hands go. It comes down to the last round for me then, so I already know who the winner is, as Mathebula peppers Kim with his jab, doubling, tripling, quadrupling it, and although he has little success in this round Kim does land the hardest punch, a leaping left that briefly has Mathebula holding in.

Very entertaining fight, a classic clash of styles hinging on a, you'd have to assume given his spotty ring record prior to this bout, a probably career best performance from Peter Mathebula and certainly his best win. Very close, I can see the SD that was rendered on the night. Kim showed another element to his game, and came very close despite not being able to walk through his man.

Kim 142-143 Mathebula


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## Noonaldinho (Jun 3, 2012)

Just watched Lewis v Tyson.

Manny Steward giving Lewis absolute hell for not finishing him off , Shame the advice doesn't rub off with Wlad!


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## Yiddle (Jul 10, 2012)

Freddie Steele (159lb) vs Gus Lesnevich (163lb) . A short fight but i was really impressed how Steele really dominated Lesnevich and just had to much power for Lesnevich


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## Ilesey (Jun 8, 2012)

I feel like shit today, I think I have the plaugue or AIDS or something.

Anyway, I'm spending the day watching a few fights that have been collecting dust for a few months. First up is Lewis - Mavrovic, which as far as I can remember was a fairly entertaining fight.


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## Yiddle (Jul 10, 2012)

Just watched Chuvalo vs DeJohn i scored it 46-43 to Chuvalo , at one point Chuvalo knocks DeJohn down the ref pulls him up straight then gives him an eight count :lol:


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Fulgencio Obelmejias Vs Chong Pal Park I

OBELMEJIAS: 1(+1); 4; 5; 6; 7;
PARK: 2;3;

The Korean would later become the first super middleweight 'champion'; and the Venezuelan would take the title from him!

Here, both just over the middleweight limit and gunning for Hagler (a rematch for Obel), the ex-Olympian's jab keeps Park off balance early. Obelmejias is too long and good at using his reach, and he catches Park with a jarring right cross counter in the first that take his legs away from him.*****

Park takes the 2nd well, cutting inside the jab with head movement and either winging a left hook in or bringing an overhand right around out. Can't sustain a rhythm though.

Not sure whether he's fucked or just playing possum but Chong looks sloppy as the 4th goes on. He tries to throw in twos and threes and Fulgencio picks him off, prodding his jab and keeping Chong at bay, then firing off a sweeping left hook that lands hard a few times. Same thing in the 5th: good start from Park, blows his load which slows his reflexes and lowers his workrate, with Obelmejias able to take the reins again. Park did enough in the early going in the 5th to take it IMO.

Obelmejias warmed up in the 7th. Typical of many South American boxer-bangers he's got a wide array of punches, the only truly straight one the jab, his hips well into every other blow that are textbook and awkward, his hooks turning over at the end of the punch to give them that choppy and unexpectedly hurtful effect. His movements are not exaggerated, and it's all down to his jab, anything closer and it's because Park has pushed forward and Fulgencio is reacting. The Korean briefly comes on very strong, drawing some more evasive movement and clinching from Obelmejias.*****

But he's blown his load again. Obelmejias catches him with clean wide hooks, and then throws up uppercuts to a man leaning in to shorten his range. Certainly a very good contender given his ability, Olympic grounding and punching power.


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## Wallet (May 31, 2012)

Adrien Broner vs Fernando Quintero

75-78 Quintero.

No way did Broner win that fight.


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

Wallet said:


> Adrien Broner vs Fernando Quintero
> 
> 75-78 Quintero.
> 
> No way did Broner win that fight.


Agreed Wallet. I think I had it the same score. Good show by Quintero wasn't it?


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

Just watched Froch - Ward 

Ward beat Froch up bad, Froch didn't look as clueless as he did at points of the Dirrell fight, but I really do worry for Froch if he really thinks it's wise fighting Ward again, I just don't see it ever being competitive, he even beat Froch from the outside/mid range for large parts too. Ward has also really grown on me since this fight happened, he's as well rounded as anyone else boxing today imo (yeah I said it) and if he beats Bad Chad then he imo joins May, Pac and Marquez in the real elite. Hopefully he does fight away soon though, as that's the only real question mark left over him.


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## Wallet (May 31, 2012)

ScouseLeader said:


> Agreed Wallet. I think I had it the same score. Good show by Quintero wasn't it?


Aye, I remember you posting about the fight in the old thread.

