Last Images of Lisanne Froon & Kris Kremers - 2 girls lost hiking in Panama

Mat Cauthon

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May 22, 2013
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You raise a good point, over here no such nature exists, we have some forest but the landscape is mostly flat and all the routes in forest areas are marked with colored poles that show you are on the trail. You can throw a rock and hit a road over here so you can get lost but not like that, the nature is not so dense that you make the mistake of going in circles
Never been to the far north of Scotland, mountains of Norway, or great forests of Sweden ?

You can get lost in a heartbeat, especially in bad weather or winter.
 
Jul 25, 2012
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Kris and Lisanne arrived in Panama to serve as volunteer social workers—and to learn fluent Spanish—but someone had miscalculated.

Apparently, they arrived in Boquete a week early; the program administrators weren’t ready for them, and the assistant instructor had been “very rude and not at all friendly” about it, as Kris wrote in her diary.

“There was not yet a place or work for us so we could not start… The school thought it odd as it was all planned since months ago,” Kris wrote, moments before leaving the room she shared with Lisanne to set out on the fatal hike that morning of April 1, 2014.


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...how-the-lost-girls-of-panama-disappeared.html



I think they were on the wrong foot ,from day one ,with the Panamanians and this may have made them leery of seeking out the local expertise and knowledge.

Their mentality might have been: "Screw 'em. Us Dutch girls have a week before the program starts. Let's go crazy,let our hair down and have some carefree adventure . "
 

dftaylor

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Jun 4, 2012
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Never been to the far north of Scotland, mountains of Norway, or great forests of Sweden ?

You can get lost in a heartbeat, especially in bad weather or winter.
I spent a lot of time around the Ochil Hills when I was growing up and all it took was a bad fog, or a serious rain and you could be trapped or lost. When we did sponsored walks up there, they were fastidious that you stayed on the trails.

Only city kids and idiots think it's easy to keep your bearings in an environment like that. Some of the side walks had been barred for access, but people still walked them because they were quiet and beautiful. But there were rock falls, collapsing paths, and plenty of places to die if you didn't know your way around.
 

Duo

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Jun 14, 2012
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Hiking around Central New England was a pretty casual thing for any kid growing up in the area. New Hampshire and Maine were the most densely forested of the 50 states. (It was also a lot safer when I was a kid, since rabies hadn't arrived in the region. Even if you're vaccinated, you don't want to be attacked by a rabid animal of any size.)

Going into unfamiliar wild territory, I'd want a guide. The White Mountains, Green Mountains, Smoky Mountains, Berkshires and Appalachians are not the Rocky Mountains (where I have some relatives), Sierra Nevadas, Everglades, Okefemokee Swamp or Louisiana Bayou. Visiting Central American or South American jungle territory might be trendy, but don't be stupid going out alone into wild places you've never been before.

If a guide offers you services you don't feel comfortable taking, then don't even contemplate visiting where that guide's offering to take you. Were Froon and Kremers somehow uncomfortable with the idea of the full package tour and overnight ranch stay from the part time tour guide who met them on campus the day before those girls headed out alone? Were those girls worried he might do something to them which would be somehow worse than their actual fate?

Sure, I believe Lisanne Froon was noble in dying, and no doubt she and Kris Kremer were BFFs to the end, but that hardly disqualifies them for a Darwin Award by getting themselves into that situation in the first place. The tour guide they refused on 31 May could have saved their lives.

Down in Florida, I wouldn't even wander off the road into a palmetto thicket. Snowbirds stupid enough and ignorant enough to go barefoot on Florida grass, walk into palmetto thickets, or not shuffle their feet under the sand into Atlantic or Gulf waters deserve to get nailed by fire ants, rattlesnakes and stingrays. Go right ahead...the gene pool will be better for it!
 
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Mat Cauthon

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I spent a lot of time around the Ochil Hills when I was growing up and all it took was a bad fog, or a serious rain and you could be trapped or lost. When we did sponsored walks up there, they were fastidious that you stayed on the trails.

Only city kids and idiots think it's easy to keep your bearings in an environment like that. Some of the side walks had been barred for access, but people still walked them because they were quiet and beautiful. But there were rock falls, collapsing paths, and plenty of places to die if you didn't know your way around.
Yeah mate, exactly. I go walking up the Ochils quite often actually, either that or Kilsyth Hills/ Campsies. I also go on two/three day treks to the more remote parts of Skye and Inner Hebrides quite often.

