# What Fighter Has the Deepest Top 5 Win Column?



## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

I'll go First:

Leonard:

Duran
Hearns
Hagler
Benitez
Kalule


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## Lunny (May 31, 2012)

Has to be done:

Ali:
Frazier
Foreman
Liston
Norton
Patterson


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Tunney
Walker
Flowers
Rosenbloom
Gibbons (?)


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## NoNeck (Jun 7, 2013)

De La Hoya:
Whitaker
Trinidad
Chavez
Mosley II
Quartey


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

NoNeck said:


> De La Hoya:
> Whitaker
> Trinidad
> Chavez
> ...


Someone did it before me :ibutt arty


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Gavilan
Jack
Joyce
Montgomery
Angott


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## Seamus (Jun 4, 2013)

Greb is my number one but for shits and giggles, I'll go with Jeffries

Jackson
Fitzsimmons
Corbett
Choynski
Sharkey


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Someone list Ez' wins

Louis
Moore
Burley 
Walcott
Lesnevich

??


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## LittleRed (Jun 4, 2013)

Dempsey

Fulton
Gibbons
Carpentier
Sharkey
Levinsky


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## Seamus (Jun 4, 2013)

LittleRed said:


> Dempsey
> 
> Fulton
> Gibbons
> ...


I would put Willard above Carpentier, Fulton or Levinsky. Still, not mind blowing.


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## Seamus (Jun 4, 2013)

Langford is hard to beat...

Walcott (newspapers say he got the best of it)
Gans
Wills
McVea
Flowers


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## Mugshot (Jun 11, 2013)

It's Greb, by far. 

- Mickey Walker
- Gene Tunney
- Tommy Gibbons
- Mike Gibbons
- Tommy Loughran


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## Lester1583 (Jun 30, 2012)

turbotime said:


> Someone list Ez' wins
> 
> Lesnevich
> 
> ??


Bivins instead of Lesnevich.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

Robinson: Gavilan, Angott, Armstrong, Basilio, La Motta.
Whittaker: Chavez, McGirt, Nelson, Ramirez, Vasquez
Jones: Hopkins, Toney, McCallum, Hill, Ruiz

Them's my top 3 atg and their top 5 stack up.


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## Gunner (Jun 4, 2013)

Pacquiao
Marquez
Barrera
Morales
DLH
Cotto


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## frankenfrank (Jun 4, 2013)

McCall: 

Lewis
Akinwande
Maskaev
Ferguson

possibly Tucker


Duran:

Marcel
Leonard
Barkley
DeJesus
Viruet (Adolfo/Edwin) / Mamby / Castro (really a win?) / Pazienza / Camacho

In Charles' case it is:
Cream
Wright
Burley (4 what its worth, Burley was much smaller)
Maxim
Bivins

Lloyd Marshall was already done when he fought Charles

McCline:
Byrd 
Peters
Grant
Whitaker
Shufford / Briggs / Cole


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## Cormac (Jun 6, 2013)

turbotime said:


> I'll go First:
> 
> Leonard:
> 
> ...


It's an interesting thread but flawed because you can have the names , but the actual fighters might be.

a.younger versions.b. past it ,near shot versions.

eg You can look at Marciano's top 5 
Walcott
Charles 
Louis
Moore
Layne?

Tunney's
Dempsey
Gibbons
Carpentier
Loughran
Greb

Johnson's
Jeffries
Burns
McVey
Langford
Jeannette

Sharkey's
Wills
Godfrey
Loughran
Delaney
Schmeling

imo your pick is as good as any, they were nearer to their primes.


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## DonBoxer (Jun 6, 2012)

I was wondering are we supposed to look at the top 5 wins or are we going for the top 5 names?