Very impressive when you remember he took the fight at 4 days notice. What a shame that he hasn't fought since.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

BOZA: 1(+1); 2;*****
LOCKRIDGE: 3; 4; 5; 6; 7; 8; 9; 10

Considering how much I like both these guys (Lockridge is criminally underrated IMO) it's shocking I've never tracked this down before. I just knew, given when it took place that whatever happened it was guaranteed to be interesting. And it was, and how could it not be? Both reliable, well-rounded technical boxer punchers.*****

Against such a talented technical boxer southpaw as Boza, Lockridge seems unsure of how to apply his dynamite offence early. He pulls out of an inside exchange and gets caught square on with a big right hook. Shake his legs out to make they're still there before trying to get up.*****

However, Lockridge is fighting the right strategy, as anyone familiar with Boza will know. It is impossible not to draw him into a firefight. Lockridge is a boxer puncher but he can fight as well, and bar Juan Laporte showed a serviceable chin. He's well schooled, hits well, has good shots with both hands, and has Georgie Benton in his corner. Trying to box the rangier guy (a ridiculously skilled operator) when you can drag him into your World with ease is not the right idea.

In the 2nd, Lockridge starts to land more. Of course, Boza is a quality in-fighter as well, and he takes the 2nd, but Lockridge has got him coming in now, and he has less distance to travel with his right hand counter. And he lands it, hard, that briefly rattles Boza's brain.*****

Very close third round, a bit more activity and sharpness from Boza, but with Lockridge getting underneath or catching more and landing the more hurtful leather.

In the 4th, it's revealed Benton has formulated the gameplan to fight on the inside. It doesn't surprise me, it's got Benton all over that. Rocky is far less open defensively and is quicker than Boza. The 4th made me feel all giddy, Lockridge starting to employ more lateral movement to dictate the pace on the outside, lading before moving in to land more, then Boza timing his accurate straight left and one-two's and then Lockridge closing the distance and landing again. Close. Lockridge buzzes Boza to take the 5th. Both always working, always thinking. Boza constantly throws in the 6th, Lockridge has stayed smart and lands the far better blows. Same in the 7th, Boza now in his absolutely no defence mode. Lockridge is able to set the range now, his movement out and to the side making Boza miss rather than the Ugandan walking Lockridge onto his punches.*****

Boza always works hard though, but he over exerts himself doing it of course. Near the end of the 10th Lockridge lands a sweet three or four punch combination with real variety, accuracy and thudding power.

You could probably give Boza a few more rounds because he was always active and scored well. But Lockridge landed the better blows and was the more assured ring general through the 10 rounds.

BOZA: 92-97 LOCKRIDGE


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Wow, apparently IPhone notes adds asterisks everywhere :-(


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## ScouseLeader (May 31, 2012)

Wallet said:


> Aye, I remember you posting about the fight in the old thread.
> 
> Very impressive when you remember he took the fight at 4 days notice. What a shame that he hasn't fought since.


Yeah, I'd like to know why aswell. He's clearly a smart fighter who adjusts quickly. He could develop well I reckon.


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## igor_otsky (Jul 24, 2012)

My last watch was Haye-glassora fight, until they banned me on the other side of the world. Busy at the moment due to work.


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Been watching a lot of the Latin lads lately, some cool fights that I hadn't seen before.

Jose Napoles vs Curtis Cokes- Great performance from Napoles, just dominated a very good fighter in Cokes from round 1 till the end of the fight. Cokes just wasnt able do anything with him, couldnt get his own shots off and couldn't deal with the speed, accuracy and combination punching. Anytime Napoles opened up Coke's look bewildered and in trouble. Coke's was pulled out after the 12th round by his corner, way behind on points and with a nasty swelling on his left eye. This is the first fight ive seen of Napoles, definitely a fighter I need to see more of.

Jose Luis Ramirez vs Julio Cesar Chavez-Chavez shows how well rounded here, reverting to the boxer as Ramirez puts on constant pressure. Julio catches him with some class counter punches on the back foot and lands the right hand almost at will. Ramirez to his credit never backed down and kept applying pressure, even after being wobbled several times. He landed some hard hooks and left hands but it couldn't take Chavez out of his rhythm. Fight ends in the 11th when theres a asty clas of heads, causing a cut on Ramirez forehead, which leads to a technical decision. 