You wouldn't believe the idiots you meet up these places without anything like the correct clothing and equipment. I make a point of telling them "you're going to die up here". They usually laugh until they see I'm being serious.

You need to have respect and a sense of fear for nature, especially in remote areas. It's a viscious cunt that will fuck you up as soon as you make a mistake.
 

Duo

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You know, when I was a kid, EVERYBODY knew the story of Hansel and Gretel by heart. Does anybody else under the age of 97 even have a clue who the Brothers Grimm or Rudyard Kipling were anymore? FORESTS and JUNGLES can be DANGEROUS!!!! (Ditto mountains.)
 
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Masters

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I would fashion flares out of mud and kiwi fruit.
They needed to create a makeshift compass by placing a twig on a leaf and putting the leaf on water. Then they needed to scratch rocks together to make a fire. Use the smoke as a signal and the fire to cook rats.
Survival was possible was it not for a presence of something hunting them throughout the night . Thats what made them fall to their deaths.
The flash was use over 70 times in the dark. What got them so spooked...
 

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One to watch

CHB WORLD CHAMPION 2018
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They needed to create a makeshift compass by placing a twig on a leaf and putting the leaf on water. Then they needed to scratch rocks together to make a fire. Use the smoke as a signal and the fire to cook rats.
Survival was possible was it not for a presence of something hunting them throughout the night . Thats what made them fall to their deaths.
The flash was use over 70 times in the dark. What got them so spooked...
As much as Id love to go with your theory,expert analysis points at the camera use being for marking points out.theres even the belief you can see one body on the one photo.
 

dftaylor

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Yeah mate, exactly. I go walking up the Ochils quite often actually, either that or Kilsyth Hills/ Campsies. I also go on two/three day treks to the more remote parts of Skye and Inner Hebrides quite often.

You wouldn't believe the idiots you meet up these places without anything like the correct clothing and equipment. I make a point of telling them "you're going to die up here". They usually laugh until they see I'm being serious.

You need to have respect and a sense of fear for nature, especially in remote areas. It's a viscious cunt that will fuck you up as soon as you make a mistake.
That's one of the most beautiful things about these sorts of walks. You're simply a guest in the landscape, and it doesn't care about you one way or the other. You're a witness and a participant and possibly a victim if you aren't careful.

Do you take photos when you;re out, or do you go for the solitude?
 

dftaylor

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Jun 4, 2012
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“There was not yet a place or work for us so we could not start… The school thought it odd as it was all planned since months ago,” Kris wrote, moments before leaving the room she shared with Lisanne to set out on the fatal hike that morning of April 1, 2014."
I think what chills me most is the date. Ten days later, I was getting off a plane to live in Amsterdam for the next two years, while a young girl had watched her best friend die, knew her end was likely coming soon, and all she wanted was to be where I was.

Life can be awful.
 

Mat Cauthon

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May 22, 2013
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That's one of the most beautiful things about these sorts of walks. You're simply a guest in the landscape, and it doesn't care about you one way or the other. You're a witness and a participant and possibly a victim if you aren't careful.

Do you take photos when you;re out, or do you go for the solitude?
Mostly solitude and I'm a huge nature lover.

I love nothing more than sitting on some mountain taking in the views with complete silence and not a person within miles. It's just perfect head medicine to me.

I have collected lots of photos from my travels tho yes.
 

Masters

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As much as Id love to go with your theory,expert analysis points at the camera use being for marking points out.theres even the belief you can see one body on the one photo.
Why would they move around in the darkness? That's obviously only going to make matters worse. Surely they would have known that.
They had all day to plan for the night time. Create a little hut. Start a camp fire. Instead they were running around the place and using the camera flash to beat the band. Pointless battery usage as well. Use the day light to navigate , not the camera flash.
All signs point to something stalking them.
 

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Why would they move around in the darkness? That's obviously only going to make matters worse. Surely they would have known that.
They had all day to plan for the night time. Create a little hut. Start a camp fire. Instead they were running around the place and using the camera flash to beat the band. Pointless battery usage as well. Use the day light to navigate , not the camera flash.
All signs point to something stalking them.
Pretty hard to judge what you would do unless you are in such a situation.