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## Jay (May 31, 2012)

Calzaghe:

Bernard Hopkins
Roy Jones Jr
Mikkel Kessler
Chris Eubank
Jeff Lacy

:hey


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## Webbiano (Jun 9, 2013)

Lewis:
Holyfield
Klitschko
Golota
Ruddock
Tyson


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## rockyssplitnose (Jun 7, 2012)

A couple of things I've picked up on Bivins definately comes ahead of Lesnevich in Charles list - and regards Burley on Charles list, Charles wasn't that much bigger - Charles was only a middleweight at the time himself? It wasn't like the light heavy/heavyweight Charles. Also I think it counts how good the versions of the fighters were also - ie re Marciano: Walcott was probably the best version of Walcott there ever was, first Charles fight was arguably one of his very finest performances, and Moore again - probably the best Moore all told so they are all very solid.
Whereas, say, with an obvious choice like Ali: two Liston fights for me are up in the air because I think they were both totally dodgy, and Frazier? Frazier won the important one? Foreman is very solid etc so for me the wins are tempered a little bit by the detail


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## Vysotsky (Jun 6, 2013)

*Yarosz*
Conn
Moore
Marshall
Overlin
Kreiger/Risko/Dundee


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Vysotsky said:


> *Yarosz*
> Conn
> Moore
> Marshall
> ...


Definitely underrated.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

DonBoxer said:


> I was wondering are we supposed to look at the top 5 wins or are we going for the top 5 names?


Moreso the top 5 wins moreso than names, but being elite names definitely help


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

Jimmy Young:
Ali 
Foreman
Norton
Lyle
Ehrmm who should be nr5?


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

NoNeck said:


> De La Hoya:
> Whitaker
> Trinidad
> Chavez
> ...


You can't put in Mosley and Trinidad as robberies and then put in Whitaker and Quartey who beat him away from the offical cards.


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## Chatty (Jun 6, 2012)

Bivins - Charles, Moore, Burley, Maxim, Lesnovich - could put Walcott if your including robberies

Johnson - Langford, Fitzsimmons, Jeffries, Ketchel, Jeanette - could switch some for Jackson, McVea, O'Brien if needed


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Chatty said:


> You can't put in Mosley and Trinidad as robberies and then put in Whitaker and Quartey who beat him away from the offical cards.


Quartey lost that fight.


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## Seamus (Jun 4, 2013)

Cormac said:


> It's an interesting thread but flawed because you can have the names , but the actual fighters might be.
> 
> a.younger versions.b. past it ,near shot versions.


That's the fun part of the game... giving Holmes credit for Ali, Marciano for Louis, Joppy for Duran... etc.

I still say it's a toss up between Greb and Langford whether you count just names or the actual versions of fighters they fought.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

I'd say versions of fighters they fought. How could someone actually give credit to Marciano for Louis? or Pac for Oscar?


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## Cormac (Jun 6, 2013)

Seamus said:


> That's the fun part of the game... giving Holmes credit for Ali, Marciano for Louis, Joppy for Duran... etc.
> 
> I still say it's a toss up between Greb and Langford whether you count just names or the actual versions of fighters they fought.


Fun? Youre not supposed to enjoy yourself here ,it's work , and serious work at that!


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## Seamus (Jun 4, 2013)

turbotime said:


> Quartey lost that fight.


Quartey and Whitaker lost those fights.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

turbotime said:


> I'd say versions of fighters they fought. How could someone actually give credit to Marciano for Louis? or Pac for Oscar?


In hindsight yes.

But Pacman was a very big underdog and most people picked Oscar to win.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

dyna said:


> In hindsight yes.
> 
> But Pacman was a very big underdog and most people picked Oscar to win.


Pac was only a 1-2 dog.


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

turbotime said:


> Pac was only a 1-2 dog.


Then I made a mistake, the ESB poll was pretty lopsided for Oscar though which is why I thought Pacman was a very big underdog.
Well, then I've given him too much credit.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Seamus said:


> Quartey and Whitaker lost those fights.


That Whitaker fight was just all sorts of ugly but yeah I had it for Oscar as well, very close. MUCH closer than the Quartey fight. Ike won 2-6-7-8-9, 3rd even and Oscar the rest with a 2 point round and it could've been stopped.

Oscar lost the Mosley 1 fight clearly and the Sturm fight clearly as far as controversies go. Never scored it for Oscar. Never will.