Alexis Arguello vs Ruben Olivares-Great comeback from Arguello here. Olivares pressure was successful for the first twelve rounds, as he out landed Arugello and landed some big shots. Arguello took them all and kept punching though, and landed some great counter punches. I had it 8-4 in rounds for Olivares going into the 13th, so Arguello needed to land something big to take the fight, and he did that with a great left hook that floored Olivares. Arguello finished him off seconds later with a big uppercut. Arguello's chin really impressed me here.


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

Just finished watching Holyfield - Qawi, real fun fight, Holyfield won this simply on guts, willpower and heart. Against a top top fighter in only his 12th fight having never gone past 8 to go 15 hard hard round against a veteran who never stopped coming like Qawi is amazing, as is the amount of punishment Holyfield took considering he was knackered after round 3. I didn't score it, which I probably should have because it was close as imo. Great great fight though.


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

Think i'm gonna give the Holyfield - Bowe series a run through as I haven't seen any of them in ages, and have never scored them.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@Unknown Poster the 2nd fight is an interesting one to score, be sure to let us know :good


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Unknown Poster said:


> Just finished watching Holyfield - Qawi, real fun fight, Holyfield won this simply on guts, willpower and heart. Against a top top fighter in only his 12th fight having never gone past 8 to go 15 hard hard round against a veteran who never stopped coming like Qawi is amazing, as is the amount of punishment Holyfield took considering he was knackered after round 3. I didn't score it, which I probably should have because it was close as imo. Great great fight though.


I think I had Qawi just nicking his first fight with Holyfield, very close though. Holy has a really detailed account of the fight in his autobiography, his first real war of attrition. He lost something like a stone in weight after the fight to I heard.

The second one is a great performance by Evander, excellent early knockout.


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Over the last couple of days ive watched all of Alexis Arguello's featherweight title defence's, barring the Rigoberto Riasco fight, which I couldn't find online. Alexis really did fight some mediocre opponents in defence of his title, even though I did enjoy his knockouts of those outmatched fighters :yep

Also saw both of Jose Napoles fight's with Billy Backus, an awkward, strong brawler type fighter. Backus was putting up a good show in their first fight, and getting to Napoles a little bit. But the fight was over before just as it was heating up. Backus got the win via a TKO on cuts. A lot of rounds are missing in the copy of their rematch that I saw. But Napoles gave him a bit of a beating and had Backus down twice and badly cut, before the fight being stopped in Mantequilla's favour.


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

Holyfield - Bowe I 

Round 1:Holy wins the opener with some nice combinations, he eats a couple of hard jabs and a nice body shot but does enough to take the first. Very good first round of boxing

Round 2: Holyfield starts the round landing some solid shots from range as he moves in, they then go toe to toe on the inside again, with Bowe winning that exhange, both fighters land some good uppercuts as the round comes to a close, Bowe takes it as he snaps Evander's head back with 2 lovely uppercuts. 19-19

Round 3: Bowe round again, Big Daddy wins the round landing a barrage of hooks on Holyfield, not all of them landing but when they do they look hurtful.

Round 4: Bowe again starts the round landing some big hooks, Holyfield continues to close the distance but not really do anything when he gets there, Holy lands his first meaningful punches of the round as the fighters finally step away from eachother, a nice crisp left to the body followed by a right hook to the head. Holy starts to land as the round comes to a close, before Bowe goes very low at the bell, any harder and i'm not sure Holyfield would have had any more kids, that was a peach of a nut shot. 49-46 Bowe

Round 5: The round starts with both fighters looking to land big hooks, with Holyfield coming out on top in the opening exchanges, Bowe starts to get to his man on the inside so Holy gives himself some room and gets back on top landing a nice combo, Holyfield then sees out the round landing 4 or 5 nice jabs. 58-57 Riddick Bowe

(can I just say at this point I have no idea how IB does these for live fights, it's taking me over a minute to do these with very little insight/detail)

Round 6: Back and forth start to the sixth, Bowe lands the first big punch of the round, a nice right uppercut that just sneaks through Real Deal's defence. the next minute is very scrappy on the inside with very little coming from either, then it's Holyfield's turn to land a nice right uppercut which snaps Bowe's head back, after another poor hugging session Holy finally lets some shots fly, which Bowe responds to with a nice 1-2, Holy lands a nice right to the body and left to the head, close and sloppy round which I give to Bowe as he lands a couple of nice overhand rights in the final 10. Also by this point I think Bowe should maybe have had at least a warning for holding behind the head.

Round 7: Bowe comes straight out and gets to work, landing 5 or 6 spiteful punches on Holyfield, who just sucks them up and keeps coming, Both land left hands simultaneously, but again Bowe seems to have the more power behint it, Bowe just consistently beating his man to the punch. Holy finally lands a nice uppercut followed by a double jab but not enough to win the round, 68-65 Bowe

Round 8: Holyfield having some trouble with the left eye, as Bowe steams into him and lands a nice right, big overhand right from Bowe, and Holy doesn't even seem phased, what a tough guy he is. Strong end to the round from Evander but not enough to win the round

Round 9: The rounds starts with both men trying to impose their jab, with neither managing to get the upper hand, 2 nice rights land for Bowe, superb overhand right from Holyfield and Bowe felt that, but he comes back with a nice jab, Bowe sees out the round landing some nice rights, another round for him 

Round 10: Good start from Bowe as he lands a nice uppercut, before nearly decapitating Holyfield with a monstrous uppercut, Holyfield is all over the place, Bowe landing some huge hooks, but unable to get through with another big uppercut, Holy still out of it, Holyfield survives somehow, but his eye is nearly swollen shut. Bowe looks knackered after using a lot of energy trying to finish it, now Holyfield is landing some uppercuts and snapping Bowe's head back, what heart from The Real Deal, after a sloppy 30 seconds the round ends with a huge bang, Holyfield hurts 
Bowe with a straight right before unloading on his man, great great round, credit to both for that

Round 11: Bombs away straight from the bell, with Bowe slightly on top, Holyfield knocked down as Bowe lands a huge hook to the back of his head, and Cortex counts to 8. gets a bit sloppy after the knockdown with bowe finally getting his jab going towards the end of the round

Round 12: final round of a great fight, starts with Bowe boxing at range landing a couple of nice jabs, Holy lands a right hook to the head before landing nice on the body, Bowe looks unaffected though, scrappy final round, which Holyfield wins on activity

Great fight, 117-111 Bowe on my card, Holyfield showed again an Iron chin, but on the night just wasn't able to compete with Bowe's strength and power on the inside.


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## Casual Benson's Unknown (Jun 5, 2012)

Juses that post was longer than anticipated, think i'll stick to talking about the fight in general instead of RBR when I do the next 2 fights of the series.


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## 1971791 (Jul 14, 2012)

Earlier today I watched Juan Manuel Márquez vs Manuel Medina. Not a special fight as such, it was Márquez's first title and it was a one-sided victory for him - I scored every round for him, although Jim Watt foolishly scored the fourth for Medina when he was hurt in that round. Not a great fight, although some of the punches that JMM landed were just amazing. I think that there was one right uppercut from a mile out that landed flush in Round 3 or 4, beautiful. Credit to Medina, who was always coming forward. JMM is more of a puncher in this fight, unlike his 130+ days where stoppages have come from breaking an opponent down and coming late-ish (except the Ramos fight).


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## 1971791 (Jul 14, 2012)

Wallet said:


> Adrien Broner vs Fernando Quintero
> 
> 75-78 Quintero.
> 
> No way did Broner win that fight.





ScouseLeader said:


> Agreed Wallet. I think I had it the same score. Good show by Quintero wasn't it?


Completely agree. I only had it 5-3 to Quintero, but he won at least four rounds without doubt.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Esparagoza v Villasana

1: 10-9
2: 10-9
3: 10-9
4: 9-10
5: 10-8
6: 10-9
7: 9-10
8: 9-10
9: 9-10
10: 9-10
11: 9-10
12: 9-10

113-114

Strange fight this because the early rounds are pretty much dominated by Esparragoza as he dance around landing flush at will. However Villasana lands quite a few low blows during these stages and whilst they don't score they visibly tired Antonio late on. Marcos had a point deducted but during the second half of the fight he was able to meet Antonio punch for punch and was quite visibly the ring general.

It's one of the best "fight of two halves" there are because the contrast is amazing and I think had the low blows been picked up earlier, Antonio would have cruised to a wide decision with a few shaky moments late on. there are a few close rounds in the middle so the fight could feasibly be scored either way, this is just the way I scored it.

Has anyone else seen this? I think @Flea Man uploaded it so thanks man :good


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Definitely should have been a rematch!


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

lufcrazy said:


> Esparagoza v Villasana
> 
> 1: 10-9
> 2: 10-9
> ...