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## Bukkake (Jul 19, 2013)

Jimmy McLarnin:
Lou Ambers
Tony Canzoneri
Barney Ross
Benny Leonard
Pancho Villa


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## Seamus (Jun 4, 2013)

Bukkake said:


> Jimmy McLarnin:
> Lou Ambers
> Tony Canzoneri
> Barney Ross
> ...


Well played, sir. Very well played.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Bukkake said:


> Jimmy McLarnin:
> Lou Ambers
> Tony Canzoneri
> Barney Ross
> ...


And people rate Ross higher. Myself included. Uh oh.


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## Bukkake (Jul 19, 2013)

Seamus said:


> Well played, sir. Very well played.


Thank you kindly.


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## LittleRed (Jun 4, 2013)

Patterson

Moore
machen
Chuvalo
Bonavena
Quarry
Ellis
Ingo


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## Webbiano (Jun 9, 2013)

Seamus said:


> That's the fun part of the game... giving Holmes credit for Ali, Marciano for Louis, Joppy for Duran... etc.
> 
> I still say it's a toss up between Greb and Langford whether you count just names or the actual versions of fighters they fought.


Holyfield's top 5 looks ridiculous like that
Bowe
Foreman
Holmes
Tyson
Qawi


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## NoNeck (Jun 7, 2013)

Luf said:


> Robinson: Gavilan, Angott, Armstrong, Basilio, La Motta.
> Whittaker: Chavez, McGirt, Nelson, Ramirez, Vasquez
> Jones: Hopkins, Toney, McCallum, Hill, Ruiz
> 
> Them's my top 3 atg and their top 5 stack up.


Jones' win over Tarver definitely trumps the Hill and McCallum wins. Possibly even the Ruiz win. Hopkins is a better win only in hindsight.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

NoNeck said:


> Jones' win over Tarver definitely trumps the Hill and McCallum wins. Possibly even the Ruiz win. Hopkins is a better win only in hindsight.


Jones: Hopkins, Toney, Hill, McCallum, Tarver.


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## NoNeck (Jun 7, 2013)

Luf said:


> Jones: Hopkins, Toney, Hill, McCallum, Tarver.


Griffin and Ruiz were better wins than McCallum, considering how old he was.


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## NoNeck (Jun 7, 2013)

turbotime said:


> That Whitaker fight was just all sorts of ugly but yeah I had it for Oscar as well, very close. MUCH closer than the Quartey fight. Ike won 2-6-7-8-9, 3rd even and Oscar the rest with a 2 point round and it could've been stopped.
> 
> Oscar lost the Mosley 1 fight clearly and the Sturm fight clearly as far as controversies go. Never scored it for Oscar. Never will.


I pretty much agree with this. Considering Sturm has lasted for a decade + after the DLH fight, that would probably be a top 5 win for Oscar, except he definitely didn't deserve the win.


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

NoNeck said:


> Griffin and Ruiz were better wins than McCallum, considering how old he was.


Name carries a lot of weight.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Webbiano said:


> Holyfield's top 5 looks ridiculous like that
> Bowe
> Foreman
> Holmes
> ...


Holyfield originally crossed my mind but I figured that'd be cheating due to Holmes and Foreman being Dinos :lol:


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

NoNeck said:


> I pretty much agree with this. Considering Sturm has lasted for a decade + after the DLH fight, that would probably be a top 5 win for Oscar, except he definitely didn't deserve the win.


Its crazy that Casijello stopped Sturm, a guy Oscar beat the shit out of almost for fun.


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## tommygun711 (Jun 4, 2013)

dyna said:


> Jimmy Young:
> Ali
> Foreman
> Norton
> ...


Could be Shavers or Marvin Stinson who was a highly acclaimed amateur.