I watched and scored it, had it 114-113 for Esparragoza, close ass fight :good


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Sportofkings said:


> I watched and scored it, had it 114-113 for Esparragoza, close ass fight :good


very very close. how good did antonio look early doors though! a guy with his ko record hitting someone at will from all them angles, what a beard villasana had eh!


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

lufcrazy said:


> very very close. how good did antonio look early doors though! a guy with his ko record hitting someone at will from all them angles, what a beard villasana had eh!


Yeah, Villasana looked as tough as nails, especially being hit with some big shots by a guy like Esparragoza, who could hit as hard as anyone. Just kept chugging along and returning with interest. Got to check out more of him sometime.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Sportofkings said:


> Yeah, Villasana looked as tough as nails, especially being hit with some big shots by a guy like Esparragoza, who could hit as hard as anyone. Just kept chugging along and returning with interest. Got to check out more of him sometime.


I still think in a rematch with a stricter ref, antonio wins clearly. maybe i'm not giving marcos enough credit for his body work but on the version i saw it looked like a lot were low early doors.

then again it's like that with mares-agbeko, mares still went on to win the rematch so it's hard to say really.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Herol Graham Vs Sumbu Kalambay II

Have only watched this once before and felt 'Bomber' got the better of it so thought before I made good on a promise and uploaded it to the 'tube I'd give it a rewatch and rescore.

GRAHAM: 1; 2 (+2); 4 (-1); 5; 7; 8; 10; 11
SUMBU: 3; 6; 9; 12 (+1)

GRAHAM 114-110 KALAMBAY

Graham's ability to pivot to create the angle is on full display here early, as he twice lands a short right hook from the southpaw stance over first Sumbu's left hand, and then in response to a right cross, to sit Kalmbay on his arse twice in the second round. Early in the third a straight left from Graham shows Sumbu still on unsteady legs and that Graham can take him off balance with either hand, but as the round progresses Kalambay gets the timing on his right hand down and starts to take ring centre for the first time, hurting Graham twice and forcing him to backpedal in a quality round.

Already warned for throwing at his opponent when his awkward angles have got them spun round, Graham is unfairly deducted a point in the 3rd even though he seems to hold back. Hardest shot in the round was Sumbu's. Graham far busier. 9-9 round.

Graham bossed the 5th and did for most of the 6th with sheer workrate but I felt Sumbu landed enough clean rights, the most powerful shots of the round as well, to nick the round. Sumbu has a shout for the 8th but Graham is consistent with his approach, flicking, prodding and poking shots at Kalambay in twos and threes, constantly making him re-think his line of countering. Again Kalambay twats Herol late with a counter right.

I felt Graham should've had another knockdown in the 11th, even though the replay showed the combination that knocked Kalambay over started with a punch to the back of the head, so probably a good call by the ref'. In the 12th Sumbu comes on strong with the right just as he did in their first encounter, then Graham is harshly deducted another point for seemingly just being an awkward fighter. Sigh.

Even with another few close rounds you could've scored to Kalambay if you were trying to, plus the unfair deductions to Graham, with the early round knockdowns and Graham clearly getting the better of most of the fight with his angles and workrate I cannot see Kalambay winning without a hometown decision, even though he was competitive throughout.

A very good watch, as you'd expect from technical boxers with such contrasting styles at this level.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

@lufcrazy I felt Esparragoza got the better of it, clear but highly competitive. Villasana had one of the best chins of all time IMO, he could take anything.


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## Flea Man (Jun 2, 2012)

Orzubek Nazarov Vs Kwang-Shik Song

Nazarov the beastly Olympian with heavy hands and an even heavier moustache Vs a hapless Korean, undefeated in two but never to fight again, like so many Korean's/Jap's you see undefeated in single figures pushed too hard, too soon. Nazarov, I think, was brought over to Japan to turn pro' after Seoul in the same program that took Yuri Arbachakov over there.

Song lands a looping right hand early and Nazarov is briefly stunned, but he quickly fires back and puts the Korean down immediately. He gets up quick, not badly hurt, and even lands a clean right hand as the round goes on, though the pace quickly slows despite the knockdown.

In the 2nd Nazarov means business; showing his amateur background he flurries then steps back averting the Korean's wild attempts to fire back, and then Nazarov steps in with a hard left uppercut to the belly to drop Song to his knees. Nazarov doesn't let up from there, a barrage dropping Song to the floor a second time seemingly in slow motion. He holds his jaw in pain. It's over.

Nazarov Vs Won Park

This Korean was similarly untested, but at least had a bit with experience with 15 wins. He's erratic and whenever he succesfully cuts the distance he just holds on, but Nazarov is in complete control and a hard left uppercut to the gut, again leaves his opponent in a heap. This time his man doesn't make the count after his first visit. 

Shame Nazarov got such a bad eye injury. Would've been in some fun fights, you'd think. Lost his title before he retired, suffering the injury in a fight.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Flea Man said:


> @lufcrazy I felt Esparragoza got the better of it, clear but highly competitive. Villasana had one of the best chins of all time IMO, he could take anything.


he won his rounds much clearer but he didn't win as many of them for me. I found it a tough fight to score and I'm not unhappy with you're view on it. I do think Marcos edged it though, hard to tell if it was body work that slowed him down or low blows.


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Been watching a shit load of fights this week, I suppose the one advantage of being in a quite season of world class boxing is that you can catch up on your history :deal. So far ive seen:


Harold Johnson vs Ezzard Charles- Excellent performance by Johnson, in dominating a past it, yet still solid Charles. Everything Johnson did here was class, his jab was excellent, snapping Ezzard's head back with it in every round, his counter punching, particularly with the right hand was accurate, he was able to shake Charles multiple times during the fight, and he took anything he was hit with, with ease. I cant get the scoring though, with the judges only giving Harold a close SD victory. Personally I had it 9 rounds to 1 in his favour, such was his dominance.

Carlos Monzon vs Tom Bog's-Basically Monzon walking through a game, but outmatched challenger in Bog's. Bog's to his credit, came out all guns blazing and landed some good punches, but he couldn't shake the Iron chinned champion. Once Monzon got his range right, he repeatedly landed hard power shots on his opponent, until stopping him in the 5th round after 3 knonkdown's.

Emile Griffith vs Dick Tiger- Great performance by Griffith, who utilized his jab and some very good footwork to outbox the slower champion, who wasnt allowed to get set and land really anything of note in the majority of the rounds. This is a another fight where the scoring is bogus, I would struggle to give Tiger more than the 4 rounds, yet the judges had it dead tight.

Oscar De La Hoya vs Genaro Hernandez- Young Oscar De La Hoya at lightweight vs the veteran Super-featherweight champion in Hernandez. This one was competitive throughout the first couple of rounds, and Genaro's classical boxing skills looked like they would be trouble for the younger man. Yet once Oscar got into his flow, he seemed to take over, and rock Hernandez with a few powershots. It was odd to see Hernandez quit so soon, as he hadnt yet absorbed any great punishment, yet with the way it was going, he would probably have been stopped late by De La Hoya anyways.

Antonio Demarco vs Kid Diamond- Probably the first breakout win of Demarco's career, as he forced the tough slugger Kid Diamond to quit on his stool after 9 rounds. This one had solid action through out, and Kid Diamond gave it a go, pressing his taller opponent throughout and landing some decent power shots. The right hand and jab was there all night for DeMarco to land all night however, and he took full advantage of it. It was close coming into the 9th round, but this was where Antonio took over, and had his best round of the fight, opening up on his opponent and painting him with hooks and straight left's, before forcing Kid Diamond to quit on his stool in between rounds.

Evander Holyfield vs Ray Mercer- Good fight here, Mercer giving as good as he was getting throughout the first half of it, before being outboxed by Holyfield down the stretch and eventually knocked down with a left hook. Evander bled from a cut on the eye through most of the fight, yet it didn't bother him. He was able to counter punch well and do enough to take a deserved victory.



Next up im going to have a look at the 1970 fight of the year between Nino Benvenuti and Carlos Monzon. Should be a good one:yep


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

Carlos Molina V Julio Cesar Chavez Jnr I





I thought it was a ten rounder for some reason but its only a six. Anyway I wanted to watch this as it is made out to be an outrageous robbery. On that note, I do find it hard to call because whilst Molina should have won, he landed the better shot with more volume throughout, it was still a competitive fight with Junior landing his fare share of shots.

Molina actually looks a lot better in this fight than he did in his most recent fights, a lot more aggressive and although less awkward, his work is more crisp. Chavezx has come a long way though, he still has a very similar style but he is more defensively focussed and picks his shots better now, he has filled out massively as well.

Very good fight though, no letting up in either of them.