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## rockyssplitnose (Jun 7, 2012)

In terms of names emphatically beaten Jack Johnson Knocked Out Stanley Ketchel and also Knocked Out Bob Fitzsimmons and also Knocked Out Jim Jeffries and also Knocked Out Tommy Burns and also Knocked Out Sam McVey - which is something only another 8 men did in their combined 346 fights which isn't bad going obviously (at least for me) Sam Langford goes as his best WIN - but there are other good names like Joe Jeanette, Young Peter Jackson etc


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

tommygun711 said:


> Could be Shavers or Marvin Stinson who was a highly acclaimed amateur.


he drew with shavers


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## The Kurgan (May 17, 2013)

Luf said:


> he drew with shavers


"Earnie Shavers, 210, Warren, Ohio, ran into a tiger in Jimmy Young, 197, Philadelphia. Shavers had stopped Young in an earlier meeting and for a couple of rounds last night it looked like he might repeat. Young was down in the 4th from a vicious left hook but got up and weathered the storm. In the 5th, Young started coming. He blasted Shavers with both hands and in the last two rounds it looked like Earnie might go at any moment. The majority of those at ringside felt Young was a handy winner but the verdict was a draw. Referee Joe Cecchini gave his vote to Shavers, 46-45, while one judge saw it for Young 47-44 and the other judge had it even at 47 points each." -Cumberland Evening Times

Looks like Young deserved the decision.


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## scartissue (Jan 6, 2013)

Carlos Ortiz:

Joe Brown
Duilio Loi
Ismael Laguna
Flash Elorde
Sugar Ramos


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## Luf (Jun 6, 2012)

The Kurgan said:


> "Earnie Shavers, 210, Warren, Ohio, ran into a tiger in Jimmy Young, 197, Philadelphia. Shavers had stopped Young in an earlier meeting and for a couple of rounds last night it looked like he might repeat. Young was down in the 4th from a vicious left hook but got up and weathered the storm. In the 5th, Young started coming. He blasted Shavers with both hands and in the last two rounds it looked like Earnie might go at any moment. The majority of those at ringside felt Young was a handy winner but the verdict was a draw. Referee Joe Cecchini gave his vote to Shavers, 46-45, while one judge saw it for Young 47-44 and the other judge had it even at 47 points each." -Cumberland Evening Times
> 
> Looks like Young deserved the decision.


I haven't seen the fight.


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Fight isn't available is it?


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## tommygun711 (Jun 4, 2013)

pretty funny to imagine young almost stopping earnie shavers


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## frankenfrank (Jun 4, 2013)

NoNeck said:


> Griffin and Ruiz were better wins than McCallum, considering how old he was.


not if considering how cold Griffin was


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

Griffin wasn't cold, he was out classed.


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## NoNeck (Jun 7, 2013)

frankenfrank said:


> not if considering how cold Griffin was


rimshot


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## DrMo (Jun 6, 2012)

Holyfield

Bowe
Tyson
Qawi
Moorer
Mercer

Plus Foreman, Holmes, Dokes, Thomas, Stewart, Cooper, Ruiz, De Leon................

Micheal Spinks 

Holmes
Qawi
E M Muhammed
M Johnson
Cooney


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## dyna (Jun 4, 2013)

DrMo said:


> Holyfield
> 
> Bowe
> Tyson
> ...


The first Ruiz fight was a robbery.
The second Ruiz fight was closer except for round 11.
Third Ruiz fight was a draw and if Holyfield won that fight it was by just 1 round...


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## Seamus (Jun 4, 2013)

John Ruiz

Tony Tucker
Evander Holyfield
Hasim Rahman
Andrew Golota
Jameel McCline

Legendary!


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## kf3 (Jul 17, 2012)

i'm quite suprised how many legends can't really be put in this thread


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## frankenfrank (Jun 4, 2013)

turbotime said:


> Griffin wasn't cold, he was out classed.


He was rushed cold into the ring. Jones' handlers made sure that there will be no surprises in the rematch and this is how they did it.
There is a reason to why Jones fought the way he did the 2nd time but not in the 1st.
Only lesson that was learned was learned by his handlers and that was to never let their own fraud get into their own heads again.


NoNeck said:


> rimshot


Iz dis wot yor BF geiv u lastnait?


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## NoNeck (Jun 7, 2013)

frankenfrank said:


> Iz dis wot yor BF geiv u lastnait?


I cut off your Jonhson!


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## Bukkake (Jul 19, 2013)

Johnny Risko:
Tommy Loughran
Mickey Walker
Max Baer
Jack Sharkey
Jack Delaney

... plus George Godfrey and Paul Berlenbach. 