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Watched this cracker of an amateur fight last night, between Carl Frampton vs David Oliver Joyce in the 2009 Irish championship's. This is a right war till Frampton gets the better of it in the last round. You knew he was going to be a classy pro just by seeing him here


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

*What fight's have you watched today??*

as it seem's we not got one of these threads i'll start one.

i find it interesting to see what people have been watching, u can add a description about the fight if u want.

:lp:lp:lp:lp:lp:lp:lp:lp:lp:lp

Floyd Mayweather Jr vs Miguel Cotto


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## Lunny (May 31, 2012)

Yesterday I watched Abril-Rios

Scored it 117-112 to Abril (scored the 4th even I think).
@Pabby watched it too and had it 116-112.

Disgraceful scenes.


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## 1971791 (Jul 14, 2012)

Yesterday I watched Tim Austin vs Rafael Márquez I. I had the fight 68-65 when the fight was stopped, in line with two of the judges' scores. A technical fight, that lit up on occasions, most significantly in the 4th and in the 8th, when Austin was hurt. 8th round was a very good one, just after someone in Austin's corner shouted across the ring 'it'll be over soon', Márquez hurts him and gets the TKO (although he seemed to get hurt himself from one punch in that round). :lol:


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## Indigo Pab (May 31, 2012)

We have another one of these threads here but it just hasn't been bumped in ages, probably needs a fresh start to get it moving again though.:good It _was_ a sticky but leave it to the admin here to remove it.:-(



Lunny said:


> Yesterday I watched Abril-Rios
> 
> Scored it 117-112 to Abril (scored the 4th even I think).
> @Pabby watched it too and had it 116-112.
> ...


Yessir, and judging how most people seem to score that fight it seems I was kinder to Rios than many were. There were rounds where Abril made Bam Bam's work ineffectual but at the same time he wasn't exactly landing much himself, so I felt that Rios' - somewhat messy - work on the inside where he would occasionally fit in some lefts up top and right hands to the body were more worthy of the round than Abril's 2/3 clean punches. That only applies to like 2 rounds though, definitely an awful decision.


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Lunny said:


> Yesterday I watched Abril-Rios
> 
> Scored it 117-112 to Abril (scored the 4th even I think).
> @Pabby watched it too and had it 116-112.
> ...


i'll have to re-watch it soon and give u my scorecard, no bias of course ha.


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## Lunny (May 31, 2012)

EnglishWay said:


> i'll have to re-watch it soon and give u my scorecard, no bias of course ha.


:lol: Just noticed your avatar's from that fight as well isn't it?


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Lunny said:


> :lol: Just noticed your avatar's from that fight as well isn't it?


yeah it is :smoke


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## Michael (Jun 8, 2012)

Herol Graham Mccallum vs Sumbu Kalambay 1. There was only 1 copy of the fight that I could find on the internet and it was uploaded by Fleaman. Unfortunately its missing 4 or 5 rounds so its hard to get a clear picture of the fight. But its fairly clear that Kalambay deserved the win, as he took almost every round that I saw, and dropped Herol hard in the 12th round with a counter right hand. Very good performance from what ive seen from the underrated veteran, he showed a great jab, landing it consistently on the awkward Graham, and also counter punched very well, especially with that aforementioned right of his. He also forced Herol to become the come forward aggressor, something which didnt come naturally to a natural boxer puncher like him. 


Overall a very high class fight from two master boxers.


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Felix Trinidad vs Fernando Vargas


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## 1971791 (Jul 14, 2012)

I watched Forrest vs Mayorga I - genuinely one of my favourite fights. Short, but action-packed. 

Also, Forrest's rapping. :facepalm

And Mayorga getting handed a cigarette by Larry Merchant after the post-fight interview! :lol:


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## Slip (Jul 17, 2012)

1971791 said:


> I watched Forrest vs Mayorga I - genuinely one of my favourite fights. Short, but action-packed.
> 
> Also, Forrest's rapping. :facepalm
> 
> And Mayorga getting handed a cigarette by Larry Merchant after the post-fight interview! :lol:


Man i loved Vernon Forrest as a fighter, but how he allowed Mayorga to beat him was so ridiculous. Vernon allowed Mayorga to build up a head of steam and run into him with power shots. He didn't employ the tactic of getting under Mayorga's wide shots. Mayorga was a tough out at 147 though. Most of his losses have come at a higher weight against guys who got inside of his wide punches. Vernon stayed outside and he got caught with looping shots. In the second fight i swear Vernon fought intimidated. He kept falling to the ground to avoid Mayorga's power. He didn't show ring generalship and good bearings. Mayorga looked like he was being MORE effective brawling than Vernon did boxing. Mayorga just had his number. Which is something that's hard to come to terms with, when a guy was such a good boxer and the other one a wild gunslinger.