That's 7 HOFers defeated! Not bad for a man with a 80-53-8 record, who's not himself in the IBHOF, and who never fought for a world title.


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## frankenfrank (Jun 4, 2013)

NoNeck said:


> I cut off your Jonhson!


hi told mi det u hed strong spynkters, bat it woz him, not mi, end hi riported 2 mi det it iz ol gud bay naw


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## Brownies (Jun 7, 2013)

Just for fun :

Joey Maxim (Giuseppe Antonio Berardinelli)

Sugar Ray robinson
Floyd Patterson
Jersey Joe Walcott
Jimmy Bivins
Freddie Mills


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## Brownies (Jun 7, 2013)

Bukkake said:


> Johnny Risko:
> Tommy Loughran
> Mickey Walker
> Max Baer
> ...


Wow, nice call ! Add Galento, Uzcudun, Earnie Schaaf and you've got a solid career...


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## MAG1965 (Jun 4, 2013)

Hearns

Cuevas
Benitez
Duran
Hill
Roldan


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## Setanta (May 24, 2013)

WTF ???

Not a mention of Floyd ???

Oh well, it's up to a Pac fan then...



Corales
Delahoya
Castillo
Cotto
Judah


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## Teeto (May 31, 2012)

Ruben Olivares:

Lionel Rose
Chucho Castillo
Joe Medel
Bobby Chacon
Alan Rudkin


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## O59 (Jul 8, 2012)

Setanta said:


> WTF ???
> 
> Not a mention of Floyd ???
> 
> ...


Really not that deep when you take into account De La Hoya was quite a ways from his prime (though still a top-flight fighter) in comparison to the others mentioned.


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## The Undefeated Gaul (Jun 4, 2013)

Worth a mention:

Monzon
Napoles
Griffith
Benvenuti
Briscoe
Valdes


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## Zopilote (Jun 5, 2013)

Vicente Saldivar:

Ultiminio "Sugar" Ramos
Ismael Laguna
Jose Legra
Johnny Famechon
Howard Winstone


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## junior-soprano (May 23, 2013)

ezzard charles :

jersey joe walcott
archie moore
jimmy bivins
joey maxim
charley burley
joe louis


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## Illuminaughty (Aug 19, 2013)

don't ban him, this English is hilarious


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## junior-soprano (May 23, 2013)

ali looks also nice.

liston
frazier
foreman
norton
patterson/shavers


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

junior-soprano said:


> ezzard charles :
> 
> jersey joe walcott
> archie moore
> ...


6.


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## johnmaff36 (Aug 3, 2012)

Honourable mention goes to sal sanchez

Nelson
Gomez
LaPorte
Danny Lopez
rubin Castillo?


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## turbotime (May 12, 2013)

:-(


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## devon (Jun 5, 2013)

Dafuq is this shit?


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## KuRuPT (Jun 10, 2013)

Whitaker - Nelson... Ramirez... McGirt... Chavez... Vasquez (should be Oscar though  ) 
JJW - Bivens... Charles.. E. Ray... Harold Johnson.... and yes I said it Joe Louis (if you don't count louis, which you should , then its Maxim or Murray


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## Sweet Pea (Jun 22, 2013)

Based purely on the names it's hard to beat McLarnin. Greb still takes it when we consider the stage of their careers the fighters were at when beaten.


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## NoNeck (Jun 7, 2013)

Lennox:
1. Tyson
2. Holyfield
3. Vitali Klitschko
4. Shannon Briggs
5. Rahman

That's 5 lineal heavyweight champs if you count Vitali.


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## frankenfrank (Jun 4, 2013)

NoNeck said:


> Lennox:
> 1. Tyson
> 2. Holyfield
> 3. Vitali Klitschko
> ...


Hector:
1. Duran
2. Leonard
3. Ramirez
4. Pazienza
5. Haugen

det iz 4 lightweight champs , 2 lineal welterweight champs 1 , 1 lightwelterweight champ , 3 lightmiddleweight champs , 2 middleweight champs , 1 supermiddleweight champ , 1 lightheavyweight champ


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