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## Ilesey (Jun 8, 2012)

I'm a touch hungover today, so I'm tempted just to spend the day watching a few fights. Roy Jones - Glen Johnson is up first, they ran a repeat of it on BoxNation yesterday. I'm tempted to watch Back to the Future as well, but I'll leave that for another thread.


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## Yiddle (Jul 10, 2012)

Watched John H Stracey against Hedgemon Lewis last night . Lewis started well but at 35 his legs were not going to last 15 rounds and Stracey stopped him in the 10th


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Rufino Flores vs Andy Ruiz


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## Yiddle (Jul 10, 2012)

Minter vs hamsho


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Roberto Garcia vs Ben Tackie


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Rico Ramos vs Guillermo Rigondeaux


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Orlando Salido vs Juan Manuel Lopez I
Orlando Salido vs Juan Manuel Lopez II 
Lomachenko vs Maxwell -WSB


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## Wallet (May 31, 2012)

Hagler-Sibson.


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Lunny said:


> Yesterday I watched Abril-Rios
> 
> Scored it 117-112 to Abril (scored the 4th even I think).
> @Pabby watched it too and had it 116-112.
> ...


Re-watched the fight i had it 116-112 to abril so same as pabby.

commentators made me laugh in this fight tho, they were giving abril alot of credit even when rios was blocking his punches n rios blocked alot, they got to pro abril happy..
Bam Bam couldnt get his punches off which losted him the fight.


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## NoMas (Jun 7, 2012)

Watched Aaron Davis/Mark Breland, GREAT fight, and massive KO... Got quite alot of Davis fights on DVD

(gotta love the 90s american adverts lol)


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## Wickio (Jun 3, 2012)

Froch-Kessler I. Already hyping up.


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## EnglishWay (Sep 19, 2012)

Miguel Angel Garcia vs Mauricio Pastrana


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## Wiirdo (May 31, 2012)

Just watched Ali-Norton I.

This wasn't even close for me. I had it 10-2, but could easily see 9-3(first round was even). Ali was sluggish and only fought in spurts, usually flickering a few jabs that barely connect or miss. Norton bossed this. Controlled the ring, being accurate and a high workrate but not throwing for nothing. His bodyshots were especially impressive against the ropes. Anyone's thoughts?


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## Indigo Pab (May 31, 2012)

Just caught Mauricio Martinez vs Lester Fuentes for the first time. Drama on deck, Martinez getting dropped three times in the first 4 rounds by the unbeaten Fuentes before then coming back to stop him in the 5th. Madness.

Seems odd that a Panamanian and a Nicaraguan clashed in the UK. What happened there?


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## Post Box (Jun 7, 2012)

Hatton vs Pacquiao. Funny as fuck to see Kugan Cassius escorting Ricky to the ring


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## Boxed Ears (Jun 13, 2012)

Good thread. I recommend we stick this thread.


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## Bladerunner (Oct 22, 2012)

Just watched Israel Vazquez-Jose luis Valbuene.

Plan on watching the following fights in the afternoon:

LC Morgan-Ldwip Lightburn II
Oscar Larios-Manabu Fukushima
Yoan Pablo Hernandez-Wayne Braythwaite
Chartchai Chionoi-Susumu Hanagata 2


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## O59 (Jul 8, 2012)

Watched Escalera-Shibata again today, brilliant little fight. Shibata gets the better of the fight until Escalera pummels him into defeat. :ibutt Need to watch more Shibata.


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## O59 (Jul 8, 2012)

Wiirdo said:


> Just watched Ali-Norton I.
> 
> This wasn't even close for me. I had it 10-2, but could easily see 9-3(first round was even). Ali was sluggish and only fought in spurts, usually flickering a few jabs that barely connect or miss. Norton bossed this. Controlled the ring, being accurate and a high workrate but not throwing for nothing. His bodyshots were especially impressive against the ropes. Anyone's thoughts?


Can't remember how I scored it, but I did have Norton grabbing a wide-ish decision. First couple of rounds Ali nicked one or two IIRC. Decent fight, arguably Norton's best showing. He had just the style to negate Muhammad, with that low, crouching posture.


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